You know what's good level design?

[STM]

Turning half of Scrabania into a smart phone game. Gotta love repetitive jumping areas.

Seriously, I'm really enjoying the game so far but this bot really kinda got me more frustrated than anyone should be at a game.

[Holy Sock]

I dunno. My problem was that it was difficult to gauge how to jump so those sleeping Sligs wouldn't kill you upon awakening. Jump at the very last moment perhaps? Otherwise I quite liked that bit. I'm in the Temple right now.

[STM]

I didn't mind the sligs, I've never been killed by one, the issue for me was due to the non-grid system, it meant that you could just about clip the edge of the next platform after the jump and you have like a 50/50 chance of making it or slipping off.

[Holy Sock]

Conversely I rarely had a problem with the jumping. Although I think you have to be jumping at the last possible moment to make a lot of them.

[STM]

Yeah, I dunno. It was just in general a bit dull, reminded me of temple run or something of that calibre.

[Nepsotic]

I dunno. My problem was that it was difficult to gauge how to jump so those sleeping Sligs wouldn't kill you upon awakening. Jump at the very last moment perhaps? Otherwise I quite liked that bit. I'm in the Temple right now.

It's actually completely based on chance. Sometimes they kill you, sometimes they don't.

Yeah, one of this game's biggest issues is consistency.

[Job McYossie]

Scrabania was boring to me. I got through it way too fast on my first try and died maybe once or twice to a bad jump.

[Holy Sock]

I guess that comes with the territory of having played the original too many times.

[Shade667]

It's actually completely based on chance. Sometimes they kill you, sometimes they don't.

Yeah, one of this game's biggest issues is consistency.

Thats incorrect.

Its based on positioning.
But because of the non gird system I can understand if thats hard to gauge. When you're doing the level for the thousandth time it becomes consistent. They dont kill me randomly anymore unless I jump too early or late.

I used to think alot of the game was RNG. Even those meat falling in Rupture farms. But everything in the game is either based on a cycle or positioning. Sawblades, enemy movement. The only thing thats a bit random is enemy behaviour once youve triggered them. But again, in sacrabania, even if they shoot as soon as they wake up, if u jump right they wont hit u. Consistency.
Its all about when u jump. They dont hear u when ur in the air. Its really hard to explain how to do it though, u just gotta watch someone else do it and copy until its muscle memory...

[Job McYossie]

Wow shade is actually bringing in some really good insight.
Wow shade is bringing up this information in a very nice, clean, formal, and non-sarcastic way

Why am I telling u guys this u wont play the game more than 3 times anyway...

Nevermind, that was really rude. No one even said anything to you that was attacking you in this thread. Yet for whatever reason you find it necessary to get all edgy and melodramatic with your insult-esque comment ending in the most edgiest of things, ellipsis.

[Shrykull43]

Honestly I don't understand why they moved away from the grid system. That was a big part of the gameplay in the original. What's there to gain by removing it??

[Shade667]

I dunno, im all pissy lately over this game not working...

[Holy Sock]

I imagine, in this day and age, a grid system would have felt a lot less fluid for new players? I big thing about modern platformers is the fluidity of movement. That the player has complete control over his character. If they nudge the analog stick ever so slightly the character should move ever so slightly. I think players would be frustrated otherwise.

I really don't think Oddworld should ever go back to the grid system for future platformers. BUT, and this is a big but, New 'n' Tasty has a few rough edges because they've adapted a game completely based around the grid system.

So far, for the most part, I've had no problems - I think they've adapted it quite well. But there are moments where the game definitely feels like a remake of an outdated gamestyle and it doesn't translate perfectly.

If Oddworld is to work as a modern platformer - and it really can - they'll probably have to rethink a lot of the game design. Since this is a remake of an old game, though, there's only so much you can do. I think they've been largely successful, too.

[Shade667]

Yeah, I can agree with that.I wouldnt still be playing the game if it had the grid system. It didnt feel natural.

[Phylum]

AO was designed around digital input. You press the left or right directional BUTTON and you move a grid space in either direction. These days when literally every console gamer has two analogue sticks under his thumbs it would be silly to not use them. It's just a pity that some things, like slig wake-up radius, needed more polish.

I don't know why they would even have sligs like they do along those elum paths - it's just frustrating. You could remove one or two trouble sligs and the entire section would run much smoother.

[Holy Sock]

Maybe they wanted to make it extra Hard for players like us. Even though we play hard we kind of expect to breeze through it. If it's as precise as Shade says, anyway.

[Manco]

Guys, the PR person from Xbox in the livestream managed to get by those Sligs on her first try. Maybe you’re just bad at the game???

[STM]

Yeah I never had a problem with the sligs at all, it's the jumps that get me. More annoyingly though it's just the actually level design that I was taking issue with, not the ability to makes the jumps.

[Paul]

That Slig jump/kill part had me stuck for a bit, the saw blades suck too. Its not consistent with any other part of the game where run/walking near a slig is insta-death.

[Abeguy]

oddly enough, because it was more like the infinite runners, I ended up having no problems with those levels. It really surprised me. I was thinking "man, I remember it being harder back then"

Just got to look at where you're going, not where you are. I never kept my eyes on elum.

[OWI_Alex]

It's actually completely based on chance. Sometimes they kill you, sometimes they don't.

Yeah, one of this game's biggest issues is consistency.

No it's not.

[Phylum]

Can we maybe get a comment on how it does work, for those of us who still struggle with those sections? Is their sensitivity likely to be tweaked in a patch?

[Shade667]

Its position based.

Sligs wake up based on sound proximity. Sligs dont hear u in the air, so theyll wake up whenever u land or run into their sound proximity.


Just gotta time ur jumps. I havnt died in those sections (unless I fall off the edge) in months. Just treat it like every puzzle in the game. The more you do it the better you get at knowing when to jump.

[OWI_Alex]

Its position based.

Sligs wake up based on sound proximity. Sligs dont hear u in the air, so theyll wake up whenever u land or run into their sound proximity.


Just gotta time ur jumps. I havnt died in those sections (unless I fall off the edge) in months. Just treat it like every puzzle in the game. The more you do it the better you get at knowing when to jump.

This is correct.

[Xavier]

Alex, truely a man of few words.

[Holy Sock]

I think he's just on the verge of pulling out his hair in frustration sometimes.

[Nepsotic]

This is correct.

But surely doing the same thing over and over with different results is inconsistent?
Of course it's not exactly the same, but the differences are so small it may as well be.

[Manco]

The same as doing the same thing over and over in other video games with different results?

[Nepsotic]

Videogames in which random elements don't break puzzles in some cases.

[Manco]

It doesn’t break if you play it right.