This is just getting stupid!!!! -

Havoc · #31 08-28-2004, 04:11 AM

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your on a ****ing one man crusade for god sake..........

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Many of the mods support it and many old members also support it. The people that are causing the most trouble are members that havent been here long.

I read back when this thing first started... and the members who supported it back then are the same members who are banned right now becouse they don't like it.
Codek, Lucipher, TBM who just got back and a few others.

@ alcar: Dude, you realy are on a one man crusade. I don't see a single mod backing you up. Maybe in the staff forum, but if thats the case their doing the wise thing to keep there mouth shut becouse they might get there ass flamed. In fact I seen some mods (which im not gonna mention before they get banned too) who arnt a big fan of your plan either. They just do as their told.

Jacob · #32 08-28-2004, 04:23 AM

Well, i'm sure when Alcar instates me as Moderator [which he IS going to do] this whole regime will change. And Alcar shall get my backing...oh yes...

To the people who are against the whole instant deletion thing - vote for me to become a Moderator and i'll make sure it never happens. Oh yes...

And to actually add to this post, i'm not fussed either way, since i don't think i do many things that constitute to instantio deletion.

T-nex · #33 08-28-2004, 04:29 AM

So the time has come where the people can't take it anymore. The law enforcement has gone too far. I normally don't stick my nose into these things, But i can't take it anymore. Alcar... You have to loosen up a bit... And find some other solution, becouse this is leading to nowhere. I feel that i can't post what i want in fear of getting a warning. even if it actually does have to do something with the topic... I still don't post. And i've seen people get warnings for the most ridiculous things.
I know that this has been said many times but... The forums is getting boring, not being able to pull of a joke. But then again, if you want to pull of a joke, make sure you also have something on topic to say. But still... It's a ridiculous thing to get a warning for... And banning... Oh yeah.... the horror... People get banned for NOTHING! MAybe instead they should have got a warning. Yes.
But thats my opinion.
Now vote, and come with an oppinion, lets see where this is leading to.

THE REVOLUTION IS ON ITS WAY!

Havoc · #34 08-28-2004, 04:36 AM

Your right T-Nex. This has gone far enough. We are trying to reason with alcar for ages now.
Don't wanna listen? Suits me fine, just face the penalty.

the brew master · #35 08-28-2004, 04:44 AM

well im with you two in this idea.......i for one was thinking of making a thread like this but then i had the fear of getting a warning for just breathing on the ****ing monitor..........and i think your one man crusade is coming to an end so drop your sword mister knight in shining armour..............VIVA LA REVALUTION(**** i cant spell)

Havoc · #36 08-28-2004, 04:47 AM

LOL @ TBM!

Oh shit... lets make this something usefull to the topic... I don't want to get a warning...

VIVA LA REVOLUTION!

Havoc · #37 08-28-2004, 04:49 AM

^^^ What he said ^^^

***Wil*** · #38 08-28-2004, 04:52 AM

If there's one thing that's gone too far, it's this pathetic idea of a revolution. I don't see why you have to have these little delusions when there are topics created to help accomodate for your wishes for an altered system. My serious advice is that you grow up and stop jading your own cause with over-the-top conflict.

Havoc · #39 08-28-2004, 04:59 AM

This topic is meant to get a clear reading on what the members here want. If this poll turns out that everyone hates this thing, then we take trust in Alcar he listens to the members and remove's it. If you like these stupid rule's, Max, then let us know by your vote. He who doesn't vote has no right of talking IMO...

***Wil*** · #40 08-28-2004, 05:13 AM

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Alcar, there is an old saying that goes "If it aint broke, dont fix it"

I think the forums were going just fine untill the law enforcement. It was not needed, and because of it I can see the forums slowly seperating once again.

That’s your opinion, and while respected, respect also mine, that being that I disagree. It was an increase in complaints about the state of the Forums that incited the Rule Enforcement.

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Just put things back the way they were, I know it wasnt perfect, but we got by just fine.

But this is how the Forums were policed before the mods started dozing off. Use that as an argument against us if you wish, but it’s true nonetheless.

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@ alcar: Dude, you realy are on a one man crusade. I don't see a single mod backing you up.

The large swathes of pettiness have discouraged me from being so blunt, and since the spoken support of other members seems to be ignored by you, I don’t expect much notice will be taken of this either, but for all it’s worth, I back Alcar up on that. And I’ll run around tittering to everyone else who does too if it’ll prevent such obviously incorrect statements as that.

