Your generic God debate containing Aliens and lots of excitement!

[OANST]

I remember having a conversation in church where they would try to explain faith to me. The guy would tell me to look at a chair. He then would say that I have faith that the chair would hold me, and that believing God's word is like that. I told him that I can see the chair. I can see other people sitting in similar chairs. The chair has all four legs. I can also see that the welding is still in place, and doesn't have any cracks in it (metal chair). So, yes. I am fairly certain that the chair will hold my weight, but it isn't by faith. It's by observation. And I also understand that by sitting in the chair, I am taking a chance that it won't hold my weight. So, that gets rid of blind faith altogether.

He tells me that Christians have that with the Bible. So, I tell him, yes. I can see the Bible. I see all of these hypocrites using the Bible. I see that the Bible is filled with unexplainable holes. I can see where Matthew gives one lineage for Jesus, and Luke gives another. So, no. I do not believe that the Bible will hold my weight. Furthermore, it doesn't seem to be holding anyone's weight.

[shaman]

A. You're afraid to die.

B. You're stupid.

See, this interests me. I can understand people putting religion down to the fear of death. But i am not afraid of death. I don't think i would be even if i didn't believe in an afterlife. It couldn't be any different than sleep, so what's to worry about? Are you accusing STM of the fear of death or do you think that religion in general is down to the fear of death?

[LDG519]

I remember having a conversation in church where they would try to explain faith to me. The guy would tell me to look at a chair. He then would say that I have faith that the chair would hold me, and that believing God's word is like that. I told him that I can see the chair. I can see other people sitting in similar chairs. The chair has all four legs. I can also see that the welding is still in place, and doesn't have any cracks in it (metal chair). So, yes. I am fairly certain that the chair will hold my weight, but it isn't by faith. It's by observation. And I also understand that by sitting in the chair, I am taking a chance that it won't hold my weight. So, that gets rid of blind faith altogether.

He tells me that Christians have that with the Bible. So, I tell him, yes. I can see the Bible. I see all of these hypocrites using the Bible. I see that the Bible is filled with unexplainable holes. I can see where Matthew gives one lineage for Jesus, and Luke gives another. So, no. I do not believe that the Bible will hold my weight. Furthermore, it doesn't seem to be holding anyone's weight.

althogh you have good reasons to not have faith I have good reasons to support my faith, like when every time I pray about something it turns out well, I havn't seen the holes that you say are in the bible but me like alot of other christians havn't gotten around to reading the bible cover to cover yet so they may exist, also you may notice that in my first post I mentioned that I am willing to accept that the bible may not be 100% accurate

[Manco]

althogh you have good reasons to not have faith I have good reasons to support my faith, like when every time I pray about something it turns out well, I havn't seen the holes that you say are in the bible but me like alot of other christians havn't gotten around to reading the bible cover to cover yet so they may exist, also you may notice that in my first post I mentioned that I am willing to accept that the bible may not be 100% accurate

1) Confirmation bias, look it up.

2) How can you follow a religion without having at least read the holy book the whole way through? I can understand that not everyone needs to be able to write an essay about it, but at least read it.

[shaman]

like when every time I pray about something it turns out well

And just like that, we're on to Magick.

[OANST]

See, this interests me. I can understand people putting religion down to the fear of death. But i am not afraid of death. I don't think i would be even if i didn't believe in an afterlife. It couldn't be any different than sleep, so what's to worry about? Are you accusing STM of the fear of death or do you think that religion in general is down to the fear of death?

I'm of the opinion that the fear of not existing is what has always caused mankind to cast about, looking for answers. It sure is nice to think that once the hardship of this life is over, you will get to live forever in peace and serenity.

Also, I don't really blame people who turn to religion because of this. I'm afraid of death. It's healthy. I don't want to return to nothingness, and neither do you. I'm just not going to lie to myself about it.

like when every time I pray about something it turns out well

I think that you will find if you read the Bible that this is not how prayer works. Even if god is real he is a fucking asshole, and has no intention of giving you your petty desires.

[LDG519]

How can you follow a religion without having at least read the holy book the whole way through? I can understand that not everyone needs to be able to write an essay about it, but at least read it.

Ive only been christian for about a year and I'm bloody lazy, but again as I have said many times a fault in me not my religion

And just like that, we're on to Magick.

the fact of the matter is god is an all powerful being, magic was bound to crop up in this debate somewere

[OANST]

Hey, god. Can you make this light turn green for me before I get to it? Oh, well. Maybe next time. Holy shit! You did it, god! This motherfucking light is greener than shit! Let's be best buds forever!

This is the point where he tells the really sad story that he made up about cancer being healed, or broken bones mending of their own accord after he prayed about it.

