Do you believe in God?

[Sydney]

This is a pretty heavy topic, but I'm sure most of us here at Oddworld Forums are mature enough to discuss our beliefs while showing respect to those of others.

The title of the topic is "Do you believe in God?" but this subject can cover whatever your beliefs are in regards to religion, or lack thereof.

My beliefs often change and perhaps the best word to sum them up is agnostic. I'd like to believe there is a kind and loving God up there somewhere, someone who knows all and looks upon us in the tribulating times of our lives. Jesus was a great man and could be the Son of God. The Buddha may have really reached enlightenment.

Other times I find myself acknowledging the impossibility of ever knowing TheTruth™ and dismiss religion as a way of quenching the yearning that humans have to understand our origins. Religion fills that questioning nature we have. I believe existence is something far too complex for us to ever understand so we attempt to explain it the best we can, should it be with mysterious unseen entities or scientific theories.

There's so much we don't know about the universe. Just look at perceptions people had four thousand years ago compared to 2001. Imagine what new things people will be learning about in the year 7001. I doubt anyone will ever be able to understand everything, but physics is somewhere to start. The mathematical side of physics bores me to death though.

It's an interesting thing to talk about, it flows more when discussing it in real life. But I'd like to hear people's thoughts on God, Life, and the Universe. Oh, and it makes for better discussion if you give reasons why you believe in whatever it is you believe.

My goofy $23.05

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

I'm a christan or fundalmentalist (meaning, I believe everything in the bible) and yes i do strictly believe in God and Jesus christ being the son of GOd. Jesus was'nt just any man! He was perfect. The Messiah, The lamb, pure He never sinned. Satan tried to make him sin when up in the mountain but failed. He died for our sins. If it was'nt for him, we all would of been dead long time ago. There are some evidence today in Irseal. They have Jesus tomb when he was buried in, Kyafis i think he had a book of some sort. God is great and awesome. But he does have a wrath and he will get angry and he will
can you to hell if you are bad. I hope i am not in that direction! lol

As the bigbang theory is concern? I mean, common!? It we were made my some atoms and crap, I mean puhlease, puposterous.

[ May 19, 2001: Message edited by: PinkHaired Mudokon CWR ]

[Pacen]

Wow. What a difficult topic. I find my believes about god ever-changing. I loosely believe the bible, that some stories are real and others are stories to express a point. I like to believe there is a god and sometimes I believe this very strongly, but other times I find myself doubting it very much.

Even thinking about our existance makes me feel sick. I can hardly begin to describe the thoughts I get when I try to figure it out. I doubt very much that the bible is true in this aspect, implying that some mystical being (God) just made things happen in 7 days. Especially since a day is the amount of time that it takes the earth to spin 360 degrees when the Earth did not even exist back then. I have no idea what this thing, life, actually is and frankly even thinking of it scares me.

Then there's the thought of what happens when it's all over, when we die. What happens then?

I believe religion is something people make themselves believe to make them feel save, to give them some idea of what will happen after death and rules by which to live their life. But of course then there's all these miracles and holy visions which tend to make me believe there is a God.

I suppose I think the human body is not supposed to be able to comprehend these extremely complex topics. I try to think about them as little as possible. Delaying the inevitable I suppose. I like to just live life as I think appropriate at the time, trying to keep things simple.

I do believe Jesus had some sort of religious significance, I'm just not sure what to think of him. I think calling him "the son of God" would be wrong because I don't have any idea what God is, and I doubt God is anything that could have children.

Oops, I didn't intend to write that much, I didn't really notice.
Well let's hear some other people's opinions shall we?

[One, Two, Middlesboogie]

Yes, let's.

I'm an atheist and a philanthropist, because I was brought up as such. I have no religion whatsoever.
I believe that such people as Jesus, Mohammed, Moses, the Buddha etc. may very well have exiseted, but I certainly do not believe that they were divine. They are simply stories blown way out of proportion over hundred of years. I do not believe that anything happens to us when we die; there is no justice or punishment at the end. We die and that is it.

I do not think that we should need the fear of a wrathful deity to make us be good. We humans are intelligent and highly sophisticated creatures, and we are clever enough to judge for ourselves what is right and what is wrong. We can tell what good moral standards are without having to have them written down for us in a lengthy tome.

Religion is an insidious blight on our lives, and humans can never be truly free until we can cast aside such unrealistic notions and speak rationally about science, our real creator.

