Islam

[Varrok]

This is not the religion promoting killing. The religion is just a way for people to justify themselves. They avenge what was done to their homelands (remember Russia and the USA ravaging Middle East), because most Middle Eastern people are hot blooded and highly patriotic. It does not mean, that we have the right to wipe out the whole Middle East, which was the centre of art and culture in Middle Ages.

There are passages in both the Bible and Quran that directly talk about murdering people. You can't deny the facts. Whether people follow it 100% or not, it's still funamentally bad. Also, I never said I want to kill anyone, basically the opposite.

There are terrorists from Georgia in Russia. They are Christian.

I never said Christianity is good. It's not. What's your point?

And one more thing. I talked with many Muslims and they say, that terrorists are neither Sunni, nor Shia, because Sunni and Shia Islamic dogma says that they should not attack any foreigner unless the foreigner attacks them. They say, that their terrorists are their shame and they shall burn in Jehennam (Hell), because what they do is not what Mohammed said.

You can attack people verbally, but that doesn't mean you should kill them in return, which is basically what they did at Charlie Hebdo. They attacked Islam. Verbally. Therefore they needed to be murdered.

[Xorlidyr]

Sunni and Shia dogmas are interpretations of Quran and Hadith. This is what the religion of Islam is. The religion is following the dogma 100%, not the religious book of the religion.

Terrorists are encrazed people, who want revenge and find in Hadith, that it is okay to kill whoever attacked you. ISIS has its own faulty dogma, that interprets it as "Who threatens me, can attack me, therefore may be killed".

In Sunni and Shia verbal/mental/honor attacks are not considered attacks. They are considered indecent, but not attacks. But there are still hateful people who find a reason to kill those, whose countries "hurt" them (remember, the people there are brainwashed by their leaders, that Europe+Russia+the USA want them dead and Islam disappear).

[Vlam]

Isn't he (Xorlidyr) German?

[Varrok]

He's not. He's Ukrainian.

[STM]

Let's not forget, everyone that maybe 0.00006625% of the Muslim population are terrorists. That number includes groups like the KDP and Peshmerga, which are only considered terrorists because the US of A doesn't like them.

There are more Christian terrorists in the world. Fuck, there are more Atheist terrorists in the world.

So don't try to make it a numbers game, because that's an irrelevant argument.

Let's not break this down to "which theology is the worst", either, because it's a stupid argument as well. Theology, and in fact any ideology gives already sadistic people the casus belli they wanted to justify the bad things they do. Islam is not the problem, sadistic individuals are the problem.

[Nepsotic]

Let's not forget, everyone that maybe 0.00006625% of the Muslim population are terrorists.

So? (I'm not even going to go into how that's not even a remotely reliable statistic)

There are more Christian terrorists in the world. Fuck, there are more Atheist terrorists in the world.

Okay, where is your evidence?

Islam is not the problem, sadistic individuals are the problem.

And Islam breeds sadistic individuals.

[EVP_Glukkon]

Let's not forget, everyone that maybe 0.00006625% of the Muslim population are terrorists. .

You are being ridiculous. How can there be only about 1060 extremists when ISIS alone is believed to contain 10-20,000 members.

Your stats don't hold up with reality.

There are more Christian terrorists in the world. Fuck, there are more Atheist terrorists in the world.

Yeah the news is full of Christian and Atheist terrorism, bombings, attacks, all this ISIS stuff is just getting overshadowed, apprently there was a bombing in belgium? Completely overshadowed by Christian Militia's in the US complaining about their rights.

Really STM, how can you expect anyone to take you seriously with these knee-jerk statements.

[Varrok]

1060 000*
It's funny how ISIS is like 2% of those.

[Havoc]

Let's not forget, everyone that maybe 0.00006625% of the Muslim population are terrorists. That number includes groups like the KDP and Peshmerga, which are only considered terrorists because the US of A doesn't like them.

There are more Christian terrorists in the world. Fuck, there are more Atheist terrorists in the world.

So don't try to make it a numbers game, because that's an irrelevant argument.

Let's not break this down to "which theology is the worst", either, because it's a stupid argument as well. Theology, and in fact any ideology gives already sadistic people the casus belli they wanted to justify the bad things they do. Islam is not the problem, sadistic individuals are the problem.

Yeah man, sure is a lot of christian and athiest terrorism going on these days. Almost makes the past 30 years of Islamic based terrorism seem like nothing.

[Varrok]

I have yet to hear of atheist terrorists killing people just because they don't want to be atheists

[Nepsotic]

I remember a story recently about an atheist killing a Muslim in a parking lot. Turns out it was over a parking dispute but the media definitely didn't mention that.

[abe619]

Terrorism should NOT and CANNOT be associated with Islam or ANY religion for that matter, it's purely a human flaw, therefore religion (All religion) is never the reason, it's the tool, the excuse.

Well then what's the reason?

Politics, money and in some cases, just pure sadism for the sake of sadism.

But if honestly you're thinking the media is more biased to defend muslims, then you really REALLY need to check just how much the media has ALWAYS LOVED muslims oh SO SO much.

