Abe HD Ideas

[Spooce-aholic]

Abe's Oddysee wasn't really multiplayer. It just had a mode that brought up an alternating "Player 1"/"Player 2" overlay every time you respawned.

I thought it would be cool if they made multiplayer for the PC version, supported more players, and supported LAN/internet.

Maybe they could change it so the players play at the same time.

Maybe they could add more game modes.

[Crashpunk]

Abe's Oddysee is a single-player game. It doesn't need online play and I think it would ruin it if it had it because what use would it have? just muiltple Abes running everywhere messing up the paths?

[AvengingGibbons]

@crashpunk 'time trails'? i've been calling them time 'trials'.. Have I been wrong my whole life? o_O..

Multiplayer could work, but you couldn't just stick another player in the game as it is. You'd have to redesign the puzzles, and the layout, pretty much everything about the scene, to make it work for multiple players. What could happen is a second player could opt to control slave mudokons throughout the game and this would allow puzzles to be accessed and completed that are only accessible with the aid of the second player, enabling a '110%' game completion.

[Jordan]

I think multiplayer could work in Oddworld depending on how the puzzles are designed. Maybe you handicap each player regularly throughout the game to leave them with certain abilities or skills, like being able to possess or talk to other Mudokons. This can make it so each player has their own importance and task throughout the game.

[Goresplatter]

As far as multiplayer is concerned, I think it's an excellent idea, and I've got quite a few mates who'd love it as much as I would; but I do think it would require a seperate set of levels, possibly characters, much like Portal 2.*

I like the idea of the 'jittery' possessed Sligs. That would really add atmosphere and immersion!

I also like the time-trial idea, with the ghost player from a previous playthrough or some such thing.

Further levels through DLC etc. (SLIGSTORM PLX) would add to the longevity of the game, too!*

*You wouldn't have to worry much about making these levels if you included an easy-to-use and highly interactive level editor of some kind. Eh? EH? You know it has to happen

[Wil]

Regarding user-generated levels, a level-editor is probably a bitchload of work considering how much it's likely to be used. After all, Abe HD will have fully 3D backdrops. How are you gonna make those in a level editor?

As long as the structure of the programme allows it to be modifiable, mods will appear if modders are interested. If the demand proves to be high once the game is out, then you can design a level editor built to cater to the emergent demand.

[Manco]

Sligs & Posession:

Going back to this briefly, I just wanted to explain why I hate the idea of Sligs having dialogue and conversations.

Maybe I’m turning into that fan who bemoans any changes made to a classic game, but I don’t see it helping the atmosphere. Think back to when you played AO for the first time.

Think about how the world is presented—our first landmark is a smoke-spewing megalithic factory, filled with production lines and cold, malicious machinery manned by emaciated slaves. RuptureFarms is built up in the player’s mind as an unpleasant and oppressive place, an amoral corporation whose only concern is its CEO’s pocket.

The way Sligs are presented in-game is, I think, an extension of that environment. In the original game, the are portrayed as callous and inhuman. Their presence and their loose trigger fingers are designed to make the player fearful; they are an obstacle and a threat. I think their (relative) silence accentuates that image of a cold and dangerous enemy, and I think giving them throwaway dialogue cheapens that image.

Imagine Combine soliders standing around a watercooler. Slig small-talk gives me the same sense of dissonance.

[Goresplatter]

I can see what you mean, actually, OddHunter. Perhaps a middle-ground would be best, so as not to humanise too much; maybe they could occasionally engage each other in the same kind of chit-chat as when we see them conversing just as Abe enters the Stockyards. It's unintelligible and emotionless, much like the Metropolice radio chatter in the start of HL2... which makes me think.

In the first game, ALL of the industrialists spoke in low, obscure voices, and as far as I could work out, were not meant to be fully understood by the player. Kind of makes them seem much more merciless. I think as long as any Slig chatter was done like this, and the aforementioned cutscene, it could breathe a little more life into the environments while not breaking character.

