"SJW" and the Spectrum...

[Varrok]

I think that's a good time to say that my point was nothing in the pose alone was sexual, and yet they're removing it.

And it's hard to buy their argument of "we we're already wanting to remove it", especially since they do seem to have a history of censoring things that don't need to be censored:

[Slog Bait]

It's not censorship if the person(s) removing the content is the person(s) that created the content

[Varrok]

Do you think it was the same guy who modeled/designed the magazine that took it upon himself to delete its instances from the level?

Also, no, it still is a censorship, at least according to Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-censorship

[Manco]

I think that's a good time to say that my point was nothing in the pose alone was sexual, and yet they're removing it.

I’ve already pointed out why I disagree with that. The pose has sexual connotations.

And it's hard to buy their argument of "we we're already wanting to remove it", especially since they do seem to have a history of censoring things that don't need to be censored:

That doesn’t make it harder to buy, it makes it easier – if they have a history of removing things from their game then it stands to reason that they would be more likely to remove more. There’s no evidence that the magazines were removed due to complaints, so you’ll have to present some evidence of that before this point makes sense.

Do you think it was the same guy who modeled/designed the magazine that took it upon himself to delete its instances from the level?

So unless the exact artist on the team is the one who deletes it from the game, it doesn’t count as a voluntary decision on the part of the development studio?

[Moot]

Do you think it was the same guy who modeled/designed the magazine that took it upon himself to delete its instances from the level?

Also, no, it still is a censorship, at least according to Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-censorship

Self-censorship? That's honestly a ridiculous.

There's an entire debate in itself regarding censorship, and how adamantly people try to defend it. I get it, the right of free speech is very important, and we should cherish it. But removing a joke from a game isn't censorship of ideas or free speech, and it's beta - this happens, things are edited and removed to fit the ideals of the company and project leads.

The "ohno-censorship" boners need to go down already. There's a time and place to fight for free speech, a vague (possibly accidental) joke regarding a naughty magazine and masturbation, isn't the time to fight for it..



This isn't directed at you, Varrok. This just irks me, and I need to complain!

Edit: It also stands to reason, the people complaining about this form of "censorship" are SJW's in themselves.

[Xorlidyr]

Self-censorship is truly a form of censorship.

[EVP_Glukkon]

But removing a joke from a game isn't censorship of ideas or free speech, and it's beta - this happens, things are edited and removed to fit the ideals of the company and project leads.

That's correct, but do we know enough about why it was removed?

If during the design process, elements that do not fit with the game are found, their removal isn't censorship of any kind.

However if these elements are called in to question by another party, perhaps the publisher for example, and these elements are removed for the reasons of an external party or if the creator of the original content is removing them to please the views/opinions of specific groups, then I would see that as censorship.

[Varrok]

Overwatch developers did excatly what they said, and changed the pose.

Before:



After:

[Manco]

It's an improvement.

[Varrok]

It definitely looks better, but it's even more sexual

And it's based on a pin up

[Manco]

Except she’s not bent over sticking her ass out any more. There’s nothing inherently sexual about that pose, the fact the character in the original is in her underwear is what makes it sexualized.

[Varrok]

The OP had a problem with the pose making Tracer feel like a woman stereotype, and they changed it into a pin-up girl pose.

Do you think that'll make her happy?

[Slugology]

the people who complain about dumb shit like Tracers butt don't play videogames anyway, so their opinions can be safely discarded

[Nate]

I feel like the new one still is sexual, but it's badass-sexual rather than come-hither-sexual. It's adequate.

[Nepsotic]

Edit: It also stands to reason, the people complaining about this form of "censorship" are SJW's in themselves.

You must be very misinformed, Moot.

[Moot]

You must be very misinformed, Moot.

I'd argue it's vice versa.

"Blizzard is changing something because they're being forced to by someone who's offended! They're being censored!!!!"

How hypocritical. Fighting for ones own sense of personal justice, using the buzzword of "censorship!!!11!" to vehemently defend a moot point. That sounds like Social Justice Warriors to me. Blizzards replacement pose even enforces my reason for irritation, they're not being censored and never were.

Sure, they're not neckbeards sitting on Tumblr saying "mlady" but they're their own breed of bad. I see very little difference between these kinds of SJW's, they simply have different outlets.

There are extremes to every side, even outside of SJW's. The Feminist debates, the racial equality debates, Occupy Wall street, Gamergate. Great examples of extreme movements that have often hindered themselves with their zealotry. Don't presume one side is just "right", it's always more complicated than that.

[Tired Glutton]

So is sjw just an insult or do any of you consider it an ideology of it's own or what. Is it the replacement word for communist as a perjorative

[Nepsotic]

It's basically a member of the regressive left.

[STM]

Which really tells you everything you need to know about what 'sjw' means...

[Nepsotic]

Fucking what do you think I am, the Urban Dictionary? Google it!

[Manco]

I like how Nep swapped one meaningless label dreamed up by conservatives for another meaningless label dreamed up by conservatives.

[Nepsotic]

All labels are meaningless and dreamed up but tha doesn't make them any less true.

[Manco]

“it’s meaningless but it’s true”

[Vlam]

Manco is far left.

[STM]

I was kinda making a point about regressive-left being a non-existent thing but hey ho.

[Vlam]

I was kinda making a point about regressive-left being a non-existent thing but hey ho.

Because the left is already regressive?

[Nepsotic]

The regressive left is totally an existent thing. It's what you call people who call themselves 'the progressive left' because 99% of the time they are the complete opposite.

[Vlam]

Nepsotic, aren't you a socialist?

[Nepsotic]

I've no fucking idea lol

[Manco]

The regressive left is totally an existent thing. It's what you call people who call themselves 'the progressive left' because 99% of the time they are the complete opposite.

So, it’s a meaningless label you apply to people whose views are too SJW for your taste.