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And to actually add to this post, i'm not fussed either way, since i don't think i do many things that constitute to instantio deletion.

Not a knock at Jacob here, but everyone. Get it right: there is no instant deletion. Doesn’t the very name of ‘warnings’ make that clear?

This is really sad, and your foul ways is a prime example of why people were complaining about the state of affairs here in the first place. The only difference now is that you are being egregious for a cause. Your attitudes remain disturbing.

Al the Glukkon · #41 08-28-2004, 05:13 AM

I agree I could hav put up with it but they closed the spam topic. I'll probably get a warning but VIVA LA REVOLOOTION

the brew master · #42 08-28-2004, 05:16 AM

thx for joining the cause Al.........and Max this topic isnt an over the top conflict this thread its to get peoples opionion about this new rules enforcement stuff.........and there is no reason for it to be closed or moved.........are you scared of what people will say?

***Wil*** · #43 08-28-2004, 05:18 AM

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OMG! IT*S THE BEST THINGE EVER

That's really mature. But seeing as the opposite end of the spectrum is just as much of a piss-take (I seriously hope), I won't pretend to be insulted.

ADDENDUM:

Scared of what people will say? You seem to be assuming that I don't recognise that Forums are a place of public discussion and opinion. The idea of getting everyone's opinions is decent, but flawed in that I know people have been repelled from this particular Forum because of your exaggerated ideas (as proved by the fact that you don't consider the concept of revolution a piss-take as I had imagined), and so will not vote. It also somewhat seems to me that you're assuming we can't judge your opinions from other threads, but correct me if I'm wrong, please.

And who even mentioned anything about closing this? Is your fever so terrible that you need to make up accusations against me?

***Alcar*** · #44 08-28-2004, 05:19 AM

We have a number of threads already similar to this one. If you have things to suggest, post them in the appropriate threads that have already been posted. There is no need to create, yet-another-thread on this matter.

Alcar...

Havoc · #45 08-28-2004, 05:57 AM

She made this into a new thread so she could add a poll, thats why.

Cyber-Slig · #46 08-28-2004, 06:27 AM

.Im with u guys..And joshy it is'nt just the new members who are opposed to the rules.Havoc etc who have been here for a year despise it.To avoid a warning I won't shout Viva la revolution but just so you guys know I am with ya.This is way too harsh.Alcar you are a teen yourself are you not? You don't act like all the rest because you have a different attitude than nearly everyone. You can't change thier attitudes with these rules. I ain't gonna join the revolution and flame etc I wan't this fixed.This debate has been going on for nearly 3 weeks and you have'nt took anyones advice.Not even abe babe's........

T-nex · #47 08-28-2004, 06:31 AM

Cyber-slig.... TBM actually spammed alot... He kinda deserved it... But still... I think it's a pity, that he got banned AGAIN.

Cyber-Slig · #48 08-28-2004, 06:33 AM

Yeah but could he spam in 10 minutes? He only got back in 20 minutes ago....

***Alcar*** · #49 08-28-2004, 06:40 AM

Cyber-Slig, yes I am a teen. I was, and still am to a degree affected by teenage angst, and the like. I know what it felt like. I've been on childish crusades such as these. Point being, I've matured. As for taking into consideration Abe Babe's suggestions: She suggested we tone it down a bit, as I explained, I have done so. She also suggested a different tallying for warnings system. I said I'd get to speak to her about it when I have some free time, and when she is next online.

And yes, BM could spam in less than ten minutes:

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wow.....if i actully believed any of that bullshit then maybe i'd vote for you..........

Can you see what I mean? Nothing to do with the thread. Not only that, it was a chit-chat / idle discussion post directed at a single member, which furthered the conversation in no way.

Alcar...

Cyber-Slig · #50 08-28-2004, 06:47 AM

I see.I never saw that.But like you said you did take time to mature to forums. Some members have never joined a forum before. Others join forums with different rules. It can be tough. At the same time I think the enforcement is right and wrong.I really did'nt like DI constantly annoying me.But an instant warning is too harsh.Most are unfair.Nearly everyone thinks most are unfair.You should take into consideration ''Was he/she the only one who spammed?'' . In the please help thread Others spammed too and got away with it.I was the only one with a warning.I think that's pretty unfair.But most things which are Off-topic people would like to hear it.It happens in old threads which is why ya close it.Juts cut down on warnings but keep the enforcement dude.Much less warnings would help.If something is horribly off-topic delete it.If someone is flaming another person pretty horribly all the time that deserves a warning.If you delete someones post and they swear at you etc that deserves a warning.Warnings are for harsh things not simple chit chat.