Just don't make them speak with the same jive mannerisms as in Munch... I always thought that was awful.

Just two small things I thought of while writing this post;
1) I hope the Sligs still spam BS and S'Mo BS when they're about to beat the slaves silly. To me it's highly iconic.
2) Can't remember if we've had word on this, but I hope the Sligs use the visor mask from Oddysee. Looks way cooler and more emotionless.

[Crashpunk]

I suppose Portal 2 styled co-op levels could work. @AvengingGibbons It is Time Trials, You were right.

[Chubfish]

Proper 2 player mode separate from the main story would be pretty cool, and could work somewhat easily on a PC. I could only wonder what complex and nightmarish puzzles you could create.

However, if it was done a la Portal 2 style, you have to wonder; can this puzzle be solved solo? Does it really require a second player? It'd take a while to make something like this but it'd enhance the experience alot. You could still rescue mudokons and sabotage industrial facilities and what not but it'd have to be separate from the main story, or editted levels from the main story made co-op style.

That would be something I'd very much like, along with co-op puzzle elements and achievements, but it sounds hard to implement correctly (but anything would be better than the "2-player" in Oddysee/Exoddus before this).

[Spooce-aholic]

Maybe they can have a race where the players see a ghost of the other players on their screen or something.

[Sekto Springs]

Though I agree that giving sligs dialogue may disrupt the general atmosphere, I still think that it makes them more congruous with how sligs are portrayed in cut-scenes. The only reason they weren't more chatty was because of the crippling AI limitations in those days. When MO rolled around, we saw sligs behaving the way Lorne and crew probably wanted them to in the first place. Essentially, the limitations made it better.

They're more effective as no-nonsense kind of security guards, but that's not how they really are. The question then becomes; do we take the opportunity to characterize them more now that we have fewer limitations, or do we keep them as the half-sentient, guns-with-legs that shoot first and ask later? I feel that, in capable hands, it could go either way without detracting from the game itself.

[Spooce-aholic]

I can see what you mean, actually, OddHunter. Perhaps a middle-ground would be best, so as not to humanise too much; maybe they could occasionally engage each other in the same kind of chit-chat as when we see them conversing just as Abe enters the Stockyards. It's unintelligible and emotionless, much like the Metropolice radio chatter in the start of HL2... which makes me think.

In the first game, ALL of the industrialists spoke in low, obscure voices, and as far as I could work out, were not meant to be fully understood by the player. Kind of makes them seem much more merciless. I think as long as any Slig chatter was done like this, and the aforementioned cutscene, it could breathe a little more life into the environments while not breaking character.

Just don't make them speak with the same jive mannerisms as in Munch... I always thought that was awful.

Just two small things I thought of while writing this post;
1) I hope the Sligs still spam BS and S'Mo BS when they're about to beat the slaves silly. To me it's highly iconic.
2) Can't remember if we've had word on this, but I hope the Sligs use the visor mask from Oddysee. Looks way cooler and more emotionless.

They should make it so that if Abe stands there listening to their conversations for 30 mins, he says "cool story bro".

[STM]

Far too gimmicky, I'm not sure if you're serious. But adding little internet memes and pop culture references would kill the game for me completely. Especially since playing the game again in maybe five years would probably make them all invalid.

[Sekto Springs]

It totally worked for Shrek.

Right?

[Crashpunk]

They should make it so that if Abe stands there listening to their conversations for 30 mins, he says "cool story bro".

GOD NO!

[Chubfish]

I had an idea. How about speed run/time attack/challenge mode? The idea is to get to the goal at the end of the level as quickly as possible, and it could track your time on a leaderboard or something. I know Steam is good with stuff like that.

Maybe you could have leaderboards for time, and mudokons saved for each level. Who can rescue all 28 workers from the first level of RuptureFarms the fastest? Would be cool to see and be quite competitive, I know a few other games that do this that are also 2D platformers.