Yeah, it really shows in how they ignore the fact that ISIS actually kills more Arabs and muslims than other demographics, the problem is that you think Islam is just this one gigantic mass that acts and thinks in unison, you fail to see that it is waves upon waves of highly diverse individuals, just like...let's see...about every other group ever?

[Havoc]

If a religion can be used as an 'excuse' to kill people, that says a LOT about the religion don't you think?

Either way, ISIS is based entirely on Islam. Their entire purpose is to form an ISLAMIC state that lives according to the rules of the Sharia (Islamic Law). So don't say it has nothing to do with Islam, because it has everything to do with Islam in the very core.

[Nepsotic]

Politics, money and in some cases, just pure sadism for the sake of sadism.

A lot of the time it's culture-based xenophobia, too.

But if honestly you're thinking the media is more biased to defend muslims, then you really REALLY need to check just how much the media has ALWAYS LOVED muslims oh SO SO much.

The media (in the UK and US, at least) is divided into the SJW types that defend Islam and then the opposite. I don't give a shit if Muslims kill more eastern people than Caucasians, in fact that makes sense considering they live in the middle east. I'm saying they should just stop killing people all together.

the problem is that you think Islam is just this one gigantic mass that acts and thinks in unison, you fail to see that it is waves upon waves of highly diverse individuals

No, MUSLIMS are a group of highly diverse individuals, ISLAM is a textbook of bad ideas mixed in with some good ones which people who aren't morally corrupt should know anyway.

[abe619]

If a religion can be used as an 'excuse' to kill people, that says a LOT about the religion don't you think?

Either way, ISIS is based entirely on Islam. Their entire purpose is to form an ISLAMIC state that lives according to the rules of the Sharia (Islamic Law). So don't say it has nothing to do with Islam, because it has everything to do with Islam in the very core.

Not it does not, you can use literally anything as an excuse to kill people, the only real purpose behind it would be either something related to some form of political goal or just base sadistic desire.

@Nepsotic: Really? Islam is a textbook now? anyway, for the sake of argument, just what is this supposed really deep knowledge you have of Islam so much? and that is for you too, Havoc...what is this supposed "Core" of Islam?

[Nepsotic]

Well the prophet you love so much was a rapist, paedophile, murderer and thief. That says a lot right there.

[Xorlidyr]

If you really wish to know Islam well, you have to have the profound knowledge of Hadith, which is also a religious book of Islam (and it is not a part of Quran).

And truly, ISIS kills much more Muslims than any other people.

I love Mohammed.

[Nepsotic]

And truly, ISIS kills much more Muslims than any other people.

HOW IS THIS RELEVANT? How is killing Muslims any less bad than killing atheists or Christians?

[Vlam]

Abe619 is doing the Taqiya...

[abe619]

It isn't, it's just as bad, it's relevant because it goes to show that Islam is not the problem, terrorism is, ISIS is.

Also about your earlier post, you know that how exactly?

Edit: Okay someone tie Vlam up, every time he says that I lose my marbles. x'D

[STM]

Varrok, Nepsotic and Havoc (and maybe Vlam, I don't know), let me just pose this question to you, so I know where you stand and so I can get what this sprawling mass is about: what is your issue with Islam?

[Nepsotic]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aisha#...ge_to_Muhammad

Edit: STM, have you been reading this thread at all?

[STM]

I just want it compiled clearly and concisely into one post, call it a recap.

Also just to point out the marriage Muhammad had at the time was not at all uncommon of the period. People lived far shorter lives and women often died in child birth.

[Nepsotic]

Let the others go first, I'm too tired and I had some ritalin. It'll take me a while to write up in a concise way, maybe tomorrow.

[Xorlidyr]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mukhannathun

I wish that people read this.
It shows that even Hadith and Sunnah are not consistently stating the same things.

[Varrok]

It's a religion (and a political system) that promotes bias, spirituality and submission amongst the people, instead of logic, intellect and science.

It's also a highly misogynic system perceiving women as inferior than men. And don't give me the "oh but women are highly respected in Islamic countries", they're so respected that their testimony in court is worth less that a man's is. They can't go whenever they want, they can't dress like they want (if they don't want to wear a huge sheet of clothing covering most of their body) without an overwhelming public ostracism. They get murdered by stoning for being unfaithful for their husbands who can totally beat them up, and they shouldn't do anything about it.

Oh. They have a rule that you can kill homosexuals. And atheists/apostathes. "Oh but they don't do that very often now anyway." Maybe, but if they wanted to, they could. The law they made allows that, as a good thing.

Also just to point out the marriage Muhammad had at the time was not at all uncommon of the period. People lived far shorter lives and women often died in child birth.

Oh yes, underage girls usually die while giving birth. It's also a thing happening in Arab countries, even now. Thanks for the reminder.

[Xorlidyr]

So what do you wish to do with that, Varrok? How could you change the situation without distorting the fragile world peace we have right now?

[Vlam]

STM, you will soon be a dhimmi. Enjoy the time left.

[Varrok]

Promote logic, intellect and science. Maybe that way the smarter part of the people will realize that they believe in hundreds(or even thousands)-years-old books and beliefs that are scientifically inplausible. Hopefuly they won't get killed by their families afterwards.

[Nepsotic]

World peace?

Go out and live a bit Gishy, you're my age and yet your naivety is astounding.