Remake MO and SW to 2D

[possessedfart]

Ok like everyone here, oddworld holds a special place in my heart. Over the years Ive lost count how many times played through the first two games. But for me the last two games didnt have the charm (or something) of the first too. I understand that Munch didnt exactly go to plan and with strangers wraith they tried something different and thats awesome, but I just love those old 2D games. I can honestly say, i think they were the best 2D games ever and I would put them up against Sonic or Mario anyday. And I just keep thinking how awesome it would be if the last two were remade. Even if it was 2D, think how good they would look on current gen consoles and it wouldn't be half as much the work. Like King of Fighters 12 is in the works and its 2d and it its all completely hand drawn, the characters, the backgrounds, everything, its looks so great, so think how good oddworld could be (Ive always loved the background art). Anyway, thats just my thoughts. Its not like its ever going to happen and its not like Lorne will even read this so Ill just keep dreaming and keep playing my 2 lil 2D games and think of a time gone by.

But still how awesome would it be ah?

Cheers, Justin

[Jordan]

As much as I agree, it just won't happen. People want 3D games nowadays.

[AbesGenerationX]

Not a chance! Stranger's on 2D would be horrible Munch on 2D would be good.

[DarkHoodness]

3D games can be just as good as 2D games. :P I think what you mean is that MO and SW should be 2D platformers.

I'd agree if somebody re-made MO into a 2D platformer in the style of AO and AE, 'cause most of the gameplay and the atmosphere of the levels could be re-captured, even be made better. I mean, you play Abe most of the time anyway, and have to jump from platform to platform, switch between characters, open gates and get together groups of mudokons while running away from creatures - Stuff that could easily be done in the style of AO. But it'd be nice if it was re-made at all. MO shouldn't of been made the way it was anyway, though - I still can't belive that they SOLD US A CONCEPT FOR A GAME instead of AN ACTAUL GAME ITSELF! GAUGH!!

. . . Ahem.

SW on the other hand wouldn't work as a 2D platformer game unless you took out all the Shooter parts. And the shooter parts where you beat up outlaws and capture them are what make Stranger himself. SW works well as a game anyway - Every part of the game feels like it's there for a reason, and it's fun to play. You explore areas, sneak behind stuff, snipe outlaws, beat them up, collect ammo. It's action-based and it works. It's hard to imagine it in the style of AO and AE without it being majorly changed. Imagine Stranger sneaking around like Abe and occasionally backhanding the odd Outlaw or two. You'd miss the point of a character who is strong on the outside and weak on the inside, and then he wouldn't be The Stranger anymore - He'd be more like Abe.

Anyone agree?

[Nate]

Dark Hood pretty much summed up what I feel about SW. MO wouldn't work as a 2d game either. Sure, it didn't work as a 3d game but that's to do with what was taken out, not what was put in.

[Fuzzle Guy]

MO wouldn't work as a 2d game either. Sure, it didn't work as a 3d game but that's to do with what was taken out, not what was put in.

I think where MO went wrong was with it being a new console, so they had no other games to base their work off of, or refer back to. Also, it was their first 3D game, so they couldn't say "Well, nobody like this aspect of gameplay in the last game, let's take it out". It was a whole new take on the Oddworld Game.

[OddYouko]

It's to late to do that anyway.

[DarkHoodness]

We know that. :P This is why we fantasise in the end.

[Bullet Magnet]

I disagree. They should never be made into 2D games.


What people are forgetting is that it wasn't the two-dimensional format of AE and AO that made those games great. Remaking the others in less dimensions is hardly going to recapture that.

[Wil]

I agree. Dimensions are evil. The fewer, the better. SW should definitely be a 2D FPS. Hell, I think AO and AE should be remade as 1D platformers.

Tongue removed from cheek, I concur with the majority view. Back when MO was still in production, I dreamt of a 2D version being made alongside it for the PS1 (knowing how unlikely it was that I would get a PS2 or a PC with decent specs). MO might survive a transition to side‐scrolling fairly well, its gameplay mechanics not being too dissimilar from those of its predecessors (mostly possession and rescuing), but doing it would not be doing the story, the character, or the franchise any favours, financially or artistically. MO needs to fleshed out, not flat‐packed.

SW? 2D? We had 2D shooters years and years ago. They were called shoot ’em ups, and they were dire. SW was beautiful, wholesome, rich, heartfelt genius. You can’t have 2D Sergio Leone‐style shootouts. You’ll have to keep dreaming your dreams in your personal time. I can’t share them with you.

[Zelda--Fan]

Well what they should do for MO is make it a 2-D/3-D platformer much like Viewtiful Joe.

i have nothin to say bout SW.

[Xavier]

MO in 2D is just not a good idea,

While Abe is perfect for the job, and moves vertically as spiderman, going up and down from platform to platform, I have the feeling that Munch is a character that moves way more horizontally then Abe. Just look at munch swim, and roll in his wheelchair. How are you going to capture the fun controlling this character in 2D? You might as well make it without Munch and call it Abe 3.