We do actually have a creator and a master, but it is not a God. It is our genes. All humans, despite our sophistication, are no more than throwaway survival machines for our genes, the immortal replicators. Pacen, you said you were not sure what 'life' actually is. All that is neede for life, however primitive or sophisticated, to arise, is a type of cell with the ability to replicate itself.

All life forms started as no more than little bits of deoxyribose nucleic acids floating around in the primordial soup. These bits of DNA evolved protein coats for protection from other foreign bits of DNA. Eventually the protein coats became so sophisticated that they became all the
creatures we see today.

(Richard Dawkins explains all this better in The Selfish Gene)

However, the DNA is no longer in a single part of our body. It is in our entire body. Every cell has metres of DNA coiled tightly inside it. We and our mitochondria are programmed to survive, not for the good of the body (which is a mere throwaway survival machine), but for the good of the individual's genes. The genes are the only part of the body that has barely evolved at all. They are not conscious, but they are still as selfish as ever, 'interested' only in surviving. Like it or not, they control us, not a God.

However, because we are intelligent enough to have realised this, I and Richard Dawkins hold out the hope that our species, alone on Earth, has the power to rebel against the designs of the selfish genes. All creatures show natural selfishness; even apparent altruism is very often selfishness in disguise. For example, an allele for saving a family member at the cost of one's life seems an altruistic one, but seeing as the person we saved is related to us, it is certain that they have some genes in common with us. Therefore it would still be beneficial to our genes to save them, since they may contain copies of the same genes, which will now survive.

We must teach our children to be altruistic, for it will never come to them naturally.

[ May 19, 2001: Message edited by: One, Two, Middlesboogie ]

[Sl'askia]

*feels a long debate coming up, but decides to put her two cents in*

I was raised(more like forced, but I wont go into that) as a Roman Catholic, but I don't follow it. Basically, I DO believe in higher life forms watching over us (something like the 'Q' from Star Trek). To me, all religions are basically the same...they were created by village elders and the like to help explain why things are in the world. I don't really believe one enity created the Earth just like that..(ok I believe in the Big Bang theory), but rather many such entities 'assisted' in making the universe as it is today, and still are (again, kind of like the 'Q').

Stafonos: you are threading on dangerous ground...*warning glare*

Bug off. sorry, some of my characters races are based on that belief...
Darn it I lost my train of thought, thanks a lot Stafonos!

Stafonos: *snickers*

*sigh* oh well, If I remember anything else, i'll edit my post.

[DarkHoodness]

Hmmm. Well, I'd say I don't really belive in anything. I choose not to because I can't be sure on anything. It may exist, or it may not. I kinda belive what I've seen actually work (The Wiccan religion and science), but I choose not to go to them because I still can't be sure. It isn't something that passes through my mind each day. It boggles the mind to think about it, so I don't.
- DH

[ May 19, 2001: Message edited by: Dark Hood ]

[freakyLA]

Ok i don´t understand what you wrote, but here´s what I have to say:
god is a power on wich contains everything the whole universe. Everything is part from it. If someone dies it comesback to thge power, so no one ever dies. Jesus is an alien

[LuxoJr]

Yeah, this is pretty huge.

Well, I'm agnostic; believing that God's existence cannot be proven (yeah, pretentious, I know...). Whilst I was once Catholic, and a very involved catholic, I became tired of the way the church (authorities) handled their religion - by that I mean throwing in lines about homosexuality and abortion that really have nothing to do with a supreme being and his son. Then I started to question whether or not Catholicism was a valid interpretation of Life, the Universe and Everything.

I do think that Jesus existed, and that in many ways the Bible could be an accurate historical document. In answer to the 'supernatural' events that seem to deny this, it's possible that the book's writers were influenced by the same strong beliefs that many people experience today. I'm loathe to believe in something that was written two millenia ago. Hell - I'm loathe to believe in something written by a journalist yesterday just because it's text sitting on a page.

The biggest gripe I have about Christianity, and equally atheism, is the fact that neither one can be proven. Sure, it might make more sense to assume that God doesn't exist because there's no physical evidence to prove that catholics are right - but either way we can't know for sure.

Christianity's been around for a long time - so long, in fact, that its convictions are often just assumed to be truths. I would love to know what is actually right, but I don't want to assume anything in a matter this important until there's some tangible evidence.


:::added:::

Just a question for One, Two, Middlesboogie - about your altruism statement. Since a person can only teach children the concepts of right and wrong through positive or negative reinforcement, the child would feel good about themselves once they'd done something for someone else - merely because they'd been trained to. In that sense, the behaviour isn't really altruistic at all, since the kid is actually getting a reward for their 'altruistic' action.

