Should Homosexual Couples Be Able To Adopt?

[Bullet Magnet]

This thread isn't about whether homosexuality is right or wrong, or about Christianity and Bitter, it's about letting homosexuals taking up the slack and raising the children no one else wants to.

[Nate]

I happen to know the answer to that one, although it's not a very smart one...
Apparently everyone has free will, and even though science has proven that homosexuality is genetic and a feeling you don't suppress so easy, the church just threw it out the window and holds a firm stance that it's a choice. The idea being that any true follower would not chose to be gay despite their desires.

There are some that say that, yes. But I believe the *modern* Christian viewpoint is that people may be born gay as a test and they must prove themselves by remaining celibate.

How the hell did I end up as the defender of the Christian faith?!

Nate- I have already answered this but I will do it again. The areas of Leviticus that you are speaking of are not attributed to God directly. They do not say that "and God proclaimed that such and such". Although that is implied so I understand how anyone could be taken aback by that.

Time to go back to your books, mister:

Lev 11:1 And the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying,
Lev 11:2 Speak ye to the sons of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat of all beasts that are upon the earth.
Lev 11:3 Every beast parting the hoof and making divisions of two claws, and chewing the cud among beasts, these ye shall eat.
Lev 11:4 But of these ye shall not eat, of those that chew the cud, and of those that part the hoofs, and divide claws; the camel, because it chews the cud, but does not divide the hoof, this is unclean to you.
Lev 11:5 And the rabbit, because it chews the cud, but does not divide the hoof, this is unclean to you.
Lev 11:6 And the hare, because it does not chew the cud, and does not divide the hoof, this is unclean to you.
Lev 11:7 And the swine, because this animal divides the hoof, and makes claws of the hoof, and it does not chew the cud, is unclean to you.
Lev 11:8 Ye shall not eat of their flesh, and ye shall not touch their carcases; these are unclean to you.
Lev 11:9 And these are what ye shall eat of all that are in the waters: all things that have fins and scales in the waters, and in the seas, and in the brooks, these ye shall eat.
Lev 11:10 And all things which have not fins or scales in the water, or in the seas, and in the brooks, of all which the waters produce, and of every soul living in the water, are an abomination; and they shall be abominations to you.

[Bitter Buffalo]

Yes, but it does not speak of it being a killing offense. That is what I was talking about.

[snuzi]

You think that saying I don't have the capacity for original thought isn't tantamount to stupidity? We must have different ideas of what the word means. And anyway, you are making assumptions about me based on people you have met who belong to the same religion as I do. I would have to say that this is not an original thought. You should judge me based on what I do. Not by what you think I might do.

Again, I didn't say that you don't have any original thoughts in your head. You just tend to think with your bible rather than with your noggin is all.

I am judging you based on what you're doing. You're acting like all the other Christians that came before you. Every example of why homosexuality is supposedly a sin comes from the bible, and not from your own personal standpoint. You all tend to do that, as you have no personal opinions that could possibly support some of the things that are said in the bible.

Homosexuality is considered a sin. But so is smoking as we are supposed to treat our bodies like a temple and not put harmfull substances in it. Do you think I demonize smokers? No. They are just people who are doing something that isn't good for them. I am not making the argument that being a homosexual defines a person completely. There are many more aspects to a person than their sexual preferance. You seem to think that everything is black and white. Or you think that I think everything is black and white. I'm nonchalant about it because it is merely one sin amongst a cornucopia of sins. I don't apply the stigma to it that you think I do.

So, would drinking be considered a sin as well? Because, if we got by your logic, it also does harm to our bodies. More damage than smoking, in fact. If drinking is indeed a sin, then why does the bible suggest that we do so? Wouldn't that contradict what the bible said, and suggest that perhaps other things could also be contradicted? Like, homosexuality, perhaps?

And are you implying that homosexuals are also "doing something that is abd for them"? because if you are, that's rubbish. Their sexual preference is not their choice. It's instinct, and evidence suggests that people are just born that way.

Last thing. Let's say someone who belonged to your religion was faithful, and was a genuinely good person, but turned out to be gay. Would they immediately be destined to go to hell when they died, simply because of such an insignificant detail as sexual preference?

This thread isn't about whether homosexuality is right or wrong, or about Christianity and Bitter, it's about letting homosexuals taking up the slack and raising the children no one else wants to.

I know it is, but Bitter turned it into a thread about whether homosexuality is right or wrong in the first place, which still relates to the topic .

Lev 11:10 And all things which have not fins or scales in the water, or in the seas, and in the brooks, of all which the waters produce, and of every soul living in the water, are an abomination; and they shall be abominations to you.

This one's my favorite. Baically, we're all abominations if we don't go along with the Christian faith. Priceless.

