**IMPORTANT** Plz Read **IMPORTANT**

FireFrog · #1 01-26-2003, 12:02 AM

We've been having a lot of discussion about weapon acuracy, attack power and character statistics. Now seeing as in my opinion (This is just my opinion) it will get too confusing, I have a new proposal.

Weapons/characters don't have statistics. You buy weapons so you can write about using them in your RPG. Without buying it you can't use it. This way we can still fight each other through our stories without engaging into combat and having to do all these wierd rules...

What do you guys think about this?

Mini Mod
--FireFrog

Latamire_Munch · #2 01-26-2003, 01:39 AM

Yes! Yes! Please enough with all the numbers and crap, on the internet, it gets way to confusing and messy!

Darkest · #3 01-26-2003, 02:08 AM

I thought we were supposed to write about this on the Oddworld Council, FireFrog!

You may give these numbers up, but I never will, in any RPG I run. Without numbers, no one cares about the story and just goes about trying to power themselves.

If you people AGREE right now and right here, that you will, from now on, swear to do every action for the good of the story, for the good of the RPG, to make it readable and entertaining, then I will abandon numbers right now.

You must look at your characters as real characters! You must not treat them as if they were gods, and you must treat all other characters with power. If killing another character will make the story great, then by all means do it! If you will respect eachother's posts, and WRITE as well as rolepay. If instead of fighting for power, you fight for a story others will read and be proud of... Then I will abandon my views and numbers.

This means that moolah will not exist, for that is also a number. You must buy things from moolah you find on the journey, and you must be humble with the moolah you get. There will be no player shops, just an ongoing story.

You either drop numbers completely, or you take them up with your hands full of them.

If you feel that you can't take this responsibility for the good of the story, then I, Darkest, will take up the responsibility as Lord of Numbers.

I will calculate everything, I will calculate stock and Moolah Numbers. I will coordinate battles and character stats. I will determine random situations and realism. If you don't want to give up Moolah, then you don't have to care about the numbers.

If you keep your Moolah, then give me the responsibility of the Numbers. You don't even HAVE to think about the numbers, I will tell them to you. If you ask what number of damage you do, I will reply. You can keep your world of numberless battles, and never have to calculate anything, and I, Darkest will be your calculator?

Which will it be?

Give up your Moolah and accept the responsibility of the Story or...
Keep your Moolah and give the title of Lord of Numbers to Darkest, and never have to do any math.

I don't demand to be a Mod, or even a Mini-Mod. I want to help this forum, and there are only two paths to perfection.

You choose.

Shadestorm · #4 01-26-2003, 03:07 AM

Instead of numbers, why not effects?

Instead of something such as: Damage: 3-5 or 50% Accuracy, we can easily do something like: High Damage and Medium Accuracy.

This will help things alot! Combined with text-oriented character sheets, this'll totally work. Example:

Raz has "High Endurance".
A Dydakon Rider has "Medium Strength".

The Dydakon can not kill Raz cause it's damage is lower than Raz's Endurance. 'Tis simple as that!

However, multiple enemies vs. one character and weapons will have change on combat and such.

How's that? Lot less complicated eh?

This way, writers and RPGers will have a way more general pick of what they want to write, but still have limits so they are not power-hungry.

Good... good?

FireFrog · #5 01-26-2003, 04:08 AM

YES! Nice idea Shade. I love it.

Darkest, just cause we drop those numbers, doesn't mean we drop Moolah! Are u insane? Without Moolah this would be boring as hell. We don't NEED the numbers. I think we should just use Shades idea. If people still think it'll be stupid though, then we should have none of these things. Nobody will think they're god. Everyone here, I belive, will be able to act responsible enough and not kill everything left right and center (Unless everyone in the RPG has agreed to that of course).

Sorry Darkest, but I guess your not Lord of Numbers then, eh?

Mini Mod
--FireFrog

Originally posted by Darkest

:

In any RPG I run...