How could anyone have fun playing as Munch in 2D the way he has been designed?



oh and BTW, don't ever touch SW, it's almost perfect

[Alector]

How could anyone have fun playing as Munch in 2D the way he has been designed?

(I'm still posting as Dark Hood. :P Don't get confused.)

Just think - You could have super-cool underwater levels! All in 2D! Munch never really dives in MO - He just swims along the surface. Kinda boring really.

(BTW, I actually think that MO should simply be re-made and done properly, if you're wondering, instead of re-made to 2D. 3D can be good too. . . Especially if it was anything like the concept movies shown to us in 2000. But it was much worse than them. )

[skillya_glowi]

I have no clue about SW, but in my mind MO would just look weird in 2d. I agree with what Xavier said, how controlling Munch wouldn't be as much fun in 2d. In my wildest fantasies MO is just remade, not as a platformer but the way it was envisioned to be. It's such a shame that it didn't work, I thought the story was brilliant.

[caracal]

MO shouldn't of been made the way it was anyway, though - I still can't belive that they SOLD US A CONCEPT FOR A GAME instead of AN ACTAUL GAME ITSELF! GAUGH!!

Hm, I wasnt around for seeing this happen.What exactly are these features that got dropped and were promoted to be there? I know about this http://oddworldlibrary.net/archives/cinema/MO06.htm section at Oddworld Cinema, but since I didnt play the striped down MO I dont know what was kept and what wasnt....and I only want to see what wasnt .

regardless of not having played either of the games, I think there are new features that could be brought in to both games to make them as fun as their 3D counterparts, in the case of MO hopefully better. Chases I think are almost always more fun in 2D platformer format because there really are less options and any change of path is literally a leap of faith.

Given whoever made this remake were really trying they could bring in new elements to supplement whatever is lost.People tend to forget that 2D doesnt mean just sidescroller, think for example if the games were to be redone for DS, a lot of new stuff could be brought in.

[Leto]

Yeah, but the DS can handle 3D graphics, and to a surprisingly high standard.

SW in 2D, however, is the worst idea I've heard today. SW was a brilliant game and as Xavier said, it shouldn't be touched.

[abe is now!]

When I first read the page about MO of AE's manual, I imagined MO like a 3D game for PS1 (I had no Internet and I hadn't never heard about MO). I sometimes imagine MO in 2D. But I disagree, I think it wouldn't be a good thing. MO is perfect for XBOX. At least it could be reassessed and improved.

[Oddball1000]

Well, I still think MO would be great in 2D, (although, you would have to redesign Munch's movement a bit.)

BUT -- just a suggestion -- instead of doing SW like AO/AE you could do it like Metroid Fusion, or something similar.

OR what would be really cool, would be if there was a Metroid Prime Hunters-esque DS shooter. Yay for cake!

[possessedfart]

Wow.when I wrote this I didnt think it would become so big, I thought it would just die. I respect ever ones thoughts but i still think it would be cool, buts that me, I love 2D and retro games. Again I think there is really no point to this because it will never happen but look at this trailer for the remake of bionic commando and imagine if Oddworld look like this. At least I think it would be good.
(Make sure you watch it past the NES bit lol)

[Zerox]

I thought MO could work similarly to AO and AE, albeit added characters etc., and this could allow for perhaps underwater environments for Munch, where he has alot more freedom. Certain different puzzles than Abe normally does could work well here, due to the extra versatality (sp?) of Munch's underwater movement. Munch would also get up and down levels on land via pulleys. By that method he'd have similar versatality to Sligs in that realm.

I can't see Oddworld working on handhelds well at all. The gameplay for the 2D ones maybe, but they can't really reflect the environments so well as the larger consoles. Even on a handheld with good graphics, it's not going to get the same point across. The same type of game just won't work across two different formats. With a handheld you don't get as 'into' the game as something on a larger console particularly. The feel of Oddworld wouldn't be there.

[Fuzzle Guy]

Wow.when I wrote this I didnt think it would become so big, I thought it would just die. I respect ever ones thoughts but i still think it would be cool, buts that me, I love 2D and retro games. Again I think there is really no point to this because it will never happen but look at this trailer for the remake of bionic commando and imagine if Oddworld look like this. At least I think it would be good.
(Make sure you watch it past the NES bit lol)

It's not difficult to imagine - 1.34 could be Oddworld!

[Beastman59]

I hate when people say that 2D is dead and everybody wants 3D games. I've grown up playing 10X more 2D games than 3D. In fact I still play my old 2D games. Their Fun! And I'm positive their are a lot of people out there that feel the same way. The majority of all gamers started with 2D games growing up. Not to rag on 3D games or anything. I love'em. It's probably the best thing to happen to games in general. But it has its downfalls. I would say a lot of 3D games are based on image from the consumer perspective, rather than how fun the game actually is. If the graphics look amazing, it must be good. The same vise-versa. Thats why companies have to spend loads of money creating intense CGI trailers of their game so people will think its "quality," and don't even show what the actual gameplay looks like. 2D games in their own right have an edge that 3D games can't compete with. 2D gives a more interesting way of fun and difficult strategy (Abe is a very good example) that lets the player take in ALL of the surroundings. 3D games can become overwhelming at times, and can cause a lot of frustration (in my experience). And even lets the player miss the detail and hard work the programmers put into amazing environments. It gets overlooked sometimes. I could keep going on and on about all this.
This can probably be argued either way, and I strayed from what I really wanted to say. I don't full heartedly 'agree' with everything that I've said, since it just kind of came from the top of my head, but thats kind of the gist of what I feel. The video trailer that possessedfart posted was very interesting. I really do believe that 2D games will make a comeback in a 3D world and become popular again. There is too much potential to just be forgotten in the past. When Abe came out, 2D games were just starting to get really good. Its a little disappointing that they didn't get developed any further. I like 3D and 2D games, I just wish 2D wasn't completely dropped. (I don't count hand held games, I've long out grown those boy toys. Thats a whole other rant.)

