Doing an LP of the whole OddBox -

MA · #31 01-27-2011, 09:09 AM

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Using "I have subscribers" as a measurement of quality AND using "well let's see YOU do better" as an argument.

You sure showed him?

well, Metroixer did go and make a tedious ten paragraph fucking analysis on why he thought his LP's were shit, which i though was way overboard. practice what you preach and all that. opinions are like arseholes and all that. he's a fucking dick and all that.

metroixer · #32 01-27-2011, 11:45 AM

Just to say, yes I do let's plays.

I do, however, acknowledge that it is a dumb as hell hobby and those that I have made have there very own issues, and I work to fixing them. Also, when I started let's playing myself, I, too, got ripped apart for how terrible everything I did was. I sucked it up, I learned from it, I'm much better because of it.

So, yeah.

No I won't link them because it would feel like stupid dick waving

also it's funny pissing off people that make bad videos

Manco · #33 01-27-2011, 12:17 PM

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well, Metroixer did go and make a tedious ten paragraph fucking analysis on why he thought his LP's were shit, which i though was way overboard. practice what you preach and all that. opinions are like arseholes and all that. he's a fucking dick and all that.

So if I get served a crap steak in a restaurant, I'm not allowed to complain unless I'm a chef?

skittlesaretasty · #34 01-27-2011, 12:19 PM

MA · #35 01-27-2011, 05:08 PM

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So if I get served a crap steak in a restaurant, I'm not allowed to complain unless I'm a chef?

the fuck are you talking about? that's a totally different scenario. they are being paid to make good food. its their job and responsibility. if they aren't doing their job, they aren't earning their pay and you have every right to punch them in the face.

on the other hand, i don't believe this person is being paid to make LP's. it isn't their job, and they are not responsible for any tantrums people may throw. its something they do out of their own free will, and they do not need to make them to anyone's specifications. if you don't like them, stick it up your arse. if you're going to rip them apart instead of being constructive, be prepared for them to ask for your own amazing shit.

i can't believe i just had to explain that.

metroixer · #36 01-27-2011, 05:56 PM

I was being constructive though? I pointed out several issues:

Watermark
FPS counter on fraps
bad commentary and why it is bad

See, the thing is Xavier says it's always good to have more oddworld on the web. I totally agree with that. Yet, if it's putting oddworld in a bad light, what good is it going to do?

Sure, you're not being paid, but is that an excuse to just put crap on the internet and call it good?

MA · #37 01-27-2011, 06:01 PM

to be honest, i couldn't care less. i'm trying not to drag this out.

metroixer · #38 01-27-2011, 06:03 PM

I'll just drop it by saying:

you're probably better off doing something else

I'll leave now

skittlesaretasty · #39 01-27-2011, 06:23 PM

You were being constructive, but a constructive asshole. Like a construction worker that does cat calls but gets the job done in the end. And the FRAPS counter can't be helped. Or the commentary for that matter, until I get guests.

EDIT: And MA, are you saying they should shove their computers up their asses, or my Let's Plays? Because, the LPs already stink enough, and shit stains won't help.

Manco · #40 01-27-2011, 10:44 PM

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the fuck are you talking about? that's a totally different scenario. they are being paid to make good food. its their job and responsibility. if they aren't doing their job, they aren't earning their pay and you have every right to punch them in the face.

on the other hand, i don't believe this person is being paid to make LP's. it isn't their job, and they are not responsible for any tantrums people may throw. its something they do out of their own free will, and they do not need to make them to anyone's specifications. if you don't like them, stick it up your arse. if you're going to rip them apart instead of being constructive, be prepared for them to ask for your own amazing shit.

i can't believe i just had to explain that.

Being free doesn't excuse bad quality - no, he's not getting paid for it, but he should still be aiming to produce a high quality video series, and learning from criticism is a part of that.

And no matter what, being a critic doesn't require you to be an accomplished expert at what you're criticising.

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You were being constructive, but a constructive asshole. Like a construction worker that does cat calls but gets the job done in the end. And the FRAPS counter can't be helped. Or the commentary for that matter, until I get guests.