[StrangerEastwood]

Maybe some challenges outside of the main game. Of course, the secrets are devious enough, so we'll see.

[Glitch]

I think multiplayer could work in Oddworld depending on how the puzzles are designed. Maybe you handicap each player regularly throughout the game to leave them with certain abilities or skills, like being able to possess or talk to other Mudokons. This can make it so each player has their own importance and task throughout the game.

@crashpunk 'time trails'? i've been calling them time 'trials'.. Have I been wrong my whole life? o_O..

Multiplayer could work, but you couldn't just stick another player in the game as it is. You'd have to redesign the puzzles, and the layout, pretty much everything about the scene, to make it work for multiple players. What could happen is a second player could opt to control slave mudokons throughout the game and this would allow puzzles to be accessed and completed that are only accessible with the aid of the second player, enabling a '110%' game completion.

I'm sure I mentioned this idea somewhere on the forums. If I haven't none of you are going to believe that I've already got it written down.

EDIT: ah there we go, page 6

[Paul_hibs3]

Nope going to stay stubborn. Abe games is a single player experience. Some of my mates like oddworld but they would cba playing co-op in Abe HD. Too much stress and time, but whereas COD they would play co-op in something like that. I don't want abe HD to have co-op purely for the fact its going down the same cycle as many companies thinking its cool and new when infact its boring and usually broken. AO and AE are single player games, not a Portal 2 where its single player then more story in co-op. It worries me if that's what is being suggested to be put in the game.

[Jordan]

Nope going to stay stubborn. Abe games is a single player experience. Some of my mates like oddworld but they would cba playing co-op in Abe HD. Too much stress and time, but whereas COD they would play co-op in something like that. I don't want abe HD to have co-op purely for the fact its going down the same cycle as many companies thinking its cool and new when infact its boring and usually broken. AO and AE are single player games, not a Portal 2 where its single player then more story in co-op. It worries me if that's what is being suggested to be put in the game.

If you honestly think multi-player is too stressful and time-consuming, then you have been playing games with a poor multi-player option. It's only boring and broken when it's done wrong. I however have faith in JAW and if they were to execute multi-player, then I think they would do it very well. Also, multi-player has been around for a very long time, it hasn't suddenly become a thing that companies decide to include for the sake of it. Do you really think Oddworld is the kind of game that would jump on bandwagons?

[Paul_hibs3]

If you honestly think multi-player is too stressful and time-consuming, then you have been playing games with a poor multi-player option. It's only boring and broken when it's done wrong. I however have faith in JAW and if they were to execute multi-player, then I think they would do it very well. Also, multi-player has been around for a very long time, it hasn't suddenly become a thing that companies decide to include for the sake of it. Do you really think Oddworld is the kind of game that would jump on bandwagons?

Multi-player has been put into almost every single game nowadays and most of them are poor. Except AAA titles. I didn't mean multi-player is too stressful and time consuming. I mean co-op games, and espically in a game like Abe's games.

And to your last question yes. Example, Playstation Move and 3D support for Strangers Wrath a HD remake. 3 out of 4 popular trends atm for all new games only thing missing is co-op.

However I ain't complaining about the HD remakes, trust me on that one Nor do I mind them trying Playstation Move or 3D TV support because it doesn't really change the game its an optional tweek. Whereas co-op changes the whole game itself.

[Chubfish]

If multiplayer/co-op and time attacks/challenges/etc are being at least considered then hurray for additional content. You can easily make co-op story based in Oddworld me thinks, it's pretty expansive.

I don't see how multiplayer is at all bad. Even in games that do it poorly, it opens alot more gameplay choices, and styles of play, and it is therefore quite good.

Just because multiplayer has been put into "every" game as you say, doesn't mean it's going to not work in this. I can see how it could work in this with ease.

[Manco]

And to your last question yes. Example, Playstation Move and 3D support for Strangers Wrath a HD remake. 3 out of 4 popular trends atm for all new games only thing missing is co-op.

