would you kill a human clone? -

Gluk Schmuck · #31 02-24-2002, 09:50 AM

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Originally posted by abe22
Does anyone remember when they cloned that sheep? Dolly was it? I think it was For every normal sheep year Dolly gained like 7 years, or something like that. I think it died very quickly and It was retarted I think.

As far as I know Dolly's still alive but she's got arthritis and sheep as young as her don't usually get arthritis.

I don't know anything about Dolly's brain but I've never heard of her being retarded in any way.

The reason she's not very healthy is because she wasn't cloned very well.

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Originally posted by Fazerina
There's been talking about how good it would be, if you were for example very ill and they could clone some organs to you or stuff.¹ Of course that would be a good thing, but how in hell would that be possible, anyway?² You can't just clone a simple organ.³ Although you would find the right genes to do it, you couldn't keep it alive by itself.⁴ Would they make a whole clone of you and then rip its organs out when you need them?⁵ Well, I must say I don't know anything about how they plan doing this, but it just feels kind of absurd, doesn't it?⁶

1. Very useful, indeed.

2. It's not easy. It's been done, not very well but it's been done. I think a bladder's been made in a lab. Skin has been grown in labs for ages but the skin that they use has been cut off the patient, not cloned.

3. You can!

4. You could!

5. No!

6. Since this particular area of genetic engineering is in its infancy not many people know a lot about it.

Fazerina · #32 02-24-2002, 10:14 AM

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Originally posted by Gluk Schmuck
Skin has been grown in labs for ages but the skin that they use has been cut off the patient, not cloned.

Yeah, I knew about the skin.. And they could use it by testing make up and stuff with it, but no.. they have to torture the poor animals.

Well, I think some companies are testing their products with this skin..

Jacob · #33 02-24-2002, 04:54 PM

I haven't read all of the replies cos i couldn't be bothered...but yes...hell, i would even kill a normal peep if i wanted to!!

ODDBODD · #34 02-26-2002, 02:57 AM

jacob your a real freak

Jacob · #35 02-26-2002, 05:48 PM

Nope...jus' truthful. I have only jus' read some of the stuff...but i wunt kill a clone if they didn't do anything wrong. Cos thats jus' not nice...

Steve · #36 02-26-2002, 07:22 PM

Fazerina, you seem to be confusing nuclear transfer(I learned a new term, wahoo) with genetic engineering, while related to each other they are entirely different. who says designer babies would be for civilian use? it is much more likely that they would be used for colonisation of mars, increased gray matter for research and so on.

Danny · #37 02-26-2002, 08:42 PM

Cloning is nothing to do with Designer Babies. The whole point about Cloning is that the clone is genetically identical to the doner. The point of Designer Babies is to CHANGE the genetic structure. I fail to see where you've got confused here...

Besides, it's wrong to condemn something as wrong just because it could be used for bad purposes. I find it hard to think of anything that couldn't be used for amoral practises, when it comes down to it...

Fazerina · #38 02-27-2002, 04:38 PM

Yeah, Steve.. I know I was talking about a whole different thing and I also said it in my post. I just think they're both wrong.

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Originally posted by Danny
Cloning is nothing to do with Designer Babies. The whole point about Cloning is that the clone is genetically identical to the doner. The point of Designer Babies is to CHANGE the genetic structure. I fail to see where you've got confused here...

Besides, it's wrong to condemn something as wrong just because it could be used for bad purposes. I find it hard to think of anything that couldn't be used for amoral practises, when it comes down to it...

Yes, i know what cloning is. I was talking about changing the genetic structure in my example, yes. But what I meant earlier was not that we're going to plan the perfect babies. I meant that if we're going to clone like great sports men and musicians etc. That's what I meant.

I just think it's wrong that we're doing nature's work. I'm not saying cloning is wrong if we use it on bad purposes. I'm saying that in my opinion it is wrong in any case.

Gluk Schmuck · #39 02-27-2002, 06:33 PM

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Originally posted by Steve
who says designer babies would be for civilian use?

Yeah, we could see Genome Soldiers patrolling the grounds of ruthless terrorists' facilities in the near future!
And we could clone the perfect soldier!

*goes off on an MGS tangent*
It's your fault, Steve!

Danny · #40 02-27-2002, 07:39 PM

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Originally posted by Fazerina
I just think it's wrong that we're doing nature's work. I'm not saying cloning is wrong if we use it on bad purposes. I'm saying that in my opinion it is wrong in any case.

So, without making any references to designer babies or other "bad" uses of Genetics, could you say what it is about it that you find repulsive?

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #41 02-27-2002, 10:50 PM

I think killing a clone is awful! Why would you want to make a clone in the first place when he turns out to be bad? That's what I don't get.

ODDBODD · #42 02-28-2002, 08:55 AM

ok say that the clone has killed people before, but only people that are trying to kill it. I still wouldn't kill the bastard because they clone will only rebel because it is scared or insecure

Danny · #43 02-28-2002, 07:21 PM

Nalaka, have you not been listening? Clones are normal people. They are no different to anyone else. Asking whether you'd kill a clone is no different ethically from asking if you would commit murder.

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #44 02-28-2002, 09:07 PM

Have you guys listen to what I said? Why make a clone when it's going to turn out bad?

