We quickly tire of discussing imported television

[Manco]

I read about it too. Turns out that it was a last minute thing because they found out that they got cancelled, and needed to wrap up the show. It still seemed pretty dumb.

They actually had the ending planned out to begin with, and rushed to use it when they got cancelled. (Quote contains spoilers)

No, I can understand that. I think that is a natural reaction, because American television is structured in such a way that there are so many episodes, they throw endless red herrings in.

They're not even red herrings. I think they want to tie them up, they just don't know how to.

I've been on the inside of that, working with Life On Mars on the American remake. Those guys were all about, "Oh, we loved your show, but we were very disappointed by the last episode, because it turned out that he really was in a coma." And I said, "Well, yeah. We know he was in a coma, because in episode one we saw him get knocked down by a car." But they said, "We've got something even cooler."

And I said, "Guys, it's not about throwing something at you that you cannot possibly imagine." That's not good drama. I can do that. Everyone can do that. I can get to the end of a Doctor Who episode and say, "Guess what? Amy's a cyberman." And it's a surprise, because you wouldn't have guessed it. But the reason you wouldn't have guessed it was that it was irrational and stupid.

And, of course, that's what they did with Life On Mars, where they said they're all on a spaceship, going to Mars. It was farcical. They thought that they were being cleverer than their own show.

Did they get in touch after the episode aired?
I did e-mail them and say, "Sorry your show got cancelled. What did you make of the ending?" And they came back and said, "Yeah, okay. Maybe that was wrong."

[OANST]

Oh, well, the whole show being a coma hallucination is fucking stupid, too. Just lost all respect for both versions.

[Manco]

It makes sense in context? I dunno why you’d write it off so quickly without trying it first.

[OANST]

I'm not writing off the entirety of the show, but yeah, that's a fucking stupid ending. Tell a story, not a years long dream sequence that maintains continuity.

And no, him being in a coma doesn't actually make sense in any context. Dreams do not make linear sense. There is no way that he would have a dream that felt like being alive for a couple of years, maintaining relationships within it. That makes about as much as sense as, well, as him being from Mars.

[Holy Sock]

May not be realistic in any way bu the conceit worked very well in the show, I think. And the coma pay off, in the ending, was pretty good I think - even if the wee epilogue was a little cheesy.

[OANST]

But, and hear me out here, you don't get to criticize someone's ending for being stupid, and farcical when your ending is stupid, and farcical.

Whether it worked as a conceit or not is debatable. What isn't debatable is the fact that it makes no sense.

[Connell]

I liked the way in the end of the UK version he elects to jump of a building and go back into the coma, leaving the world of 2006 behind. It's almost like it becomes an addiction to him, better than reality. I don't think the American version really has that pay off, I can't imagine having him step out onto the fucking surface of fucking Mars would have the same impact emphasizing the emotional connection he made to the people he met in 1973.

I agree with Holy Sock that it works within the narrative of the show, even if it isn't an accurate representation of what people experience when in a coma. If you have a problem with that and don't question other aspects, like the entire premise of him being back in time, then it's not really worth watching it, or any fiction whatsoever. Suspension of disbelief.

Edit: I honestly think if you'd seen the series you'd be suitably happy with the way things are tied up. It feels extremely right.

[OANST]

I can promise you that I will never be happy with any show that ends by saying "GOT YOU! IT WAS ALL A DREAM! AREN'T WE CLEVER?" The only reason suspension of disbelief comes into the conversation is because the creator was bitching, saying that the new ending "beggars belief" while his own ending BEGGARS FUCKING BELIEF. I would probably be fine suspending disbelief for this ending. I would still think it was a cop out, and fucking stupid.

[Connell]

I can promise you that I will never be happy with any show that ends by saying "GOT YOU! IT WAS ALL A DREAM! AREN'T WE CLEVER?"

The difference is I don't think there is any attempt to deceive you into thinking what he is experiencing is reality. I don't feel like a cheap trick or a cop-out. It doesn't come out of nowhere, like it's a possibility from the off. Like the creator said, it's fairly obvious as you see him get hit by a car. And it doesn't even come last minute. He's aware he's in a coma from the first episode of series 2. He see's doctors and medics. It's about him trying to find a way back. And when he gets there, he doesn't want to be there. So in the end he kills himself to live in 1973 forever. It's beautifully tragic.