Jacob · #51 08-28-2004, 12:18 PM

Okay, so if there is no instant deletion thing, i don't get why every pre-pubesant being on the forum is suddenly screaming out for Alcar to calm down and stop being so harsh.

Okay, so sure, i should have read the rules but i didn't and i won't since, thus far, i am actually capable of not being a c*nt, which seems to be failing other members who HAVE read the rules and are longing to either break or change them.

So, to sum up, the people wanting stuff to be changed should calm down. Yes. I would put more but until somebody briefs me on the situation i don't know what else to put.

Majic · #52 08-28-2004, 06:40 PM

I believe that further discussion on the matter of the crackdown should bekept into a single thread. In this case, the "Rules Enforcement Scheme". This is for ease of replying, and keeping track of what, where and when you posted something.

T-nex · #53 08-29-2004, 03:04 AM

Vut this is the only thread thats got a Poll... I made the poll, so we could see how many was with or against this Law thingy...

Majic · #54 08-29-2004, 05:16 AM

And people have voted. It's evident, pretty mcuh, that most people are either all the way for or all the way against it. The poll itself doesn't serve much purpose anymore. Besides, trying to associate hard numbers to this situation is a bit silly.

Rex Tirano · #55 08-29-2004, 07:06 AM

Righteos... I know this should be put in the R/E thread, but I would just like to put my opinion into the thread before everyone moves back. (Gosh. I'm so lazy!) This is my opinion and what I think has happened. It'll be wrong though.

I do not think that the rules enforcement was a bad idea or a good idea. The staff did become lax, and by the time they noticed this there was more spam than there was a few weeks before. So they all got together in a group hug and decided what they believed was best for the forums (or so I believe anyway. It's much nicer to think like that. ^_^)

New members have obviously conformed (most of them) to these rules, and don't mind because the staff have fully explained the situation. The older members (mostly) don't mind, I'm not sure why. But it's a good idea to have a crackdown, just to make sure before, during and after the Stranger period the forums are more manageable. Also, the staff don't get as stressed with certain forumers and have a little vendetta ^_^. The forum (hopefully if allowed to mature) will become a nicer place to post, and a more wholesome (sounds like an advert now >_<) forum to visit. The forumers will benefit from more varied and enjoyable discussions, and everyone will dance around happily.

However, the crackdown was a bad idea due to many different things. The way it was brought about was done to harshly; it felt like a dictatorship was being produced (those of you who remember Syd...). This obviously made some forumers feel violated, as if their freedom of speech was being ripped from them. It could have been presented in a nicer way (but then it might not have been taken seriously). So the "Revolution" was made...

The revolution again was neither bad nor good. Like the staff, the forumers got in a big group hug and decided enough was enough! And they made a squad of R/E bashers.

It was a good idea as it got ideas, thoughts and opinions to the staff openly and quickly. Which meant there was room for discussion and change. Due to this (I think.) the R/E wasn't as harsh as it had once appeared to be. The spam thread was restored and everything was well in the oddworld kingdom.

It was a bad idea, because all of the staff that support the R/E got stressed. They handed out warning, and the forumers tried to change the minds which made the staff get even more stressed. Several members have left due to this.

My opinion is to just let the staff keep with their regime. I'm not saying I'm a huge fan, but I believe it was needed. (The fact that Alcar has never ever done anything to jeopardise the forums also helps with what I think.) I think there should be some sort of trial, say 2 months or so. Where the members post normally, and if the rules seem to work they are kept. (If not then the staff and forumers will surely create a new idea ^_^)

As for banned members and deleted posts... Members will be allowed back. Posts were deleted according to the rules and people should stop jumping around. The rules on bans and deletion have been in effect since... Well long before I even joined (which was a few years ago).

*Runs away incase of flame*

Adder · #56 08-29-2004, 08:37 AM

A revolution is never a good idea!
All it does is justify both side's belief of why they had to act, while not bothering to solve the problem.

The poll isn't fair, since only 16 people have voted. You will NEVER get ALL users to post, so it's not accurate. Of those 16, it's a 50/50 slip for and against.

