I say we kick the shit out of idiots for a laugh...
 

Since Off Topic is really fucking boring at the moment, how about for really stupid threads we leave them open, and just let people flame the crap out of the idiot newbies that have been plaguing the forums lately?

It would provide entertainment (some of the people here are incredibly funny when they're flaming people), discourage newbies from making stupid mistakes, and potentially cause numerous idiots to leave in a very entertaining "OMG I CANT TAKE IT ANYMORE!" manner.

All in favour?

No, I for one am not in favour.
You yourself said:And, yes, I know that what you just suggested would not be making threads, but I still believe it is "just plain wrong." Yes, some members can be extremely irritating at times, but I believe that's the moderating team's job to try and stop them.

Now, it's time for me to hide under a rock from the explosion...

Dino for presidente! Most definatley in favour. Ever since March the forums have been overun with n00bs, per se... Especially Off Topic Discussion. I mean, it isn't as interesting as it once was...

Amen to that! Im in favour :D

He, you say "kick the shit out of the idiots". Yes, that would be amusing, beating somone up with words on an internet forum. LOL

Well this is a forums, we're people come and go. It's probably becuase of SW release.

I support him, even though it's hypocrital and contradictory considering what he said in the other thread.
I think it would be funny. :p

It is slightly hypocritical yes... but Kimon was making a silly mistake just openly furthering hatred toward stingbee... there was no point in it. I understand that a lot of people hate stingbee and I can honestly say I see exactly why. But we don't need to make new threads just to piss on people for no reason - lets just wait till we have a good excuse like them being idiotic...

What I'm saying here is that basically, we SHOULD teach idiots a lesson if they make really really stupid mistakes, because not only does it show that person that there are consequences to being an idiot, but also it shows all the other would-be morons around the forums that you can't get away with this sort of stuff. Plus it's entertainment.

Part of our problem at the moment is that despite how much we tell these people that they should read the rules, guidlines, FAQ and whatnot before they post, they still don't do it - no matter how many suggestions, they don't change their behaviour. They are wasting the time and resources of our moderators, they wind us all up, and despite all that we're supposed to just remain diplomatic and polite.

Heck I mean I'm not trying to start a crusade here but isn't about time we showed these people that idiocy gets them nowhere? If these people realise that good behaviour keeps them out of trouble, they might actually stand a chance of falling in line.

And we might stand a chance of being entertained.

Vote Dino for mayor.

If anybody starts an open flame war in Off Topic, even if directed at an idiot, I'm closing it. Tough break. I simply don't see the pleasure and/or entertainment in relentless mocking.

Just because you don't doesn't mean nobody else does, killjoy. Anyways, why would a moderator support the cause of idiots? All we're asking for is permission to flame people for uber stupid mistakes - if it's not uber stupid you can close it. Not like we're being unfair or anything.

I would absolutely love the chance to have an official "Kick the Shit out of Losers" thread. But then I'd feel bad about making fun of people. At which point I'd drown my sorrows in alcohol and motor oil.

Anyway, if someone deserves an Internet beat-down, I'm all for it. :D

Yes, yes it was. :fuzemb:

You are definatley acting like the adult within this group of bashers, but how can you not find mocking people even remotely amusing? :P

Abuse them in a constructive manner. Don't just post flames. Prove all their opinions are wrong and all that.

Yes, now that IS fun. :D Yes, we would never just say "oi u a asshole u suck ahaha", we would bum them out totally so they would never return to this place.

:D

Dino, Hobo and Super Munch. I agree with everything you guys have said. All we need now is Alcars approval, I'm sure Hobo can win that for us. ;)

Have fun guys, but just remember not some "idiots" as yous say, want to start flaming. Becuase some of those become upset and take it very serously.


I'm bored.

You can't prove their opinions are wrong because they don't display opinions. They could be bots; they tend to make similar posts with limited grammar, terrible spellings and only of a lines substance. Often with things akin to 'do u like mulok i do'

If it's an actual person, always attempt constructive advice first. Keyword, advice. Keep it friendly. If that doesn't make a difference, that's when the harsher, INTELLIGENT criticisms come into play. Anything along the lines of "You're an idiot" yields little productivity. And I wouldn't count on Alcar supporting the cause, either.

Yes, that would be what we would do. Posting random flaming isn't funny, but being an asshole in a constructive way is incredibly funny.

God I come up with all the best ideas. :D

That so, grasshopper?