[Bitter Buffalo]

Yes, drinking is bad for you as well. Which technically makes it a sin. You aren't going to name off everything that's bad for you and ask if it's a sin, are you? I mean, I only gave one example because I didn't think I would need to clarify that deeply.

And yes, being a homosexual is bad for. If aids isn't proof of that then I don't know what is. But I'm not saying that people aren't born with that predisposition. They merely need to fight it.

Lastly, you completely nmisunderstood that verse.

[Bullet Magnet]

AIDS is found in all peoples. It was only first discovered spreading through the gay community. And honestly, that is because they weren't sleeping with anyone else.

[Havoc]

Aids isn't directly linked to homosexuality... It's a sexual decease and in the 60 using a condom was uncool and gay parties were underground back then so add the two together and you have an STD festival.

Havoc

[Bitter Buffalo]

I know that other people get it as well but most gay people have aids so I'd say that it is pretty dangerous.

[Bullet Magnet]

most gay people have aids

Take that back before you are flamed worse than Gollum in Mount Doom.

[Havoc]

Oops to late...

Bitter, you twat... that's the most ignorant statement I've ever heard around here. Not to mention that it's major bullshit. Smacktard...

Havoc

[Bitter Buffalo]

But Millions of homosexuals die every day of this horrible disease.

[Havoc]

Where the f*ck are you getting your info from? More people are dying in Africa from aids in case you don't know...

HAvoc

[Bitter Buffalo]

Cause ther teh gays.

Look, it was a joke. You were all acting like that's what I talk like so I decided to give you what you wanted. I thought it would be funny. Turned out it was.

[snuzi]

Yes, drinking is bad for you as well. Which technically makes it a sin. You aren't going to name off everything that's bad for you and ask if it's a sin, are you? I mean, I only gave one example because I didn't think I would need to clarify that deeply.

And yes, being a homosexual is bad for. If aids isn't proof of that then I don't know what is. But I'm not saying that people aren't born with that predisposition. They merely need to fight it.

Lastly, you completely nmisunderstood that verse.

If drinking is a sin, then the bible promotes sinning, as you're supposed to drink "the blood of Christ".

AIDS isn't just found in gays, ya schmuck. Nor was AIDS started by them. If you believe that then you're more dimwitted than I could've possibly imagined.

How did I misunderstand the verse? It seemed pretty goddamn clear to me.

And no, you weren't joking. You were expressing your ignorant opinion, and when you saw that no one liked it, you did a 180 and said you were joking to avoid further flaming. You, sir, are perhaps the dimmest of people I've ever come across. I really can't wait until someone else reads the comment you made, and displays a variety of colorful words to sum up the kind of person you are.

[Bitter Buffalo]

Wow! You're a psychic? I didn't realize. Actually, yeah. It was a joke. Aids is obviously not a disease that effects gay people particularly, since the highest percentage of people who have aids in the U.S. are heterosexual black males. Don't try to read anything into that, swami. It's just a statistic.

Wine is good for you in small doses. Drinking enough to become drunk is what's dangerous.

You misunderstood the verse by thinking it meant that all people are unclean. That isn't what it was saying.

[snuzi]

And I repeat, no one understands your jokes. You really shouldn't try to be funny. It isn't your fortè.

Nonetheless, you said yourself that drinking is a sin. Apparently, according to your bible, whether or not it is good for you is irrelevent, since every person who drinks is risking destroying their body. And after all, no one should ever destroy their "temple", right Buffalo Bill?

So, what you're saying is, that certain people are born clean, while others are born unclean? Tsk tsk, I didn't know that God practiced favoritism. I thought that every man was equal in the eyes of God .

[Bitter Buffalo]

Part one: Making you laugh wasn't the object. Making me laugh was. And it was a success.

Part two. Did you even read what I said? If something is good for you then how exactly does that translate to destroying the temple. Huh, dragon ball boy?

Part three. No. That is not what I'm saying. Noone is born unclean. That verse does not refer to PEOPLE. Read it again.


Edit: Your attempts to make me look stupid have backfired every step of the way. You may want to calm down on that. All you are proving is that you are a bigot. Oh, yeah. I said it. You disrespect me just because I am christian. That makes you a bigot. Oh, I know what you'll say "I'm just pointing out your own stupidity and awful beliefs". Except that doesn't work since nothing you have accused me of has come anywhere near the mark. You just don't like Christians. Bigot.

[Bullet Magnet]

Please, let's not purposefully misunderstand each other's posts. Consider the other person's point of view too, when you read them, and put your own out of your mind for the moment. Keep it civil, these are all are own ideas, and the only people saying what is right and what is wrong is us. And while we're all intelligent, we're not that wise. Or smart.