[ May 19, 2001: Message edited by: LuxoJr ]

[One, Two, Middlesboogie]

There is undeniable proof that God does NOT exist:

Vestigial organs: Humans have vestigial tailbones, vestigial caecums (which are now our appendices) and vestigial nictating membranes. Why would a God bother to include vestigial organs in any animal? We get no benefit from these organs, so they must be remnants of something we once had. Hence, this proves evolution.

The Sun: If God created everything, then the sole purpose of the Sun must be to provide heat and light for the Earth. Yet a study of the Sun proves that it is inefficient for this purpose. It is far too big and far too far away. If an architect was to design an efficient heating and lighting system for a large celestial body, he/she would probably come up with a cagelike structure surrounding the planet. The Sun does not fit this description in any way.

Either we have an extremely incompetent God, or there is no God.

[Sl'askia]

oh boy here we go *decides to try to defuse a possible agruement before it starts*, please ppl, try to keep an open mind and remember that this topic is to state your beliefs and/or opinions, NOT to try to convert others!

[DarkHoodness]

Speaking of converting people, there was this guy in Oddchat that said me and Dragadaon were sinners because we didn't belive in anything. Don'tcha just hate people like that?
- DH

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

this a comment to middle what ever her name is, but the organ thingy? I mean, God can do anything. He probably gave those to use for a reason? I dunno. God can do anything. THen how do you suppose us humans got here? Not by no accident, or explosion. It does'nt male sense. And I have proof that God is real.


My moms car would not start. Everything was dead, i mean the car just died. We did'nt know how to get home. So i started to pray. And did you know that the car started to run? I mean, it was a miracle. I have more stories too It was'nt no igine cooled down.

[Osiris The Fleech]

My Mom prayed to saint anthony (saint of lost things)when she lost some jewelry and she heard a man's voice say: "Look under the bed"

She did. The jewelry was there. I believe in God. I'm not gonna write alot.

[One, Two, Middlesboogie]

I defy any person with religious beliefs to read Richard Dawkin's book The Selfish Gene and not convert to atheism.

[LuxoJr]

Why would a God bother to include vestigial organs in any animal? We get no benefit from these organs, so they must be remnants of something we once had. Hence, this proves evolution.

I completely agree with the theory of evolution. It makes sense and can actually be proven - in real life and artificially - just purchase a copy of Creatures and the process of natural selection becomes evident.

But evolution had to begin somewhere. Primordial soup is usually the explanation, but then we get that chicken/egg scenario again. A catholic can still believe in God and evolution, assuming that they don't take the Old Testament literally.

The 'bog of life' had to come from somewhere. Evolution is a result, but can only take place when life exists before it. Just because natural selection has taken place, it doesn't refute the possibility of a God that originally created everything evolution has now improved upon. I don't necessarily believe that this is what happened, but it's still a possibility.

The Sun: If God created everything, then the sole purpose of the Sun must be to provide heat and light for the Earth. Yet a study of the Sun proves that it is inefficient for this purpose. It is far too big and far too far away. If an architect was to design an efficient heating and lighting system for a large celestial body, he/she would probably come up with a cagelike structure surrounding the planet. The Sun does not fit this description in any way.

Whatever created the sun - whether it be God, the big bang, or something else - this doesn't rule out the fact that things change over time. Perhaps there was once life on planets such as Mercury, or even Vulcan (assuming that it ever existed) - in which case the sun would have been exceptionally effective, except life eventually does die. There are theories to suggest that life on Earth will cease to exist in 100 million years, so even our own planet will possibly become as desolate as the others in our galaxy some day.

As with evolution, in which you already believe - things obviously change over time. The ozone layer, once effective for its purpose, is now becoming increasingly useless as humans destroy it with our polluted cities. Perhaps the sun was once as effective for a now obsolete purpose.

[Black Dragon]

Well, I personally do believe in God. I'm not very religious, in fact I could stand to be more, and there are some things in which I believe science more. For example, I do believe that humans evolved, and weren't just plopped in the middle of a garden somewhere. That's all I'm gonna say.

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

I mean, IMAO, the evolution theory and the Big Bang theory does'nt make sense to me. Maybe to you though . But, to me, there is no producer what so ever. What made the stars then to make an explosion? It does'nt make any sense. I believe the earth heavens and universe can be made in 7 days. I mean, you just have to divde all the parts and make them in the days and stuff like that. But the evolution thoery? I mean, common. We just came here by some accident. We were not made by no atoms. It does'nt have any proof where humans came from. SO to me, it's perposterous.