That is completely out of context, I believe. Alcar meant that some people come on the forums to vent anger they have built up because of someone else. He can't see "why people just can't go and belt" those who they are actually mad at instead of displacing their anger on the forums.

As far as this subject goes, I say let those who have no spammed/broken a forum rule, cast the first flame.

There's nothing wrong with constructive criticism. Or if needed, a bit of a harsher tone and maybe some tasteful satire/sarcasm. But full out abuse won't solve anything... So much for humaneness.

Dino, I've done my fair share of humiliating, but I don't think we should take every new member of a month or so and burn them to a crisp. If they break a rule, then fine. But you don't just go and harass someone if they're not doing anything.

There have been members who had started out as the "idiots," as you call them, and turned into productive members of the forums. (I myself never used chatspeak, but I had a really cutesy attitude during my humble beginnings.)

In all honesty, I don't think Alcar would condone this. That's just not the kind of person he is . If you want a Moderator who would happily adopt this idea of yours, I think you're better off asking someone like Disgruntled Intern (who seems to have disappeared after his "You guys are just jerks" post). I've been here for at least 5 years or so, and in my time here I've come to know that Alcar would never just flame the everloving f*ck out of someone, escpecially not a new member.


On a side note: Dino, there's no reason for you to be double-posting, especially since you're the one who started this whole "Down With the Noobies" campaign. If you're trying to deal with people who break the rules, it's best to keep your own nose clean.

Is it just me or I'm I the only newbie here who isn't trying to spam or make stupid threads.

I dunno, I'd say your gumball thread was pretty fucking stupid. But that's besides the point.

People, people, people, you aren't hearing what I'm saying...I'm not condoning the random flaming of newbies - quote me please where I ever said newbies. You made the assumption that by idiots I meant newbies, which tells me that you yourself believe newbies to be idiots.

I'm talking about idiots who do stupid things - not nice new members who talk coherantly and make a good contribution. Sometimes a newbie makes a mistake, and I think that we should help them out. But there are also stupid people who make the mistake of pissing us off, and often they get their asses saved by moderators who close their threads before anyone can really say what they feel and properly tell them off for it. Why do we reward these people for their idiocy? They get to cause all this trouble and get barely anything back except mirth in the knowledge that they're probably causing blood pressure to rise. Either that or they are so clueless that they don't even know what they are doing and need waking up to reality.

To be honest I see their stupidity as an attack on us - they've already cast the first stone, fired the first bullet, shed the first blood. These people are just going to carry on being stupid and having their threads closed unless people show them that they are stupid.

Look at stingbee for example - he should've been banned for his stupidity, but because of our forumwide dissapproval of him he took a hint and left. This kind of stuff DOES work, and we all know it does. It's not undeserved or unfair, it's just life. If you smack someone in the mouth you get a punch back, and that's how you learn not to do it again. Dig?

yes.


I'm in favor of the idea....

If an ignorant member, in all seriousness, makes a thread and it gets closed, he or she will question why, and take a hint. Spot me two or three recent exammples of a member creating a clone thread after the first one was closed, and then we'll talk.

Closing a thread from a serious poster, no matter how illiterate or retarded, is certainly not a reward. And mind you, if there's ever a truly problematic member, they're dealt with. Stop being so edgy/aggressive.

Sorry guys, but I will never flame / discriminate / torture / abuse / harrass any member on the forums. My approach has always been firm but fair discipline. The newer members may be annoying, but that doesn't give you the right to vent your frustration on them.

Jesus people, put yourselves in my shoes. I have to deal with them everyday, as well as take the hate thrown my way for trying to keep the forums sane. Why can't I flame the be-jesus outta them too?

Alcar...

I completely agree with this statement. I am a strong believer of constructive criticism and even sometimes satire (only when absolutely needed, though.), but flaming a member continuously will not solve anything. In fact, it may make certain members do these things (such as spamming) even more out of spite. :/ And besides, I'm sure we've all broken rules before.

Edit: Rich, I know what you mean by 'educating'. When I was referring to 'flaming constantly', I was only referring to when people ridicule or tend to curse at other members non stop. If you want to give them a firm warning about continuously posting the wrong things in the wrong spots, then be my guest. ;)

I'd say what we're proposing is pretty democratic, people can read this thread and think "oh shit, I'd better read the rules". Then they can read the rules and hopefully post in the right place, post coherently, be relevant, ect...

