NnT/AO Comparison and Critique

[HOMINIX]

Yes I liked the Slig dialogue. Quite a lot actually. It made them more goofy which fits the Sligs so well.

I think my favorite one is "I'm I hearing shit?" when Abe speaks to them.

Exactly! Do they still sometimes say "Hi" back when greeted by Abe?

[Holy Sock]

Exactly! Do they still sometimes say "Hi" back when greeted by Abe?

Yeah, but they seem more confused.

[Oziah]

Exactly! Do they still sometimes say "Hi" back when greeted by Abe?

More of a "Errr...hi?" kind of thing

And "Am I hearing shit?" is also one of my favourites, ha. I also think their laughs, whilst far less sinister than the original snigger, are hilarious.

[K100]

I can't talk about the controls as I don't have the game yet (waiting for the PC version ) but for me, the atmosphere is perfect. I love AO, but I'm glad that NnT is not a 1.1 remake. If I want to play AO, well, I play the original.

Plus, for me, Oddworld feel a LOT more alive with all the dialogues and the new backgrounds, and it's EXACTLY what I wanted for this game. I'm so proud of JAW, and I can't wait to see what they will do with Oddworld in the future !

Oh and I have no problems with the slig's masks. I think it was the best decision to include both type in the game.

Edit: Like I have said in an other thread, I also like all the references they have put in the game. Soulstorm brew bottles, Lulu, Splinterz, Wildum, Nolybab... It's perfectly done.

[Holy Sock]

yeah, I have to say, the alive backgrounds is a huge plus. And I much prefer them than Matthew's argument that "it's supposed to look bland!". Sure, I get the cold white lighting, but I love me that incinerator.

[Djwolf9000]

When I was posting news some sites I read and every comment,and all was so good,like "I played this game on ps1";"This game is awesome" and every review was like "it's good","best remake",but I never heard a things "this game is full of shit";"I hate this game".I read the first bad words in Facebook group OWI where one guy wrote "what a shitty game" and this analysis shows us that the is not quite masterpiece as they say (like Avatar film and Last of Us).
The masterpiece game doesn't exist.And this guy said to us "STOP BEING A FAN,LOOK AT THESE THINGS",but this is the first reviving project of Oddworld and as we say in Russia "better luck next time"

[Varrok]

But Avatar can't be further from being a wonderful masterpiece!

[Holy Sock]

I think that's his point? That no game can really be a masterpiece? And that when you get loads of positive reaction saying "this is the best game ever!" then you're bound to get a critique of something and suddenly some people start saying "I can't believe they completely fucked up everything!". That this critique is saying "What's with all the positivie reaction? Have you SEEN the bloom, guys!??" But the critique is rather exaggerated? And this is the first new project by JAW so they can perhaps be less contentious next time?

I think that's sort of what he was on about...

[El Dango AGAIN]

people are going into deep critical discussions about the game and I haven't even played it fml

[Pirfsich]

The video made me sad.
But I have to agree in a few points.
But it also made me laugh at one point though: IF Exoddus HD is happening, how are you going to solve the greeters laserbeams? Any ideas yet?

[OWI_Alex]

The video made me sad.
But I have to agree in a few points.
But it also made me laugh at one point though: IF Exoddus HD is happening, how are you going to solve the greeters laserbeams? Any ideas yet?

One things for sure, it'll never be called 'HD' anything at any point in development.

[Holy Sock]

I guess you could have some sort of cone of vision thing like the Sligs? Like a red spotlight on the ground that moves like the laser beams? Except it responds to movement?

[Pirfsich]

One things for sure, it'll never be called 'HD' anything at any point in development.

Yeah, I know....

[Holy Sock]

Something like this. But the spotlights aren't static.

[HOMINIX]

The video made me sad.
But I have to agree in a few points.
But it also made me laugh at one point though: IF Exoddus HD is happening, how are you going to solve the greeters laserbeams? Any ideas yet?

They could project a 2D "pane" of laser like they did in the original...

Maybe with little blue arcing (non-harmful) electricity touching Abe (similar to the arcing electric look used when Abe has a Shrykull ring in NnT) to indicate when Abe is in in their laser field, in case there's any lack of clarity due to the 3D environments.

Something like this. But the spotlights aren't static.

Whoops, didn't refresh my page before posting mine.
My only concern with that is the actual scan area is much bigger than the ones in Exoddus. Maybe just a horizontal line along the width of the path?

[Holy Sock]

Could they? I thought that was the issue in NnT. That they didn't really work.

[HOMINIX]

Could they? I thought that was the issue in NnT. That they didn't really work.

I assume that - because the vertical beams could be viewed from an angle in 3D - it was that you would have a hard time telling when you were in the beam's range, or the beam was right in front of you. The little electrical arcs were my proposed solution... just hammering home that you're being scanned then. The visual equivalent of the little "ssssssss" sound it made when you were in the beam in the originals. But that's just an idea.

[Holy Sock]

Surely this encapsulates more what Matthew wanted from Rupture Farms in NnT (at least in Zulag 1)?



EDIT: I was just watching a stream of the Scrabanian Temple and fuck me it's looks really good. The glowiness only really became stark in one or two places (like entering the first Big Face door)

BUT whenever the game is paused the bloom filter and dirty filter(or whatever it actually is) seem to disappear. I wonder if it would be a good idea to make this an option on the PC version? Quite like how the noise filter could be turned off in The Lost and Damned (love that grain tho').