Steve · #45 02-28-2002, 09:14 PM

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Originally posted by PinkHaired Mudokon CWR
Have you guys listen to what I said? Why make a clone when it's going to turn out bad?

when it will turn bad? it is no more likely to be bad than anyone else. even if it had no soul (so to speak) it would not neccisarily be bad.

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #46 02-28-2002, 09:15 PM

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Originally posted by Steve

when it will turn bad? it is no more likely to be bad than anyone else. even if it had no soul (so to speak) it would not neccisarily be bad.

No like the taking over the universe destroying the human race bad.

ODDBODD · #47 03-01-2002, 08:16 AM

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Originally posted by Danny
Nalaka, have you not been listening? Clones are normal people. They are no different to anyone else. Asking whether you'd kill a clone is no different ethically from asking if you would commit murder.

Clones are human but they are artificial. They aren't considered citizens because the human that was cloned would have taken its spot and the clone will think of itself as the rightful owner of that identity...hense the madness

Gluk Schmuck · #48 03-01-2002, 12:48 PM

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Originally posted by ODDBODD
They aren't considered citizens¹ because the human that was cloned would have taken its spot and the clone will think of itself as the rightful owner of that identity²...hense the madness

1. I know some governments may not let artificially cloned beings have the same rights as the rest of the beings but most governments have more sense than Bush's!

2. You obviously don't understand that when people are cloned a big machine doesn't make an exact copy of a person including memories and accuired phenotypes.
A clone is not going to be the same person as the person they were cloned from!

Doug · #49 03-01-2002, 02:38 PM

Human clones "aren't considered citizens" -- by whom? They don't exist yet, and I sure hope no legislature in the world has wasted its time establishing the legal status of clones.

The thing (person) in real life most closely analogous to a clone is an identical twin. Identical twins are genetically identical because they come from a fertilized egg -- containing a complete set of genetic material -- that divides in two before undergoing further cell division and differentiation. Each has a copy of the same DNA, but they're still two different people.

A clone is (would be) a person, and it is completely absurd to suggest that a clone should be treated under a different set of moral, ethical, or legal standards than any other person.

•[cyrus]• · #50 03-01-2002, 05:08 PM

Even though a clone is living, it's evil

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to create humans. Natuaraly, it is the biggest sin of all!

My uncle once said 'kil the clones--we must kill the clones' as a crack up joke!

IT IS TRUE -CLONES MUST DIE!!!

Mudokon101...

Oddsville · #51 03-01-2002, 06:06 PM

If there where every any clones I doubt that they would be evil. They would probably be more depressed than anything, to know that your not origanal, that you have no real parents or relatives would be awefull. I would think that the clone would commit suicide because there are no solutions for their problems?

Gluk Schmuck · #52 03-01-2002, 06:33 PM

Mudokon101,
Clones are not evil.
What is the biggest sin of all?

Oddsville,
Of course artificial clones aren't original, neither are natural clones. That is no reason to feel depressed. Anyway, they will only be genetically unoriginal they won't be phenotypically unoriginal.
The clones will still be human beings therefore they will have the right to some kind of family even if it's only a foster home or an orphanage.
What problems do these clones have?

Danny · #53 03-01-2002, 09:40 PM

Why is everyone so against Cloning? It's been going on for millenia! Have you ever eaten a Potato? Most of them are cloned. Carrots? Cloned. Strawberries? Cloned...

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #54 03-01-2002, 10:22 PM

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Originally posted by Danny
Why is everyone so against Cloning? It's been going on for millenia! Have you ever eaten a Potato? Most of them are cloned. Carrots? Cloned. Strawberries? Cloned...

What!!? Potatoe? Strawberries? What were you smoking?

Danny · #55 03-01-2002, 10:44 PM

Hash, but that's beside the point.

Strawberries and Potatoes are often grown from cuttings. Plants grown from cuttings share their donors' Genetic Structures, and so are technically Clones.

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #56 03-01-2002, 10:47 PM

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Originally posted by Danny
Hash, but that's beside the point.

Strawberries and Potatoes are often grown from cuttings. Plants grown from cuttings share their donors' Genetic Structures, and so are technically Clones.

Human clones bad I think. Food clones good. Saves world hunger if possible.

Danny · #57 03-01-2002, 10:52 PM

So what (morally) is the difference between Plant Cloning and Human Cloning? Just that one's harder to do?

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #58 03-01-2002, 10:54 PM

Um, you can eat one.... It's not living.

Majic · #59 03-01-2002, 10:59 PM

well, how do you know. we dont know for sure soemthing we havent proven, if brain waves and stuff arent omitted that doesnt mean they dont think. it could be other sort of signal, who knows. nothing has for sure been set down and proven, there technicly is no "100%" because who knows, theres still an eternity to come and what we humans have seen so far will only be a milisecond in the far distant future, there is always an exception.

Danny · #60 03-01-2002, 11:00 PM

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Originally posted by PinkHaired Mudokon CWR
Um, you can eat one.... It's not living.

I refuse to believe you are serious. Has Biology not taught you anything? Did they not tell you what Life was? About MRS NERG? About the fact that PLANTS ARE ALIVE?