[Manco]

Really I think you’re judging the show’s plot on the wrong criteria. It isn’t some copout that he’s in a coma; you see his life in the modern world in the first episode, see him hit by the car that sends him into his coma, and then the central conceit of the show is Sam trying to wake up from his coma while struggling to adapt to his new life and the world and people he doesn’t think are real – and growing increasingly attached to them, and sometimes wondering if his old life isn‘t the real hallucination.

The show plays with Sam’s perception of reality, but it doesn’t try to hide some kind of twist.

[OANST]

Yeah.... I wouldn't like this show.

It's like the last season of Roseanne, but makes less literal sense. And I hated the last season of Roseanne.

[Connell]

The show plays with Sam’s perception of reality, but it doesn’t try to hide some kind of twist.

Exactly, whereas the US version does go HA LOOK THEY'RE ALL MARS COZ OF THE NAME OF THE SHOW LOLOL BET YA DIDN'T SEE THAT COMING.

I think the creator has a fair criticism.

[Manco]

Yeah.... I wouldn't like this show.

Hey, never know til you try.

[OANST]

Watch the American version. Maybe it's good. You'll never know until you try.

p.s. I don't think it is, but there is no good excuse for "It was all a dream." None. Not one.

[Holy Sock]

I think the important thing though, as they've said, that it doesn't feel like a spit in the face. That everything you watched was meaningless because it was a part of Sam's coma. A part of that is that it's not a sudden twist ending like in Roseanne or Dallas or whatever. It may sound like a cheat, or a stupid idea, on paper but personally it still felt like the time you spent with those characters and their relationships were meaningful and not a waste of 16 episodes.

[OANST]

Oh, and guess what. The ending of the American version was a dream too.

You aren't going to convince me that it was good.

[Holy Sock]

Well I think it worked very well for the show. All I can say is that I didn't feel betrayed by the concept and it didn't come across as a cheap twist to me personally.

[Manco]

Watch the American version. Maybe it's good. You'll never know until you try.

I have heard it was decent up until the ending, interestingly enough.

p.s. I don't think it is, but there is no good excuse for "It was all a dream." None. Not one.

I think you’re unfairly writing off a good show. It builds the coma into the plot and it’s a central driving point of the story, it’s the exact opposite of a twist ending. “It was all a dream” is often used as a lazy twist, but it isn’t used in that way here.

[MeechMunchie]

I don't think it can be called a twist at all, if it's been an obvious part of the story from episode one. I mean, the last clip I watched was literally him hearing someone talking into his unconscious ear, while he sat there in comaland, completely understanding of what it meant.

There is no good excuse for "It was all a dream." None. Not one.

What's your opinion on Donnie Darko?

[Crashpunk]

Life on Mars and Ashes to Ashes are both fantastic, unique shows which leaves you with so much mystery and wanting more. Philip Glenister was perfect as Gene Hunt and the highlight for the whole thing for me. He really added to the setting.

Perhaps it's too British. And that's probably why I love it. But I really do ensure you that the series is great.

[OANST]

What's your opinion on Donnie Darko?

Donnie Darko was not a dream!

[Bullet Magnet]

Actually I don't think it is a dream. It seems to be a place where police go when they're seriously injured and lose consciousness. Sam is not the only modern cop there, and it's the same "reality" for everyone.

[Holy Sock]

It's been a long while since I've seen it but what other cop was in the 70s reality?

[OANST]

Actually I don't think it is a dream. It seems to be a place where police go when they're seriously injured and lose consciousness. Sam is not the only modern cop there, and it's the same "reality" for everyone.

I like that a lot better.

[Wings of Fire]

Don't say I didn't warn you.

PS: Ricky Gervais is shit.

[Mac Sirloin]

doctor who has never been good and I don't understand why otherwise intelligent people like it

you can't use the excuse that it's campy fun, either. Most of the time it feels dire and claustrophobic. I hate doctor who so much

[STM]

I dunno man, I loved the first and second Doctors. The old cybermen with their marigold gloves and spray painted jack boots were just amazing.

[Crashpunk]

Dr. Who is a odd show indeed. I really like it, and I get into the series. But at the same time I know it's pretty dire.

[Bullet Magnet]

It's been a long while since I've seen it but what other cop was in the 70s reality?

We didn't meet any confirmed until Ashes to Ashes, when it had caught up with the 80s.

[Holy Sock]

Ah right, didn't watch Ashes to Ashes. But from what I remember wasn't an important part of Life on Mars the female lead being confronted with this idea that she was only in Sam's mind? Haven't seen it since it aired.