Joining date: Nov 2002 ;)

Grrrrr! How many times, educating is what we shall do! If they post an abe drawing in off-topic, I will calmly tell them that it's in the wrong place and ask them to read the forum descriptions. If they then go on to post a behaviour complaint in the RPG forum, I will mercilessly slaughter them. That isn't flaming, it's educating.

Lol! What abuse, what hate?

"OMG i h8 u u clsed mi tpoic!!!!!!!!!!1111"

The member called Alpha (I think) who kept creating god damned Halo threads outside of the main Halo discussion.

That's the stuff I want.

Anyway, is sligco in the following thread worth of shit-kicking? He constantly uses chatspeak after everyone's told him not to, and his excuse is that he's dumb.

http://www.oddworldforums.net/showth...130#post206130

Bah, you drama queen. Who gets their blood pressure up over something from a forum (unless it's a heated, serious debate)? Let the moderators do their jobs, get your panties out of a bunch, and calm the fuck down.

On a related note, telling someone he or she made a stupid mistake is one thing. The person will usually be aplogetic and learn from that mistake. On the other hand, making someone believe he or she is stupid will do nothing but create a self-fulfilling prophecy. One who believes he or she is stupid will often continue doing stupid things because that is expected.

EDIT: Kimon, there is no rule against chatspeak.

Wise words, but the point is that if a person makes a mistake, the forum members will counsel them. But if the person ignores our counsel and does the same thing again, punishment is in order. While it's true that being told that you're dumb enforces that idea on a person, being dumb with no retribution won't help either. At least with letting a person know they're dumb makes them aware of it.

That's true, but es mucho annoying. And I was mostly referring to his last post. Plus, he kept using it after a mod told him not to.

I never said it was an exact interger. I put the "Or so" in there because I wasn't sure. Fine, 3 or so years.

Jesus.

Anyway, the answer Alcar gave us is obviously a no. And when one of the Forum Admins says "no," it's kind of a pointless move to keep fighting for it.

But you go ahead and keep doing that, it seems like "No" from Alcar isn't enough.

My god, if it's not the spammers, it's these guys who want to play "online bully."

Here we go... the usual "OMG why does it matter? it's just an internet forum on the internet on a computer screen made of pixels" routine. As a person who used to run and admin a forum, I've read it a million times over, and I can safely say it has to be about THE most overused attempt to remove weight or point from the discussion while insinuating that the person that the comment is directed at are retarded/petty/pathetic simply for even having emotions stimulated by a FORUM of all things (As if that's unreasonable), and it almost always never works, if anything it usually just exacerbates the situation and drags whomever makes the comment into a long and bitter argument.

It's clearly rediculous, denying the fact that these stupid people are annoying for the sake of discrediting the validity of a suggestion is utterly pointless, because what you are actually denying is that people derive emotion from a forum. What you are suggesting is that nobody finds idiots to be annoying, and that I am just strange and unacceptable because for some reason I get pissed off in real life when I read some words on a screen formed by pixels. If you think like that then you are not fully aware, or simply in denial, of the psychology, sociology, and community structure of a forum. If your logic held any weight or basis in scientific fact, then it would not be the case that people can get frustrated or even angry at computer games.

You have a discussion with me now, where you appear to be having an emotion in reaction to something that I've said, so by your own logic, why are you doing that if all this is all things done and said is a bunch of pixels forming words on a screen?

It's because that's not all this is, this is not just "a forum" on "the internet", it's a means of communication between people. But even if it wasn't, people are still emotionally stimulated by anything with the potential to emotionally stimulate. After all, books are just ink on paper forming words..but... well I think you get the picture.

Am I being dramatic? I don't think so. I think I'm reacting in a perfectly explicable manner, given that a forum is no different to real life considering that all it is, is just a bunch of people interacting. In a real world situation, if a person acts in a stupid manner, they get a predictable reaction, and it's considered acceptable - when you apply the same reaction to a "less real" scenario such as a forum, for some reason many people find this to be unacceptable or even bizarre behaviour.

But anyway, I've got another point to get to.

Dipstikk, I'm quite suprised that despite the fact you quoted me in your sig as "Dino, on close encounters of the dumbass kind", you pretend to not understand how frustrating these people are, and suggest that we're "cyber bullies". Come on, I know as well as you do that you find these people just as annoying as I do.

