Have any of you guys noticed...

Dipstikk · #1 11-20-2002, 06:01 PM

Abe only has three fingers here:

and four here:

What's up with this?

(Remember, I'm a newbie, so if the answer is insanely obvious, don't make fun of me, Please?)

***Xavier*** · #2 11-20-2002, 06:12 PM

it is in the FAQ of the official site:

:

Q: In the game I noticed that in the first game Abe and Mudokons have 4 fingers then in Abe's Exoddus they have only 3 fingers. What happened with the 4th finger?

A: Well, it's a long story that needs to be told. So here it is... Japan has a strict discriminating policy against any simulated characters entering their country with four fingers. Historically, Japan has had a subclass of meat packing workers that were typically looked down upon in their society. In later days, the blatant displaying of a four fingered hand gesture, intentionally directed at another, came to mean that you were calling them a member of the meat packing sub class. Which, we understand, was not at all a compliment.

It appears that the four finger connection with the meat packing class was due to work related accidents, but was so frequent that it came to symbolically represent the sub class. It seems as though this is a part of the Japanese history that some groups within Japan would like to see forgotten. Therefore, it is at great risk that you publish four fingered characters in Japan, as you may very likely end up in legal battles with a vociferous pressure group. This group claims that this type of representation is equivalent to and as degrading as the yellow star forced to be worn on Jews by the Nazi's during the Second World War.That is, it's offensive and degrading unless they can extort enough money out of you. Then it's all okay. Case in point: We were told that the Walt Disney Corporation is charged five million dollars a year by this group so that Mickey Mouse may live in Japan and retain his original four fingered design. Otherwise, old Mickey would need to see a surgeon and have something done about that insulting forth finger.

The moral of this story is... if you want to pay, then it's ok. If you don't want to pay, then it's a horrible insult to our culture. In other parts of the world we have a word for these types of two-faced tactics. We call it extortion. If it is truly offensive and degrading, then don't allow it at all. But to allow it for a price... is to belittle the case altogether. It suggests that the real truth behind these groups is that they are using the darker moments in their own cultures' history as an excuse to coerce money out of content providers.

Well, being that this is Oddworld, we felt that this seemed like a perfect addition to the Abe story. We thought it was ironically perfect that he was being discriminated against for being who he was. As the message came from Japan, "They don't like his kind here, with the sincere suggestion," Just chop off one of his fingers cause you don't have the money to pay up..." caused us to feel that we indeed needed to allow Abe to go through the suffering that goes along with being a poor slob at the bottom of the Food chain. Yup, we chopped off his finger so that the Japanese wouldn't get offended (or paid). He didn't like it one bit, but due to the fact that their ain't much he can do about it... we decided that he could donate his finger rather than us donating five million dollars. Such is life in Japan when you're a four-fingered meat packing worker.
And that is how Abe lost his finger in Japan. He's still pretty pissed off about it, but we convinced him that with the amount of games sold in Japan, he still might be able to get his message through to their culture someday. As a true believer in his cause, he felt that the sacrifice of a finger was but a small price to pay in hoping to shed some light on discriminations and injustices the world over.

Oddsville · #3 11-20-2002, 06:17 PM

Well welcome to the forms Dipstikk and even though your question has been asked alot I still don't mind answering it (hey at least you didn't ask if MO was ever going to be on PS2!)

Anyways here goes....

The Abe with four fingers was the original/final conceptual design for AO. Slightly after AO realease in other parts of the world, OWI was informed that four fingers symbolized the subclass in Japan, due to the slaves working in meat packing plants (just like Abe) and frequently had one of thier fingers cut off. Now thiers a law in Japan that says their can be no four fingered characters and if thier is you have to pay a fee to keep it that way. To make it short OWI didn't wanna have to pay a fee to keep the finger so they hired to Vykker surgens and vwala!

Edit- Yeesh looks like Xav got to it befor I did, oh well...

Dipstikk · #4 11-20-2002, 08:10 PM

mmmm....amputation-y...

M.O.M · #5 11-21-2002, 04:45 AM

also, (im not sure if this is true) but if you have four fingers you could get counted as being part of the Yakuza!

Welcome to the forums

intern · #6 11-23-2002, 06:52 PM

I don't like how OWI had to change the MAIN CHARACTER of their games because of a cultural misunderstanding.

(I've heard in the Yakuza they'll cut just the tip off your finger!)

BigBro · #7 11-23-2002, 10:24 PM

:

Originally posted by intern
I don't like how OWI had to change the MAIN CHARACTER of their games because of a cultural misunderstanding.

Well, what would you rather? Having the main character slighty altered or them being sued and not being able to bring us any games at all? Seemed like a logical move to me...

Joshy · #8 11-24-2002, 05:20 AM

What about the cartoon the simpsons? all of the characters their have 4 fingers, do they have to pay too keep the simpson running in Japan?

Dipstikk · #9 11-24-2002, 11:30 AM

I dunno. I like Abe with 3 fingers. Easier to draw.

intern · #10 11-24-2002, 11:59 AM

Well BigBro, of course OWI did the smart thing and avoided a scandal...or something. I just think it's such a big deal over a little thing.

Adder · #11 11-24-2002, 01:48 PM

I hate that they had to change Mud hands, now they look more like Tuvoc from Star Terc, which I despise with great verosity!!!

Slán

***Xavier*** · #12 11-24-2002, 03:08 PM

I think this post was intended for the "Have any of you guys noticed... " topic, right?

paramiteabe · #13 11-24-2002, 05:09 PM

Easy now Adder its only a slight change hardly noticeable! And Tuvoc has five fingers like humens have.

Mojo · #14 11-24-2002, 05:23 PM

uhm.. he means that when he does this gesture to wish a long life, that looks like abe's hand... not that i'm a trekkie

paramiteabe · #15 11-24-2002, 05:31 PM

Oh ok now I see what he's talking about.

M.O.M · #16 11-25-2002, 12:51 PM

:

Originally posted by intern
I don't like how OWI had to change the MAIN CHARACTER of their games because of a cultural misunderstanding.

(I've heard in the Yakuza they'll cut just the tip off your finger!)

thats kind of right they cut all their finger tips off and they have tons off body tattoos!

BigBro · #17 11-28-2002, 04:37 AM

:

Originally posted by happyguy936
What about the cartoon the simpsons? all of the characters their have 4 fingers, do they have to pay too keep the simpson running in Japan?

The reason The Simpsons arent ridiculed is because they have normal sized singers. Abe had four, and the one on the end looked deformed and small. Read the thing again, it says it somewhere in there.

EDIT: ....I think...