The thing is Darkest that u DON'T run this RPG. I don't either. Neither does Rex. It's all of ours RPG and we should make it the way we like it.

Shadestorm · #6 01-26-2003, 01:29 PM

Well thanks, I think someone needs to clear Vyykers Labs replies so that we can submit our characters with the new system. Unless you have a less destructive idea FFrog?

Anyway, guys, you should be sympathetic to Darkest. He has shown me his RPG forum where they do everything with numbers. I guess he doesn't think an RPG with without numbers is fun, cause he's been doing it the other way.

Anyway, Darkest, don't try to change the forums. It is working great, and we will easily spot any characters who are "over-powerful", in fact, I think the first thing we should do is create a punishment for those people.

As for stats:
All weapons, vehicles, monsters, characters etc. will have to have these three areas:

Strength: How much damage it deals ( By itself )
Defense: How much damage it reflects ( By itself )
Accuracy: Chance of doing any damage at all
Hit Points ( HP ): How many hits it can take before get killed or breaking.

In each of those areas, you will have: Super Low, Low, Medium Low, Medium, Medium High, High, or Super High.

There it is set, go change your character with these stats! Me, Firefrog, and any others who wish to help will be creating monsters, weapons, armor, and vehicles with those stats!

This will truly become a great RPG!

Happy? Good, let's RP!

FireFrog · #7 01-27-2003, 03:29 AM

Less destructive?
Sure! Edit your posts instead :P

Shadestorm · #8 01-27-2003, 11:59 AM

Everybody edit your posts in Vyykers Labs. Once you use the new system, I can declare you active in the Oddworld RPG forums, and put you on the site.

Unfortunately, I will only have time to update the site later today ( school, ugh ).

Cya!

Darkest · #9 01-27-2003, 12:08 PM

So... basically... we're just placing name tags onto numbers here. This is exactly the same way you'd do it with numbers, except that they are words.

Ok... Whatever. You guys hate the thought of numbers... but you like the thought of numbers with nametags? Ok, sure... Its the closest I'll get to numbers, so... okay!

The reason I said give up moolah, is because all of you guys don't like numbers, so why stick with moolah? You are totally biased! It was either 1. Roleplay just to make a good story or 2. Have numbers govern your actions... Don't you realize that if you give up characteristics of weapons and armor that there will be no need for moolah?

If all the weapons are just story items, then they would all cost the same. What's the point of moolah then, when they are just story items? Get what I'm sayin'?

I never said that I wanted to be Lord of Numbers, FireFrog, it is repetitive here that no one really reads my posts. I only wanted to be Lord of Numbers because no one else would.

FireFrog, an RPG is a post. An RPG you DM. This whole forum isn't the whole RPG I'm talking about... its the RPGs like 'To the Ends of Oddworld and Back' and 'Two's a Company, Three's a Crowd' that the RPG.

Now, with mine, the Pantheon... that's my RPG. And I can have numbers if you want. In fact, I'll never show the players the numbers, you'll just play, and I'll govern from the sidelines with numbers you never see.

It's called Hidden Stats.

You work with numbers and let it govern your RPG, yet no one knows about them, all the players just roleplay.

I own every RPG that I post, FireFrog, you don't seem to get that.

You own Two's Company, Three's a Crowd. That belongs to you.

Paramiteabe owns the RPG called 'To the Ends of Oddworld and Back'. That belongs to him.

How can I make my message clearer?

AND Shadestorm, you guys can't spot people who are being overpowerful. I see them all the time, and everyone doesn't care. You Can't Have A Good Story If Everyone is Too Powerful and Wants Their Own Way

Rule of the Road, men.

As I said to you, if you couldn't control your Overpowerfullness, then just give the responsibility to numbers. With Numbers, everyone is equal, no one can do wrong. Plus, the responsibility of working with numbers is given to one person.