[Sydney]

The evolution theory makes perfect sense and I wonder if those who oppose it have actually studied it in detail. It is completely compatible with Christianity, I know people who believe in both God and evolution. After all, it would be foolish to interpret all of the bible literally. Does revelations really talk of a beast with seven heads emerging from the sea, and a dragon that flies across the sky collecting stars in its wings? I doubt it. It makes more sense that these descriptions are symbolic, carrying a deeper meaning.

The following mechanics by which evolution takes place is unquestionable: Within any population there is variation. Organisms that possess characteristics beneficial to their environment have an increased chance of surviving up until maturity. These organisms produce offspring who will also have these beneficial features, having inherited them.

Pink, it doesn't make sense to me how you can simply "divide all the parts and make them into days and stuff like that." How does it happen? You say that evolution doesn't make sense, but it has mechanics. Does seperating "them" into days make sense? What exactly are we seperating and how does the process work?

And you say we're not made by atoms, but it is a well known fact that we are. What are we made of, if not from atoms?

By all means believe in God and Christ, but I think labelling evolution "preposterous" while in the same paragraph describing something "dividing the parts" to make days and such is rather strange.

I certainly believe there's more to existence than what we can ever comprehend, but I'm cautious to simplify it into a mysterious entity only described in ancient books. But who knows?

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

No, No sydney, you are not getting what i am saying. Okay, you know in the bible, genisis, got made like water, light and day in one day? And animals and stuff teh other day? He just divded what to make so it does make perfet sense. You have to argue with God with that. But the evolution theory to me, does'nt make any sense that's what i am saying and I have proof too but it's too long so i would just tell you a few reasons why I think it does'nt.

[titeuf62]

I have no religion:I haven't been baptised.
But I believe in god,more or less,because I don't think that we could have evolded that much,and straight from the bigenning,without help from SOMEONE or something...
But there is,of course,a limit to beleiving.
This is ONLY my opinion

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

I can groove with that. If you don't believe that's fine. But I have some proof.

1. If we were evolved from something, then what made the evolver? What made the atoms and cells to produce it. It had to be God.

2. The human body is toooooo complexed. You know no accident can do that.

3. If the Big Bang Theory was real, then who made the stars and gases? It did'nt just kazamm appear appear as stars. You need a producer, God would be that producer.

4. Go hereGod is real

5.and Sydney, in your survey, you said that you would want to meet Jesus Right? Then, who made him!? Who made someone to dye for our sins? It was'nt no galaxies. And there is proof too, If Jesus would'nt had died for us, we would of been dead long time ago, or, you would have to sacrifice a lamb to him every weak.

6. If there is No God, how could you explain the Devil! How would you explain demon possessed people? And the concept saying that "God would not punish you or sent you to hell" gets on my nerves too. God does not send you to hell, you send yourself to hell and God would get angry too. Yes he is a lovely God, but he has common sense now, look at where the devil is at noe, because he tried to be like God and became pride and jealous.

7. They found a skeleton, with non-apelike features in Africa, older than the neanderthal, and the same age as a dino bone! Explain that, it looked like a human, not apely. They used carbon-14. This was proof that the people were Adam and Eve.

8. Go here
more proof

9. And syd, you said that some people believe in the Bible and evolution. They are maybe just scientist who are christian who loves to study that. I mean, i study it too, but it does'nt mean that I believe it. It's probably there job. If there is some proof that the evolution and the Big Bang theory is real, there might be proof but there is no real proof right now to me. It sounds like they just put everything together to try to make it look good. I'm not trying to convert anyone, but I just believe that evolutionis not real, i'm sorry. It can be proven.

want more evidenece?

[ May 22, 2001: Message edited by: PinkHaired Mudokon CWR ]

[Melvin:squeeking paramite]

Pink,this is not proof of anything.Its just your opinion and other religious peoples pages.I don't believe thats proof,but I respect your opinion.I just think that people shouldn't try to force people to believe they're religion.(no ones doing this but I just think thats wrong.)How does the evolution theory not make sense when the supposed God theory does?I mean,how does it makes sense that some guy came along and created the world?Anyway,I don't nesesarily believe in god but its possible.I do believe in a afterlife but maybe it has nothing to do with god.Thats only my opinion so I don't care if anyone disagrees.
Heres a question.If there is a god,then what happens if theres this person who is the nicest person in the world.Okay this person is helpful,nice,freindly,respects people and all that.But htis person does not believe in God.Does he or she go to HEll?Any one know?