[LDG519]

I think that you will find if you read the Bible that this is not how prayer works. Even if god is real he is a fucking asshole, and has no intention of giving you your petty desires.

it is true that he will not give you exactly what you want, but he still helps out if asked in some way or anouther, weather it is cosmic magical help or maybe just giving you a clear mind it is still help, (although you could say that getting a clear mind is from the illusion of think god will help us).

I'm going to give you an example that actually happened to me, ever hear of the skin rash eczema, its itchy as hell and when I get it it usually takes 6 months to get rid of, well one night my eczema was so itchy I couldn't get to sleep so at about 3am I decided to get up, put some extra QV cream on it and pray that I would be able to get to sleep, not only did my arms and legs go num so I couldn't feel the itch (the arms and legs were where my eczema was) but when I woke up at 6am ithe eczema was completely gone. if 6 months worth of healing in 3 and a half hours isn't an answer to my prayer than I don't know what is.

[shaman]

On all your heads be it.

[OANST]

I'm going to give you an example that actually happened to me, ever hear of the skin rash eczema, its itchy as hell and when I get it it usually takes 6 months to get rid of, well one night my eczema was so itchy I couldn't get to sleep so at about 3am I decided to get up, put some extra QV cream on it and pray that I would be able to get to sleep, not only did my arms and legs go num so I couldn't feel the itch (the arms and legs were where my eczema was) but when I woke up at 6am ithe eczema was completely gone. if 6 months worth of healing in 3 and a half hours isn't an answer to my prayer than I don't know what is.

Called it.

[Dynamithix]

I leave the question open.




PS. Hai guise, I believe in scientology.

[OANST]

Did you know that Shaman is a filthy Wiccan?

[LDG519]

Called it.

yes you did but try some of these things actually happen, not every day and not to everyone but sometimes thay do

[shaman]

I'm not a doodyhead. You're a doodyhead.

[OANST]

yes you did but try some of these things actually happen, not every day and not to everyone but sometimes thay do

No, they don't. And I fucking called it.

Christians are so fucking predictable.

[Manco]

yes you did but try some of these things actually happen, not every day and not to everyone but sometimes thay do

Prove it.

There's always a conspicuous lack of evidence when people start talking about "miracles".

[shaman]

There's always a conspicuous lack of evidence when people start talking about "miracles".

Ah there's the clencher. If something like that happened, i mean actually happened. Then that is his evidence, it's just evidence that cannot be presented in an argument.

[OANST]

I like how the Bible contains a very small amount of miracles, ninety percent of them being negative, but every Christian has a story about the power of prayer.

I mean, in the Bible, if you prayed for good crops, God was likely to deliver armed men to rape your wife, murder your children, and burn your crops just to see what you would do.

[LDG519]

No, they don't. And I fucking called it.

Christians are so fucking predictable.

just because you dont understand something you call it fake (I guess you saw that coming too) and Im not saying that every single one of them is true, the only thing I can say with certainty is that my story is true, I have no way of proving it so I will understand if you dont belive me.

one of the ten commandments is thou shalt not commit false witness, I would never violate my religion to try and convert someone

[OANST]

Your story about putting extra cream on your arm to stop the itching is true? HOLY SHIT IT'S A FUCKING MIRACLE!

[Manco]

I like how the Bible contains a very small amount of miracles, ninety percent of them being negative, but every Christian has a story about the power of prayer.

I mean, in the Bible, if you prayed for good crops, God was likely to deliver armed men to rape your wife, murder your children, and burn your crops just to see what you would do.

This is the most compelling argument in favour of believing in God - that sounds like a fucking amazing deity to follow.

Terrifying, but amazing.

[LDG519]

Your story about putting extra cream on your arm to stop the itching is true? HOLY SHIT IT'S A FUCKING MIRACLE!

I admit the extra cream is probably what stopped the itching, and as for the other half of the story I have no proof of that (how could I) so it is understandable that you dont belive that

[shaman]

the only thing I can say with certainty is that my story is true, I have no way of proving it so I will understand if you dont belive me.

My last post is teh correct.

[OANST]

Of course, if you're a real douchebag then god takes it easy on you. King David sleeps with a man's wife, sends him to the front lines of a battle designed to fail so that he can steal his wife, and god's like "Alright now, Dave. That wasn't very nice. Your next child is going to be stillborn, but every other child that you have with your ninety wives will be fine. Let this be a lesson to you."

This wasn't even the first time that David had been a cunt of this magnitude.

[shaman]

I haven't read anywhere near the whole thing.

[Dynamithix]

I read Christan and Bible as Christian Bale and was like wut.

[OANST]

Christian Bale does answer prayers.

[Dynamithix]

Christian Bale > Christian Bible

[OANST]

You got that right.