Him being an asshole doesn't mean you can ignore him.

You can disable the FRAPS counter.

You shouldn't have to rely on guests to improve your commentary; the core issue is you. Try cutting out unnecessary footage, so you don't end up running out of things to say.

MA · #41 01-28-2011, 03:33 AM

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Being free doesn't excuse bad quality - no, he's not getting paid for it, but he should still be aiming to produce a high quality video series, and learning from criticism is a part of that.

why should he? because you said so? because someone else said so? if you don't like them, fuck off and watch something else. simple. why can't you understand that? are you on a crusade to rid the world of poor LP's? is it your duty? i wasn't even saying that giving criticism is a bad thing, of course it isn't, i was saying ripping apart someone's work and mocking all of the bad points isn't going to help anyone but the most placid of people. i made that pretty clear.

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And no matter what, being a critic doesn't require you to be an accomplished expert at what you're criticising.

i didn't say that anywhere in my post. i said the person you're criticising can ask for your own work if they want, and probably will if you're being an arse about it. i didn't say you have to be an expert at it, or even moderately good. i was being sarcastic when i mentioned the word 'amazing'. obviously that went over your head.

will you shut the fuck up now? please?

Manco · #42 01-28-2011, 04:11 AM

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why should he? because you said so? because someone else said so? if you don't like them, fuck off and watch something else. simple. why can't you understand that? are you on a crusade to rid the world of poor LP's? is it your duty? i wasn't even saying that giving criticism is a bad thing, of course it isn't, i was saying ripping apart someone's work and mocking all of the bad points isn't going to help anyone but the most placid of people. i made that pretty clear.

Oh I'm sorry, I was under the impression that people who are making entertainment for others want their audience to enjoy their shit, otherwise they aren't successful entertainers?

Yes, I am in fact going to "fuck off and watch something else" - my point is that if you're making something that people aren't going to watch, how are you meant to keep an audience? How are you being entertaining?

Ripping a work to pieces isn't going to help anyone who isn't willing to take criticism.

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i didn't say that anywhere in my post. i said the person you're criticising can ask for your own work if they want, and probably will if you're being an arse about it. i didn't say you have to be an expert at it, or even moderately good. i was being sarcastic when i mentioned the word 'amazing'. obviously that went over your head.

I guess I misinterpreted that part. It's still a retarded excuse for refusing criticism though.

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will you shut the fuck up now? please?

I guess I've made my point.

MA · #43 01-28-2011, 09:48 AM

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Oh I'm sorry, I was under the impression that people who are making entertainment for others want their audience to enjoy their shit, otherwise they aren't successful entertainers?

Yes, I am in fact going to "fuck off and watch something else" - my point is that if you're making something that people aren't going to watch, how are you meant to keep an audience? How are you being entertaining?

you know what? i don't like LP's where the player edits out all of the deaths/Game Over's. i don't like speedruns, either. and yet, both of those things aren't exactly uncommon. i find them fucking boring, but someone else may enjoy them. evidently someone does enjoy them otherwise there wouldn't be so many of them. its all a matter of perspective. you can't tell people what they do and don't like. you may not find them 'entertaining', but someone else out there might.

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Ripping a work to pieces isn't going to help anyone who isn't willing to take criticism.

no no, ripping a work to pieces could knock back their confidence. there is a difference between 'ripping someone's work to pieces' and giving constructive criticism.

do you really think that totally ripping into someone's work is going to help them? that they'll actually take your advice while you're pretty much embarrassing them? the hell do you say to people who ask for your opinion on their work?

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I guess I misinterpreted that part. It's still a retarded excuse for refusing criticism though.

can you read my posts correctly? would you like some help? did i fucking say that its an excuse to refuse criticism? no. no i didn't. if anything, showing someone your own work may actually benefit them. do you see the point i'm trying to make here? i'm saying that there is no reason for them to not ask for your own work, its nothing to do with using that as an excuse to refuse criticism. like i just said, it may help them if its any good.