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

Yes. I'm not trying to scare anyone, but that's what it reads in the bible. I mean, how are you going to expect God to take you in heaven if you don't believe in him? He is not going to allow that. Here is an excellent url. I am not trying to force anyone. I love Jesus Christ very much. He's not an ordinary man. God loved so much, be gave his begotten son to die for us, to have eternal life with him.Good Explanation

Yeah, the above is proof. There is alot of proof. They found Jesus tomb, they founf the mark were the Red Sea was once separated By Moses, I could go on.

[ May 22, 2001: Message edited by: PinkHaired Mudokon CWR ]

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

And No man made the bible either. God told them to write the Bible, they just wrote it in their own perspective. No man can make up anything like that at all. Noot trying to me rude, but seriously, how can ou believe in an afterlife if you don't believe in God, Not trying to sound harsh, i'm just not getting what you are saying.

[Lampion]

First af all, I'd like to say that all that has been said above doesn't prove anything to me. They are all arguements and opinions.

But, I'd also like to give my humble opinion on the subject God, Science, Life and Universe

background info

I was raised as a catholic until I was ten years old. That period didn't add too much to my spiritual beliefs. when I was 11, my parents started to study a spiritual and philosofic doutrination named Espiritism founded by a french man in the nineteen century. His name was Allan Kardec (do your homework, and make a little research in the Internet, I'm sure you're gonna find something). so I started to read some of my parents'books and actually found it really interesting.

In the meantime, I started to study physics at school (the atoms, and galaxies, and stuff), and I was hooked. (That's why I'm a sci-fi movies and books fanatic). The book that blew my mind was The Tao of Physics, by Fritjof Capra. I also consider Carl Seagan's books one of the most pleasant readings about Science.

Science

The search for the ultimate truth is what moves humanity into the future. That search brought the man from the woods of some place in Africa, to the stars. Science is the search for the Knowledge, of the world, the life, and of ourselves. But our Science is not the truth itself. It's just a way we humans found to describe the universe, and to understand it. When I say Science, I'm not talking about Physics. I'm talking about every single piece of knowledge humanity had collected, compiled and spreaded through its history on Earth.

In one phrase, Science is not the search for the right answers, but the search for the right questions.

I like to imagine our universe as the modern Science describes, and I don't believe that it denies God, because the models of the universe we have today are just an infinitesimal fraction of the real universe. One that only something like a God could understand. This brings us to the next topic:

God

Since talking about God is just a matter of faith, I'm gonna tell you my beliefs:

I believe that we are not the center of the universe, and God is not here to serve us. She did't created the hole universe and its natural laws to our pleasure and joy. We are truly part of her plan, but what we can see, and hear, and smell, and touch, and taste, is like a poor quality and resolution picture of the world. Humans on Earth won't be able to even touch the understanding of what God is in a million years of evolution.

I have to say that I believe in reincarnation. That's the only way to learn all the lessons about our universe and the nature of God. but that takes us hundreds, thousands of reincarnations to achieve the spiritual evolution to understand God, our mother.

I believe that Jesus is the Caretaker of the Earth, and all the living creatures that inhabit this world. As Jesus, there is a caretaker in every single world of the universe where there is life. As Jesus, they are the most evolved, enlightened and beutiful creatures of God. As Jesus, they are the models we need to follow. Jesus is here on Earth to show us that we need to be like him. The Bible is a great book, but the really important part of it are the books written by Jesus' friends, the men who lived with him on Earth, because they bring us the gospel of this beautiful man, Jesus.

Now, let's do a little mental exercise to show a point:

Imagine an insect, an ant. It is there, running from side to side, looking for food to bring back to its hive, tring to avoid bigger insects, following a track of pheromones its sisters left in the ground to find its way to home...

Can you imagine what understanding of the universe this little ant has (with its little brain and its weak body) compared to us, the mighty humans who rule the world, and the space, and send rockets to the moon, and probes to Jupiter and Saturn, and beyond the bounderies of our own Solar Sytem, into the deep void of the Interstelar space?

Now, Imagine you as being that ant. Could you conceive a higher being, that would stand to us, as we stand to our little ant? this tremendous creature would have the power to destroy lands and seas with its bare hands (or whatever it had as limbs). This mighty creature could build artifacts that could cross the sky at lightspeed, or even faster(its species would have a so accurate understanding of the laws of nature that us, humans, couldn't even try toimagine).