If you can control Overpowerfulness, then I congratulate you. Throw away anything to do with moolah and items, because those things just block greatness to the Forums.

But I guess we are going with numbers. Only seven numbers, but it's better than usual. I'll go edit the catalog.

salty pretzils · #10 01-27-2003, 02:48 PM

Oh dear. Nasty power struggle.
As far as I know Shadestorm and Darkest cannot make rules.
FireFrog, perhaps, because Rexy chose to give them power. But Darkest and Shadestrom, you are acting exactly like you own this RPG. For instance, all queries should be posted to Rexy. All new rules should be sugested toRexy. She maks the rules, not us. If you disobey you may have your post deleted. So within your post, whilst she cannot tell you what to write, she can tell you how to write it. If she's posted up the rules, which she has, You MUST obey them because she is moderator.
By the way, I know Rexy in real life, so don't tell me I hav no idea what I'm talking about. If I could get Rexy to come on here, perhaps she would tell you something similar, perhapds not. But that is what I believe to be true of the rules here. And don't be afraid to critisize me, In fact I'm expecting a good ol' scrap. The joys of being me, it's so peachy.
*makes sick noises*

The Red Muse · #11 01-27-2003, 03:58 PM

Bless you salty! Bless you...

I ain't gonna say anything else about this, except that I really agree with salty.

Do we really need all these fancy rules to RP?
I know I don't.

Peace.

dripik · #12 01-27-2003, 04:05 PM

Sure you don't need all these rules. I didn't need many rules at my RPG. Is that right, The Red Muse?

The Red Muse · #13 01-27-2003, 04:28 PM

:

Originally posted by dripik
Sure you don't need all these rules. I didn't need many rules at my RPG. Is that right, The Red Muse?

Yup! Correct again!

Hey, since were talking about rules, I have suggestion too:

Be reasonable.

As you know, I don't want to be mean, no.
That's not my goal with this.

I mean, for Heaven's Sake people, we've done just fine with the old rules.
At least I have.
But don't get me wrong, I have nothing against modifications...
...This is slipping out of control.

So wake up and smell the coffee!
We're supposed to have fun in here!

salty pretzils · #14 01-27-2003, 05:48 PM

Thankyou Red Muse (Bless you) and Dripik (bless you too). Now, I do not object to FireFrog's suggestion at all. It's just I think that perhaps the systems suggested would be A) Too dificult to run and B) A little too complicated.
Good ideas are fine, but it just seems to me as if this is being carried a bit too far. The RPG is supposed to be simple and fairly easy to allow for more fun. And plus I don't think there are really enough participants for the systems to be implicated.

Darkest · #15 01-27-2003, 08:06 PM

Don't call the RPG Forums THE RPG... it's too confusing. Call it the RPG Forums.

I want people to be reasonable, but no one ever IS reasonable. It happens with every single one of you. Every one of you that I've seen, there are many flaws that I've spotted. And its disturbing to me to find so many flaws in roleplaying.

Numbers protect people from making flaws. It's a fact. And the thing is, only I will be able to do the complicated stuff.

:

The RPG is supposed to be simple and fairly easy to allow for more fun.

You must haven't ever played a good numbered RPG, there is something that you are missing, and you think it will be too complicated. It isn't, I swear to you, if you use numbers in the right way.

I am trying to show this forums the light. But you reject my offerings. These things will make life on the forums easier and better.

:

Do we really need all these fancy rules to RP?
I know I don't.

No, you can Roleplay just fine with no rules. But if you want to Roleplay Well, then that is going to take a lot of work. If you don't have the skill to Roleplay Well, then you can use rules to make you Roleplay Well.