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I guess I've made my point.

that you're a stupid fucking cunt who can't make sense of arguments? yeah. you've well and truly made that point.

skittlesaretasty · #44 01-28-2011, 11:25 AM

It's nice to see that someone is actually defending me for a change. But, this seems to be needless bickering about something that I honestly don't give a shit about. Yes, I am going to listen to Metroixer. Why? Because he was an ass, but I know he is right. I want to be the best LPer possible for me, and that means listening to the nice guys and the dickheads. I now know all of this stuff that I didn't even consider to have an effect on whether an LP is good or bad, because I don't pay attention to them or maybe I don't notice them, but now coming from a viewer that notices every little thing (and some not very little things) I will work to correct them. But thanks for helping, Molluck's Assistant. And thanks OddHunter for making this topic interesting. You both get pie flavored pie. Yummy! Almost as tasty as Skittles.

Manco · #45 01-28-2011, 12:23 PM

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you know what? i don't like LP's where the player edits out all of the deaths/Game Over's. i don't like speedruns, either. and yet, both of those things aren't exactly uncommon. i find them fucking boring, but someone else may enjoy them. evidently someone does enjoy them otherwise there wouldn't be so many of them. its all a matter of perspective. you can't tell people what they do and don't like. you may not find them 'entertaining', but someone else out there might.

Personally I don't enjoy those types of LPs much either, but I recognise that there's a reason behind editing these things out - an LP that's meant to show off the game is supposed to show off the game, not show off multiple deaths and long dull sections.

I understand, different strokes for different folks, but there IS a legitimate reason why employing editing improves an informative LP.

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no no, ripping a work to pieces could knock back their confidence. there is a difference between 'ripping someone's work to pieces' and giving constructive criticism.

do you really think that totally ripping into someone's work is going to help them? that they'll actually take your advice while you're pretty much embarrassing them? the hell do you say to people who ask for your opinion on their work?

Well that's down to interpretation: I personally believe metroixer's criticism was harsh but fair, and it needed to be said. Whether skittles takes that advice is up to him, but throwing a tantrum because someone called you out on your mistakes isn't very mature.

For the record, if someone asks me for criticism, I'll give it. I am kind of a dick about it, but hey. Just the same, I'd take harsh criticism and learn from it.

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can you read my posts correctly? would you like some help? did i fucking say that its an excuse to refuse criticism? no. no i didn't. if anything, showing someone your own work may actually benefit them. do you see the point i'm trying to make here? i'm saying that there is no reason for them to not ask for your own work, its nothing to do with using that as an excuse to refuse criticism. like i just said, it may help them if its any good.

And where did I say you were saying that? Maybe you interpreted it that way, but it was meant as "hey I agree with you, but this thing is pretty dumb".

I was referring to the common practice of using the argument "well let's see YOU do better" as a way of downplaying and ignoring criticism, which is retarded. I was never implying you advocated that.

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that you're a stupid fucking cunt who can't make sense of arguments? yeah. you've well and truly made that point.

Welp.

skittlesaretasty · #46 01-28-2011, 12:49 PM

I thought my last post would stop this, but oh well.

Manco · #47 01-28-2011, 12:52 PM

I just don't like leaving a response in an argument unanswered.

But hey, good for you for taking criticism like a champ. Hope your future LPs are the best they can be.

skittlesaretasty · #48 01-28-2011, 01:20 PM

By the way, I'm streaming at 8 PM eastern, not sure what, but come join if you want! The link will be on my latest video that I'm uploading right now.

MA · #49 01-28-2011, 03:17 PM

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It's nice to see that someone is actually defending me for a change. But, this seems to be needless bickering about something that I honestly don't give a shit about.

let's just make this clear: i'm not defending you. i haven't even watched your LP's or whatever the fuck they are. i just find it profoundly stupid to think that someone taking the piss out of what someone else has done is going to benefit them.