I do feel that calling NnT a "serious visual downgrade" a pretty big overreaction. But, at the same time, I sympathise with those who disliked the noise filter in The Lost and Damned. And perhaps the best thing is to just give the player more visual options? Just to gauge reactions if anything.

[Varrok]

Usually you can turn off bloom in PC games which feature bloom. That's a standard. Nothing extravagant or wonderful.

[HOMINIX]

The PC version gives me hope for a lot of reasons. Mainly because there really isn't a way to have analog movement on a keyboard, hopefully meaning there will be a dedicated run button. The possibility of further button mapping and bloom/effect options is exciting, but the controls are my main concern.

[Holy Sock]

Usually you can turn off bloom in PC games which feature bloom. That's a standard. Nothing extravagant or wonderful.

I'm not really well versed in graphical options because my PC is rather average. In that it's a laptop.

[AlexFili]

I watched Crashpunk's LP and I was impressed by the graphics. The new voices are good and the puzzles have been tweaked to match the new scrolling screen camera.

While it would have been nice to have a few more hints towards Exoddus it's a great game in it's own right. Shame there's no info about the release date but hopefully it will come out next month or the month after.

[Holy Sock]

Well they had those brew bottles.

[DarkHoodness]

By the way, I'm disturbed by JAW : you guys shouldn't post here (Oddworld Inhabitants were wise enough to not do the same).

*later* I wanna add to the voices who think it's very good that people from JAW interact with the long-term community on a personal level. It's a shame more game developers don't do this.

I also want to say that at face value, N'n'T looks to be enjoyable and fun from what I've seen of it (a fair bit), and the majority of reviews and comments from people who've played it seem to have that opinion - Sure, some things may bug me a little as a long-term Oddworld fan, but if I've enjoyed it at the end (which I think I very much will - PC version, please!), then I'd say that's a good result. Nitpicking from hardcore fans can be valuable as feedback, but there comes a point where it gets a bit silly.

[Holy Sock]

Also, the reason they didn't interact before, I would imagine, is the publisher model didn't allow it. I mean Lorne's talked a lot about how the direction of Munch to 3D and Stranger as a FPS hybrid were to do with changes in market and how big publishers like to control the level of information and interaction with the fanbase. And he's also talked about how he was surprised fans wanted to see a return to the old 2D platforming gameplay or even a remake of Abe.

So it seems like OWI's interaction with the fanbase, on a regular basis, was just something that wasn't really viable back then.

Also, since JAW is remaking an old classic it makes sense that fan interaction would be rather important.

But, to be fair, they did have Dear Alf!

[DarkHoodness]

But, to be fair, they did have Dear Alf!

That, and the fan club. They even took the trouble to mail Oddworld-themed birthday cards to the first few members of it for a couple of years, they got interesting when Stranger was about to be released. It's a shame I lost them.

Still though, there aren't many game devs who are that generous.

[kjjcarpenter]

I dislike repetition of the same dialogue in games - but some of the dialogue brings Sligs closer to Sligs in the AE cutscenes (where I feel the true representation of Oddworld's character happened - although I'm biased since AE was my 1st game...)

I was literally just about to post:

1. "Promotion, here I come!" (Flying slig that spots Abe.)

2. "Yeah. Yeah. Blah. Blah. Blah." (Newscaster's reaction to Phleg's professional suicide.)

3. The slig snoozing on the keyboard when Phleg calls. And his subsequent, "Huh? What?" Then once Phleg clarifies that he must disarm the main gates, the slig simply responds with, "Oh."

4. "Yeah. Yeah. What d'ya want?" (While filing his nails.)

5. "Man, he is pissed."

6. "Uh-huh, I'm out of here!" (Newscaster then proceeds to flee.)

Not exactly what I'd call cold, merciless killers. More like over-worked cannon-fodder who do what they're told.

[Crashpunk]

I don't have a problem with repetition of the same dialogue in games just as long it's not repeating way too much. In NnT, yes you heard the same lines but it's hardly anything to get annoyed about. Plus, you can have only so many lines before you hear the same ones again. That's in anything.

Also I don't know why he brought this up at all honestly. In AO and AE, all the dialogue in game was only a couple of sounds. The Sligs said "What?", "Freeze!" and their Gamespeak. So NnT. The characters have way more lines and yet he complains that he hears the same lines.

Fuck me...

[Holy Sock]

Well, to be fair, there's a difference hearing the same idle dialogue over and over again and hearing the same dialogue every time you interact with another character.

I also think it's easier to digest the repetition of the same handful of words than lines of dialogue with specific tonal inflections.

The gamespeak dialogue doesn't really seem to be the issue though. Just too much repetition of the same idle dialogue - particularly since the player has no control over it.

The other issue is, if you make it so specific dialouge is heard at specific times, it becomes frustrating for a player to hear the same line of NPC dialogue everytime they die and restart. There's certainly a balance I think.

[scorptatious]

I agree with most of the guy's statements. Like Holy Sock said however, the regular Sligs in Exoddus were also wearing the aviator masks. Although I guess you could make the argument that the sligs in the cutscenes aren't assigned as security personal, so perhaps they didn't need the original visors.

Anyway, I just completed AO, and looking at it now, I can definitely agree that NnT falls short by comparison.

That doesn't mean J.A.W made a bad game however. There were just several missteps that dampened the overall experience. Overall, it was still a good game and a damn good attempt at remaking Abe's Oddysee.