I can't emphasise enough to people, that what I am NOT proposing is flaming newbies who make mistakes. I'm proposing that we be allowed to show our discontent for people who continue to behave very stupidly despite constructive helpful advice from members and moderators.

I hate them as much as you, but my views on dealing with them has changed since I posted that quote in my signature. I think that if they cause a problem, it should be dealt with then and ONLY then. I no longer feel the need to brutalize them, though my comments may continue to be harsh. But if they're not doing anything at the moment, it's pointless to humiliate them, especially not to the point of driving them out.

On the subject of the signature quote: It was partially because I thought it was well-worded and funny that I added it to my signature. I had a different opinion of new members then I do now. However, for the sake of preserving that quote, it will stay until I feel the need to remove it for another reason.

Dino, keep in mind that, even if you did serve as an admin on another forum, you are still a new member here. You may not type as poorly as the other new members do, but your actions against them still resemble someone who hasn't quite settled in. Also, if you're trying to make a name for yourself, this is a very poor way to do it.

Edit: Okay, I read the last paragraph again, Dino. I have no problem with showing discontent with repeted mistakes. If that's all that will be taking place, then that would be fine. But only when the problems are occuring.

Why are there so many new forum members trying to over-turn the forums? First the ClaireBear rebellion, now this...

First of all I'd like to state that Dino, you are obviously a eloquent and intelligent poster, as your posts are long and are well written. I am assuming that you [as you are an old forum admin] are telling us of a method that has worked in one of your forums.

However, if this idea was implemented in this forum, you would have alot of angry people having "a go" at you. So, think of the consequences to your actions.

Anyway, onto my opinion. I don't think this is a good idea because the moderating team have been doing their job well for 4 years [or more now] and I have only seen a handful of "Idiots" and they have been dealt with accordingly. If the "Idiot" persists, they are banned.

It's as simple as that, if this idea was implemented, the members would be flaming a banned member. So, this "Idiot" would either, not recieve the messages or not be able to defend themselves. Which is unfair to both poster and reciever.

Also, I think you would find that if this idea was implemented, most forumers wouldn't have anything to do with it, and you would be the only one.

It would also give the forums a harsh atmosphere and would put off any new comers. OWF is a caring community, with alot of sympathetic, empathetic and genuinely nice people posting here everyday. It would be awful if competent, nice newbies were put off joining because of the mistakes of 2 or 3.

Dino, most of your posts seem to be very controversial. And it's good that we have a member, taking an active part in the forum's well being and giving so many new ideas to the admin staff. But, another part of being intelligent [as I said earlier] is knowing when you're beaten and stepping down graciously.

Rexy

I agree with Alcar. I have to put up with annoying peopel at school, and it would be a lot easier to flame at them, but if you want to survive in the real world, then no, you just have to ignore these stupid people and get on with it.

Eh ignoring the n00bs will only make continue their mistakes. By n00b, i mean a member that makes the same mistake again and again, even though he has been informed to to do it.

I somewhat agree with Dino, but i also see the things from Rexy's point of view. I'd say that we should let the new member sttle in at first, so that they can see how things work. If they wont settle in after our rules, and wont understand them even though we keep tell them. Then there's no point of keeping them here, as the only thing they'll do is keep spamming.
Maybe the first 2-4 times they make a mistake, we should be nice to them. But i also think that the moderators should hand out more warnings... Not to little mistakes like a joke or something, that most people will consider spam. But mistakes that are dona again and again.

I was not implying that no emotions are to be put into a forum; I was simply stating there's no reason to get so worked up over the small flaws of a forum. Sure, people who repeatedly make mistakes, spam, etc. are annoying, but that's nothing to get one's blood pressure up too high. Spam and such isn't even a huge problem here in my opinion because the administration and staff do such a good job. When someone does something stupid here, I usually think something to the extent of, "Grr... Idiot, posting such a meaningless comment and spamming... Oh well, he'll be dealt with by the staff eventually." But I certainly don't think anything like, "Idiot! I want to beat the shit out of him for being so stupid! Rawr!" because that would be overreacting.

In comparison to a real life situation, if there is an annoying student in class, I kindly ask him or her to stop, like the members here. If that person continues, I ask them again usually in a harsher tone, also like most members here. If the student still persists, the rational thing to do is seek the teacher for help, like seeking the help of a moderator here. And if the teacher were to do nothing and the situation is extremely bad, I would then contact the principal, like an administrator here. Heh, problems here are taken care of way better than similar problems at school. :|