PSMove: is that a popular trend? Really?
3D support: this is probably the way technology is going, not really a trend.
HD: this isn’t a trend, it’s a standard for games nowadays.

[LIJI]

I want a debugging console!

As for multiplayer, was a Super Mario Galaxy model considered? I'm not sure how you could implement it in Abe HD (Gameplay-wise), but if done right it could probably work. It could be another Mudokon assisting Abe (Alf? Big-Face?) with a different set of abilities, and maybe 2-player-exclusive bonus areas that require 2 players to solve.

(In SMG, a second player could join the game and help Mario collect items by pointing at them, freeze or kill some enemies, and enable Mario to do higher jumps. While this exact model would probably ruin the game, another assist-type model might work)

[Spooce-aholic]

Far too gimmicky, I'm not sure if you're serious. But adding little internet memes and pop culture references would kill the game for me completely. Especially since playing the game again in maybe five years would probably make them all invalid.

I thought it would be a cool easter egg or something.

Nope going to stay stubborn. Abe games is a single player experience. Some of my mates like oddworld but they would cba playing co-op in Abe HD. Too much stress and time, but whereas COD they would play co-op in something like that. I don't want abe HD to have co-op purely for the fact its going down the same cycle as many companies thinking its cool and new when infact its boring and usually broken. AO and AE are single player games, not a Portal 2 where its single player then more story in co-op. It worries me if that's what is being suggested to be put in the game.

I thought mulitplayer would be cool so people could tell how good they are at the game.

I know I could get perfect endings in Abe's Oddysee and Abe's Exoddus, but some people may be able to do it faster than me.

There's different types of ways there could be multiplayer in Abe HD. They could have what they had in AO for the PS where the players take turns. They can have a time trials thing where players get their own screen and see 'ghosts' of the other players. They can do teams where they find the total of times for one team, then add up the total time for the other team. The team with the shortest time wins.

That's not the end of the list.

But I thought that a CTF thing would be cool where one player is Abe and the rest are Sligs or something and the player that's Abe has to sneak into the base and capture a flag.

Or we can make it so that there are multiple Abes (one for each player) and everyone has to work together to capture the flag from the base.

They should make it so that when you're playing multiplayer you can change your screen name.

[Luskan]

Though I agree that giving sligs dialogue may disrupt the general atmosphere, I still think that it makes them more congruous with how sligs are portrayed in cut-scenes. The only reason they weren't more chatty was because of the crippling AI limitations in those days. When MO rolled around, we saw sligs behaving the way Lorne and crew probably wanted them to in the first place. Essentially, the limitations made it better.

They're more effective as no-nonsense kind of security guards, but that's not how they really are. The question then becomes; do we take the opportunity to characterize them more now that we have fewer limitations, or do we keep them as the half-sentient, guns-with-legs that shoot first and ask later? I feel that, in capable hands, it could go either way without detracting from the game itself.

That's a toughy. I actually loved the way they were portrayed - brutal, unemotional, cold etc But I don't know. I'd leave it as it because with the first one, I liked the idea of them being quite different from the rest of the games, with the eyesight's etc.

[STM]

Sligattack9000gibbedTherealAbeshady200 points!
Multi-kill


While you're at it, make a kill streak system, hell fifteen kills and you can call in the slogs.

[Chubfish]

I want a debugging console!

SECONDED

Also I didn't mean non-sensical multiplayer; I meant 2 people in a platforming setting like Abe's Oddysee is.

[Spooce-aholic]

Sligattack9000gibbedTherealAbeshady200 points!
Multi-kill


While you're at it, make a kill streak system, hell fifteen kills and you can call in the slogs.

I don't want it to be a FPS like COD. It could still have normal game play. You have to solve puzzles and sneak past the other players to reach the flag. Then you need to sneak out. If Abe dies then the team guarding the flag gets one point and if Abe escapes then he gets points for each flag he takes.