:

As far as I know Shadestorm and Darkest cannot make rules.
FireFrog, perhaps, because Rexy chose to give them power. But Darkest and Shadestrom, you are acting exactly like you own this RPG. For instance, all queries should be posted to Rexy. All new rules should be sugested toRexy. She maks the rules, not us. If you disobey you may have your post deleted. So within your post, whilst she cannot tell you what to write, she can tell you how to write it. If she's posted up the rules, which she has, You MUST obey them because she is moderator.
By the way, I know Rexy in real life, so don't tell me I hav no idea what I'm talking about. If I could get Rexy to come on here, perhaps she would tell you something similar, perhapds not. But that is what I believe to be true of the rules here. And don't be afraid to critisize me, In fact I'm expecting a good ol' scrap. The joys of being me, it's so peachy.
*makes sick noises*

Tiranos Rex is nothing without the People of the Forums. She is just like you and me, except that she can edit and delete and lock posts. What makes her better than you and I? Nothing. In the end, she and I will be no different from eachother, along with everyone else.

I hold as much power as Tiranos Rex.

This is our game, we are the rulemakers. Rule of the Rode. The Moderator is NEVER the Ruler of an RPG, just a Ruler of the Forum. A Moderator, and I quote, is supposed to guard, protect, and enhance the posts. The Moderator is not supposed to make rules nor change RPGs, the Roleplayers are supposed to.

Shadestorm · #16 01-27-2003, 08:14 PM

I totally agree with everyone who says it'll be too complicated. The thing is, we need that kind of stuff, for the sake of destruction of this forums.

And, before I get going on this topic. I wasn't saying I had power over anything. Darkest and FireFrog were arguing, and I decided to comprimise with something they both liked.

Let me demonstrate:
No stats, even simple ones, and there is no need for weapons.
No weapons, items, ect., then there is no need for shops.
If there are no shops, MLA has no rewards, cause I can't do anything with it, it'll just be a number without a cause.

With out MLA, and Rex will have no power. I have nothing against Rexy, really, but the only reason I go with her opinions is cause it'll get me MLA.
If there was no MLA, I wouldn't even pay attention to her. She can't get me banned because of "strange roleplaying styles", or ""disagreeing with her".

Got it? Ok, I am a nice guy, I would listen to her cause I don't want any feelings to be hurt. The thing is, if there was no MLA, I could disobey her if I wanted.

There ya go.

Darkest · #17 01-27-2003, 08:16 PM

Amen to that Shadestorm, you have a way with words. That is what I've been trying to say, and you put it so simply.

Bless you, Shadestorm.

FireFrog · #18 01-27-2003, 10:59 PM

Salty, Dripik and Muse...
THANK YOU FOR COMING TO THE RESCUE!!!
I want a simple RPG too...

Listen. If we had no stats we can still have weapons in the shops! The whole point of buying them is to use them in your stories. For instance, you can't write about using a BlitzPacker if you don't HAVE a BlitzPacker.

See? No confusing stats, but still a little extra challenge to the RPG! This was my idea that I was trying to get across anyway...

Abe's son · #19 01-27-2003, 11:05 PM

Oh great *will now avoid fighting in the RP altogether*

Darkest · #20 01-27-2003, 11:08 PM

No, you don't get it! Why shouldn't I get it in the story, if there are no stats.

How about, I use brute force, then since weapons have no stats, I'm still as strong as I would if I had a BlitzPacker, I don't have to use Moolah anymore, because I don't care about items, I just use my brute force and magic, which is as strong as I would be if I spent moolah to get weapons!

Still no point in Moolah! If Moolah have no stats, then why buy moolah? You don't have to use a Blitz Packer, you are still as strong as you would have been.

There is still a problem.

FireFrog · #21 01-27-2003, 11:29 PM

Cause the items are for us to use in stories... how you use them is up to you! MLA and ITEMS are for a little thing that starts with F ends with N and has a little U in the middle...

Dont know if you've heard of it...

FUN!!!

Remember, you can also buy moolah for uniforms and Novelty items...