[Tristan]

3D games can be just as good as 2D games. :P I think what you mean is that MO and SW should be 2D platformers.

I'd agree if somebody re-made MO into a 2D platformer in the style of AO and AE, 'cause most of the gameplay and the atmosphere of the levels could be re-captured, even be made better. I mean, you play Abe most of the time anyway, and have to jump from platform to platform, switch between characters, open gates and get together groups of mudokons while running away from creatures - Stuff that could easily be done in the style of AO. But it'd be nice if it was re-made at all. MO shouldn't of been made the way it was anyway, though - I still can't belive that they SOLD US A CONCEPT FOR A GAME instead of AN ACTAUL GAME ITSELF! GAUGH!!

. . . Ahem.

SW on the other hand wouldn't work as a 2D platformer game unless you took out all the Shooter parts. And the shooter parts where you beat up outlaws and capture them are what make Stranger himself. SW works well as a game anyway - Every part of the game feels like it's there for a reason, and it's fun to play. You explore areas, sneak behind stuff, snipe outlaws, beat them up, collect ammo. It's action-based and it works. It's hard to imagine it in the style of AO and AE without it being majorly changed. Imagine Stranger sneaking around like Abe and occasionally backhanding the odd Outlaw or two. You'd miss the point of a character who is strong on the outside and weak on the inside, and then he wouldn't be The Stranger anymore - He'd be more like Abe.

Anyone agree?

I so agree dude.

[Fuzzle Guy]

But 2D is dead. Teenagers are the average gamer. And they don't want to pay £20 for something that is 2D.

[DarkHoodness]

I completely disagree - 2D games aren't dead at all. They're just not as common anymore. All those free flash games that keep appearing on the Internet - Aren't they 2D games too?

One example of a commercial 2D game is Peggle by PopCap. :P That was released on Steam a few months ago, and it turned out to be quite popular. Even Yahtzee reviewed it on Zero Punctuation, and click this link and listen to what he has to say 'cause it also rings true to the current situation regarding 2D games.

[Fuzzle Guy]

Ah, but 2D arcade games will never die!

2D Games such as Oddworld have had their day I'm afraid. I know that there are pleanty of free flash games that are on the internet, but the key words here is free. People will not pay for 2D Anymore. Not when they can pay the same price for 3D.

[Sleeping Slig]

I read that the average gamer was over 25... Times change I guess.

I know MO wasn't as good as it could of been, but I loved seeing oddworld in 3D.
The only issues I had with it was the level design in some levels didn't seem logical, im refering to the industral areas. I honestly would sit there and wonder how on earth would I get about if I was a slig or glukkon!

Heres an interesting concept tho..

Say the next abe game is in 3D right, but what if it had parts in 2D? How would this work you ask? Well here is an example, outside roaming about it's all 3D, you enter some industral building, still 3D, abe walks around this room and finds a doorway that leads to this long hall he has to go down, it's choc-full of security systems and sligs on patrol and theres alot of shadows about for abe to hide in.

As the player steps through this door, within the blink of an eye the game is in a 2D mode, and you sneak abe past all that security in this 2d mode and then when you leave it pops back to 3D. And why stop there? What if the game also had first person perspective? Rather then focus on being 2D or 3D of even a first person mode, the game could contain all 3 and swich back and forth with them in parts of the game. It keeps the game fresh and enjoyable. You won't suffer any bad camera problems, and each level is designed from a perspective that the creators wanted the player to see or experience. I rekon it could go a long way cos you wouldnt know what to expect.

Lol thats just my opinion.

[used:)]

I agree with Xavier. SW shouldn't be touched. It was intended to be a unique, 3D shooter game and that's what it became after four years of elbow grease, unlike MO which was rushed and resulted in inadequacy.

Now a new and original 2D Oddworld game I'd like to see, and with music by Ellen Meijers! Not Michael Bross!

[Alcar]

Now a new and original 2D Oddworld game I'd like to see, and with music by Ellen Meijers! Not Michael Bross!

While I long to see a new 2D game - it isn't feasble in this day and age. Furthermore, while it was Ellen, who's music I fell in love with, Bross is still just as good - adapting to the times.

Still, let us never forget the giants whose shoulders they stand on at present.

Alcar...

[Kyle]

Stranger wouldn't be that great in 2D, since it's a shooter.