The rules are just that. RULES! If you can't follow them (even if they are, in your mind, too strict) why are you complaining about them?
It's like complaining about not being able to pick up the ball in soccar!

Unless the rule is UNFAIR, so that it's IMPOSSIBLE to follow you have to get used to it.
If you can't, don't try to stay here. You'll only get in trouble.

Once again, this is my opinion. It's not the truth, or influenced by anything other than my thoughts.

Havoc · #57 09-02-2004, 06:16 PM

Its not so much that these rule's can't be followed. Ofcourse everyone can read back their post to decide it has spam content which might get them banned by Alcar, ofcourse we can always stay on topic and let it die after 10 posts becouse we can't repeat things that have already been said... (hey, that would be spamming right Alcar?).

Im sure most members are perfectly mature to follow rule's like that. I know I am.
The problem everyone has: This is a forum about a game! A gameing forum attracts teenagers making this a teenage forum. A teenage forum is supposed to be a place for ppl to have fun! Not keeping them self to rules set up by someone who is not much older then themselfs.

When do you ppl get that this place aint just to chit chat about Oddworld and the topics in Off Topic? This is a place where ppl have made friends and like to express that friendship tordwards each other by just having fun like any teenager would want to do.
And the fact that Alcar feels older then he actualy is, thats his problem (or advantage, however you want to look at it). He doesn't need to take that out on us. If he wants to run a forum that only has topics that stay on topic, be my guest to be admin on some forum for 40+ gold geeks. But as long as Alcar is running the show here, he has to accept the fact that this aint a 40+ golf geek forum. This is a teenage forum, and everything that come's with it.

C'mon Alcar. When you in school, and your talking about cars or something, and someone make's a fast remark inbetween: "Hey, did you know that girl has that boy?"
Do you also go all crazy like: Hey! That not the subject! Talk about cars or go away and come back some other time!

I take it you don't... so don't do it here either.

***Alcar*** · #58 09-03-2004, 04:38 PM

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Im sure most members are perfectly mature to follow rule's like that. I know I am.
The problem everyone has: This is a forum about a game! A gameing forum attracts teenagers making this a teenage forum. A teenage forum is supposed to be a place for ppl to have fun! Not keeping them self to rules set up by someone who is not much older then themselfs.

When do you ppl get that this place aint just to chit chat about Oddworld and the topics in Off Topic? This is a place where ppl have made friends and like to express that friendship tordwards each other by just having fun like any teenager would want to do.
And the fact that Alcar feels older then he actualy is, thats his problem (or advantage, however you want to look at it). He doesn't need to take that out on us. If he wants to run a forum that only has topics that stay on topic, be my guest to be admin on some forum for 40+ gold geeks. But as long as Alcar is running the show here, he has to accept the fact that this aint a 40+ golf geek forum. This is a teenage forum, and everything that come's with it.

If the members are mature enough to follow the rules, then why do they not do it? People can still have friends and express opinions. Just not in the form of spam. If you can't express your feelings in a composed manner, don't at all. I don't really feel older than I really am, everyone else is just immature

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C'mon Alcar. When you in school, and your talking about cars or something, and someone make's a fast remark inbetween: "Hey, did you know that girl has that boy?"
Do you also go all crazy like: Hey! That not the subject! Talk about cars or go away and come back some other time!

I take it you don't... so don't do it here either.

Actually, I have no interest in cars, and before you suggest weapons, I have no interest in that either. And my friends know that. Because I've mentioned my dis-interested so many times. But that isn't the point. We eliminate such off-topic / digresse posts because they lead to spam, and the actual post is usually spam.

Alcar...

Havoc · #59 09-03-2004, 05:18 PM

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If the members are mature enough to follow the rules, then why do they not do it? People can still have friends and express opinions. Just not in the form of spam.

You see, thats another big part of it. In your opinion, spam is everything that goes one letter of topic, if you would just loosen up a little with the spam the entire mess would be cleared out.

Would saying hello to someone in the middle of a topic count as spam? Like for instance when that persone just came back from vacation or something? (just to stick to my example in the other topic)

***Alcar*** · #60 09-03-2004, 06:00 PM

You can say hello. As long as you post something that is contributing to the thread. Such as:

"Welcome back mate!

Now, about the topic at hand. Blah Blah Blah Blah, something to do with the topic."

A simple welcome back IS spam.

Alcar...