Majic · #22 01-27-2003, 11:36 PM

I don't RP here, but Moolah just seems like what inflated money is. Worthless, not really necessary. Having to buy something to work in a cool plot twist in an RPG limits what people can do. Moolah seems to act as a boundary for things. For instance, if somebody says *pulls out a cup of tea and drinks it*. Did you have to buy the tea? The cup? The water? No, no, no. Yet to get in some action or such, you have to tediously post to be able to go "Look, I have a blitzpacker but the plots long gone from the point I was planning on changing!".

I suggest just putting what sort of regulations at the start of any RPG. And if any spiet wars come up, such as others making rules to prevent others from having any sort of good time, I'm not a mod here, but I'll do something about it.

FireFrog · #23 01-27-2003, 11:45 PM

Yes, but I'm saying that people cant just pull out HUGE big powerful weapons and blast every1 away. But say you have a cup of tea, blablabla... small things like that u don have to pay for!

Darkest · #24 01-28-2003, 11:56 AM

Yes, but no one can pull out a large weapon and blast people away, can they FireFrog? I mean, the weapon has no stats, so how can the person actually use it?

Bless you, Majic_Abe, you've got my point exactly.

If someone bought an EXTRA LARGE BLITZ ROCKET LAUNCHER. But the Weapons don't have stats, then how does it make it better than a stick? Or a fist? Or a stone?

If you don't get stats, everything you buy are sticks and stones.

Since it has no stats, I could beat up someone with Full Steroon Armor and an IceWyrm's Battlesword with a stick and a loincloth on. The items don't have stats, so they don't mean anything.

If weapons don't have stats, there is no point of moolah.

Shadestorm · #25 01-28-2003, 11:59 AM

Ok, I'm fine with that, at least I won't have to update my site with stats all the time.

Whatever, I don't wanna cope with it.

If you guys had ever played with stats and such you would relize:
1. It isn't a hastle ( Especially with the website, you go, you check, and viola! Everything you need. )
2. It is much funner, restrictions are fun. Half the fun of RPing is sucking at first and working yourself upwards.

But, I relize you guys are playing a Game, because games have problems, answers, and things that might take a couple seconds for you to think about.

No, what you are writing is a story. In which others can join. That's cool! I like doing that. It is just I came to this forum hoping for some difficulties that I would like to play through. But with stories, I can easily write something to blow away my problems.

There.

salty pretzils · #26 01-28-2003, 02:27 PM

Hmm....
Yes, Rexy can edit posts and such.
BUT...
She makes the rules and you obey them, and what gives her more 'power' is that she can edit, delete or move your post if you don't obey them. Remember, she is in charge of this particular forum, and as such, she controls the rules of it. Anyway, the RPG here as nearly always been pretty much a story (thankyou Shadestorm, and by the way, I don't hold anything against you or Darkest either) although I do believe that some Hp stats and so forth may have been used.
Now most Role players here a fairly intelligent (I suppose). Also theyt kno that it is almost impossible for a mudokon with a lioncloth, toothpick and no sense of smell to defeat a bigbro with a huge Blitzpacker. So people don't do it. You don't actully need a set of rules for people to realise that. And its actully quite interesting to see what players come up with...(thankyou, Majic for your example).

Rex Tirano · #27 01-28-2003, 04:42 PM

:

With out MLA, and Rex will have no power. I have nothing against Rexy, really, but the only reason I go with her opinions is cause it'll get me MLA.

*sniff* He knows i'm a girl*sniff* I'm so happy. Actally if I met this guy on oddchat i wouldn't kill him, its (you are a guy right) his opinion and i cn't change that. Evn if i do think he is a suck up. Which I dont....do i?)