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Well that's down to interpretation: I personally believe metroixer's criticism was harsh but fair, and it needed to be said. Whether skittles takes that advice is up to him, but throwing a tantrum because someone called you out on your mistakes isn't very mature.

it needed to be said. definitely. the end is nigh.

also, the only one that looked like they were throwing a tantrum in the first place was Metroixer. either that or he enjoys making incredibly long-winded statements on why something isn't up to his standards.

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For the record, if someone asks me for criticism, I'll give it. I am kind of a dick about it, but hey. Just the same, I'd take harsh criticism and learn from it.

poor you.

metroixer · #50 01-28-2011, 03:23 PM

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either that or he enjoys making incredibly long-winded statements on why something isn't up to his standards.

I know I said I would leave but I couldn't help but come back and just say this is the truth of it! Also ranting about a bad video never benefited the ranter. except for lp troll videos (aka retsuprae)

Skittles, like I said I'll leave you alone but if you think you need any help getting better you can PM me. I'll be nicer, honest!

MA · #51 01-28-2011, 03:24 PM

shut the fuck up.

metroixer · #52 01-28-2011, 03:32 PM

take it easy!

MA · #53 01-28-2011, 03:33 PM

shut the fuck up.

Manco · #54 01-28-2011, 03:34 PM

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it needed to be said. definitely. the end is nigh.

also, the only one that looked like they were throwing a tantrum in the first place was Metroixer. either that or he enjoys making incredibly long-winded statements on why something isn't up to his standards.

I dunno, metroixer made some harsh criticisms and you leapt to condemn everything he and I said in this thread; I'd say it's you throwing the tantrum, although I can't fathom why.

Case in point:

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shut the fuck up.

MA · #55 01-28-2011, 03:47 PM

i like how you fall over yourself to say "LOOK UR HAVING AH TANTRUM" after i said "fuck it." and stopped making any cohesive arguments.

i kinda got bored of reading your repetitive statements and arguing points i hadn't even made, so now i'm just dicking around. you'd know that if you even had the faintest idea of how we are here. i thought you did, but, well. no.

but really, do you guys ever shut the fuck up?

Manco · #56 01-28-2011, 03:54 PM

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i kinda got bored of reading your repetitive statements and arguing points i hadn't even made, so now i'm just dicking around. you'd know that if you even had the faintest idea of how we are here. i thought you did, but, well. no.

Translation: "all of my arguments got shot down so now I'm gonna shift the goalposts and pretend I was arguing something different the whole time"

Grow the fuck up.

skittlesaretasty · #57 01-28-2011, 04:01 PM

Oooh oooh I wanna add "The fuck up" after a verb, too!

Climb the fuck up.

Manco · #58 01-28-2011, 04:06 PM

Fuck the fuck up.

EDIT: fuck

skittlesaretasty · #59 01-28-2011, 04:19 PM

Shut the fuck you.

MA · #60 01-28-2011, 04:26 PM

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Translation: "all of my arguments got shot down so now I'm gonna shift the goalposts and pretend I was arguing something different the whole time"

Grow the fuck up.

what the fuck? read through my posts. read through yours. connect them and realise that you were making counter-arguments to things that i didn't even fucking say. your argument on a whole basically condensed into a bitchy "this isn't entertaining because i said so. having his LP mocked was a good thing. he will learn from it". bollocks.

and you know when i said "...i'm just dicking around. you'd know that if you even had the faintest idea of how we are here. i thought you did, but, well. no."? well you missed the point, yet again. me saying "shut the fuck up." isn't really me having a tantrum. its me riding past the point of 'caring' whilst flicking the V sign. i've done it a lot of times.

for you to say to me "grow the fuck up" when you only waltzed back in here the other day is a bit of a piss-take. you don't know how things work here, evidently. that's what i was saying before. the fact that you took me saying "shut the fuck up" as me having a tantrum is pretty naïve. i wasn't 'moving the goal posts', because i don't need to. if i'm wrong, i own up to it, but i know i'm not.

now, believe it or not, you socially inept cunt, i don't particularly want to be here arguing about fucking LP's and the basics of manners and constructive criticism any more. we've been doing this shit for two days, it isn't the most interesting topic.