Now, just try to image an even more powerful creature, that stands to that previous one as it stands to us, and as we stand to our little ant. Can you? This fantastic being would have the power to create a hole solar system, or destroy it. It could travel to every place of our galaxy and return in a blink of an eye. Well, just use your imagination...

I think you got the game I'm proposing here. Now, do the same thing ten, a hundred, a thousand, a million, a quatrillion, a whatever-huge-number-can-your-little-brain-think-of-zillion times.

And then, and only then, you would conclude that you haven't even touched the infinitesimal understanding of the nature of God.

So, I try not to be a selfish person, because I'm not the center of the universe, neither is the person next to me. I try to be a patient guy. I know I can't understand what is my role here, as a living creature. But I like to think that I will understand it, maybe in a thousand years, maybe in a million years.

While I wait for this day, all I can do is to try to LOVE whoever is close to me. without any distiction. After all, as John Lennon said once, "all we need is love".


Peace.

[ May 23, 2001: Message edited by: Lampion ]

[Teal]

Yeah. *agrees with Lampy on most of that*

I don't think I'll say much, other than I believe in SOMEthing. I'm not sure what, and I'm confuzzled about a lot of things. But I think there must have been some trigger for everything....

And I don't think we should tell people with different beliefs that they are stupid/evil etc. Everyone has their own way of understanding. I only wish all those people fighting in religious wars could accept that. And so until we know for sure... I'm keeping an open mind. After all, Christianity isn't the only religion. Some religions lasted just as many thousands of years, as I understand it... Anyway, that's me getting side-tracked again... Oh well, I think I'll stick with being confusedly open-minded.

There, that's me done. Back to normal transmission...

[Melvin:squeeking paramite]

I like what Teal said.Like I was sayin we shouldn't try to force people upon a religion and insult other peoples religion.
Like I said thats really not proof,there is no proof,just opinions.So we don't know until we die.
and Pink,I think your being a leetle too hard on people who disagree with you.

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

No one is trying to force you into believing in God. I think I am not trying to be hard at all. If I was, I would of force you believe in God. I was trying to answer your question. There is proof. I think your being a quite too hard Squeeky on people who do believe in God. I don't careless if you do or not believe in God, I can't force you to believe in God I don't care. I'm just telling you somw proof, you can't say that there is no proof. But The only thing I have to say is that I do believe in God, and I don't really care what other people personally think. You may think it may be an opinon, but what "I" think, it's not an opinion to me. No one is not trying to force you to believe in God, I'm trying to stay calm as I can if I sound harsh I am sorry. In a matter of fact, they found a human, I think I already said this, a human skeleton, the same age as a dinosaur that looked just like a human skeleton. I mean, I could not belive it at first, but It was on T.V., I was sooo shocked. And another interesting that they found was Mary's letter to Joseph, Kyafis tomb, and the mark in the red sea. That was soo cool. They actually went under water and look, a mark was there. It was spiffy. So, how can that not be any proof? Do you have proof on the evolution theory? How come there is not proof on evolving? But I found that spiffy that they found that evidence . I mean, it's not being closed-minded in believeing in one religion, it is not. Like let's say, you only like Oddworld and nothing else besides that game. You are being closed-minded or some thing. But yeah, I am just giving you proof, I am not converting anyone to anything.

[Melvin:squeeking paramite]

okay,its just you seemed a little hard on atheists.I wasn't being hard on anyone because I said I respected every ones opinion and anyone could be right.Sorry, I only thought that I guess you weren't
And like I said,you could be right and I respect your opinion.
I don't care what religion any one is as long as they don't force it on people(you weren't doing this I'm just sayin)I respect whatever you think and that no one knows if there is a god so any one could be right.
Niether of us are being close minded,just sharing our believes.I don't particularly believe in evolution,though.I don't really have a religion.And sorry,Pink,when I reread my post I saw that you weren't really being hard on anyone.And I'd say I'm being okay too.Sorry,Pink I was wrong to say you were being hard on people.But I really feel I'm not either.So,sorry!
(I see its not your opinion but I used the word opinion cause thats what it is to me)

[ May 23, 2001: Message edited by: Melvin:squeeking paramite ]

[PinkHaired Mudokon CWR]

That's alright. I try not to hurt anyone, and I am trying not to cause alittle riot. It's kinda hard explaining what you believe in, by trying not to sound alittle harsh. I am just giving you reasona why I believe in God and stuff I just don't believe the evolution theory, it does'nt make sense to me, and I never will believe in it.