:

Hmm.... Yes, Rexy can edit posts and such.
BUT...
She makes the rules and you obey them, and what gives her more 'power' is that she can edit, delete or move your post if you don't obey them. Remember, she is in charge of this particular forum, and as such, she controls the rules of it. Anyway, the RPG here as nearly always been pretty much a story (thankyou Shadestorm, and by the way, I don't hold anything against you or Darkest either) although I do believe that some Hp stats and so forth may have been used.
Now most Role players here a fairly intelligent (I suppose). Also theyt kno that it is almost impossible for a mudokon with a lioncloth, toothpick and no sense of smell to defeat a bigbro with a huge Blitzpacker. So people don't do it. You don't actully need a set of rules for people to realise that. And its actully quite interesting to see what players come up with...(thankyou, Majic for your example).

Amen sista! Amen! (Why did I jus put that?Man i need sme doritos.....) Okay this may be a usless quote to use but heck I also cannot change her opinions! God bless the rg and evryone in it!).........(that includes you all..........)..................(no not you majic run along now!)

Everyone I want you to listen before i explode, Moohla is fun you don't have to use it but its there foryou who want to. I am not going to force rules on you becaue if you are all 'experts' you should know them and if someone dos't understand they should just ask. I'm not going to bte your heads off...(well not normally!)
I won't inforce them because I wil be hated and i tink i will be a terrible moderator, but it look lie you people have already showed me that. So from today theese rules apply untill you al calm down and stop stressing me! I gave yu the chance of freedom now live with these rules please.

Rules I have to inforce so I don't explode:

1.) NO Character killing, of any shape or form. Not even if you agreebetween 2 people. The only time you can do this is if it is your own character and you pm me or frogger first.

2.) NO flipping arguing, If fnd you arguing aain it will be a warning, without exception.

3.) NO Stats, no hp, mp, moohla, aybe when the rpg has ben 'modernized' this rule will be abolished.

4.NO Poweplaying.

5.) NO Making mini rpg's to get around theese rules. You an make them like 'return to rpture farms' But these rules apply and if you create characters there then please post them officially in vykers labs.

6.) NO Creating more than 5 characters, and please get tem sorted before posting.

7.) NO eating in clas! Is that gum?!?!?!?!?

LookI'll probably be hated for this. But i don't really think I can cope with alltheese rows since this community has been created. It dosn't mean you are ad rpg-ers or I wanna be mean. I just wanna live till i getout of school. Just rpg and have a good time!

Shadestorm · #28 01-28-2003, 09:06 PM

Hey' it's cool wit' me! I mean, I've been doing fine in the 3 RPGs with those rules, so why am I arguing.

One thing though, why won't you guys take a little effort with stats. I even simplified the process for you. Low, Medium, and High Stats would be no hastle at all for you. Why do you wish to not take a little effort and make Rping a bit more fun?

Everybody, I mean no offense to anyone. Everybody is on the same level of friendliness in my list as they were before I started arguin'. I hope I am the same to you. I guess I just wanted to get my point through.

Anyway, cya later!

Darkest · #29 01-28-2003, 09:11 PM

Hey, Rex, you still need to hear us out, you don't yet get what I'm talking about. All good governments are based off of arguing. If you don't argue about the rules, then there is no government.

:

Now most Role players here a fairly intelligent (I suppose). Also theyt kno that it is almost impossible for a mudokon with a lioncloth, toothpick and no sense of smell to defeat a bigbro with a huge Blitzpacker. So people don't do it. You don't actully need a set of rules for people to realise that. And its actully quite interesting to see what players come up with...(thankyou, Majic for your example).

Yes, people are intelligent. So, a Blitzpacker would be stronger than a stick? Then that would be stats! The moolah needs to be based upon stats!

The way FireFrog is doing it, all the weapons cost the same, but SOME are stronger than others. WTF is up with that?

Look, I'm not going to argue any more on the forums, but I'm going to invite you all to a final rule stand-off in a chatroom, and not the Oddchat. This needs to be decided, but since Rex is feeling so queenly then we won't trouble her.

FireFrog · #30 01-28-2003, 09:15 PM

Rex i agree to everything u jus said...

But plz... don take away the Moolah! MLA was suppose to be for fun!!! Now everyones ruining our fun.....