We are not enemies here, just different.

A liberal is a man too broadminded to take his own side in a quarrel.
-Robert Frost (1874 - 1963)

A liberal is a person whose interests aren't at stake at the moment.
-Willis Player

Liberals are very broadminded: they are always willing to give careful consideration to both sides of the same side.
-Anonymous

Never confuse the faith with the supposedly faithful.
-Randy K. Milholland

[Sirap]

Part one: Making you laugh wasn't the object. Making me laugh was. And it was a success.

Part two. Did you even read what I said? If something is good for you then how exactly does that translate to destroying the temple. Huh, dragon ball boy?

Part three. No. That is not what I'm saying. Noone is born unclean. That verse does not refer to PEOPLE. Read it again.


Edit: Your attempts to make me look stupid have backfired every step of the way. You may want to calm down on that. All you are proving is that you are a bigot. Oh, yeah. I said it. You disrespect me just because I am christian. That makes you a bigot. Oh, I know what you'll say "I'm just pointing out your own stupidity and awful beliefs". Except that doesn't work since nothing you have accused me of has come anywhere near the mark. You just don't like Christians. Bigot.

Okay, Buffalo, Bullet is right about everyone having different views and opinions. We all do, but just because Snuzi disagrees with your arguments and religious comments does not make him a bigot. And by calling someone a bigot is hardly an insult. You need to get off your high horse and remember that your opinions are as relevant as any of ours. You know darn well with the stuff you post on here, people WILL indeed either disagree or agree with you. You have it coming to you. All Christians know that they will enter a battle once the horn is blown. You seem like the one who needs to calm down. You call Snuzi a bigot and yet you write about how sinful homosexuality is. Doesn't sound very loving or compassionate coming from a Christian :-p. You shouldn't sound so hateful, but it is to be expected. Just learn to take other peoples opinions and don't grab on to the defense so quickly

[Mutual Friend]

Anyway, all your views (except any gays) are irrelevant cos only gay people can discuss this in any meaningful way.

[Sirap]

Anyway, all your views (except any gays) are irrelevant cos only gay people can discuss this in any meaningful way.

Ha. I think anyone can discuss this topic in a meaningful way. That's like saying discussing a heterosexual's lifestyle can only be meaningful to straight people. Anyone can discuss this and understand. People just choose to be ignorant or cruel. There are sincere people out there that are kind to this matter.

[snuzi]

Part one: Making you laugh wasn't the object. Making me laugh was. And it was a success.

Part two. Did you even read what I said? If something is good for you then how exactly does that translate to destroying the temple. Huh, dragon ball boy?

Part three. No. That is not what I'm saying. Noone is born unclean. That verse does not refer to PEOPLE. Read it again.


Edit: Your attempts to make me look stupid have backfired every step of the way. You may want to calm down on that. All you are proving is that you are a bigot. Oh, yeah. I said it. You disrespect me just because I am christian. That makes you a bigot. Oh, I know what you'll say "I'm just pointing out your own stupidity and awful beliefs". Except that doesn't work since nothing you have accused me of has come anywhere near the mark. You just don't like Christians. Bigot.

If you make a joke, other people are supposed to laugh at it. It's not a joke if only you laugh at it. But that's not the point.

Well, apparently, not all things beneficial are said to be good things, according to your bible. For example, sex is apparently a sinful act, yet it's healthy, and ensures that the human race does not die with that generation. And wine is only beneficial to our bodies in small doses. Certain people abuse it, thus damaging or even destroying their "temple".

Dragon ball boy? Wow, we're really getting desperate here, aren't we? When I said that joking wasn't your fortè, I should have included insulting me as well. So, I have a DBZ icon. Whoop-dee-freaking-doo. You have a name that I can easily apply to Silence of the Lambs and go on joking about for hours. Is any of that relevent to this topic? I think not.

That verse doesn't refer to people!? Are you insane? That is the perfect metaphor to suggest that anyone who is different from the group is an outcast. What are you going to tell me it means? That God thinks fish should have scales and swim with the current? Please.

Your final words made me laugh the most. Me, a bigot? You couldn't be more wrong. I have nothing against christians, to be honest. In fact, I've had many christian friends over the years. It's those of you that preach and attempt hopelessly to render anyone else's beliefs invaluable that I attack and argue with. You came into this thread, saying that homosexuals should not be able to adopt because they aren't "godly". So, I challenged that theory, as did Havoc, Sirap, and Nate. I don't see you attacking them and intentionally insulting them just because they're arguing against your opinions. That's what this forum is about. Spreading our opinions, and supporting them with evidence of their relevence. All you've been doing is going on and on about homosexuality being a sin, and going off on these pointless tangents just because the "evidence", and I use that term so loosely, you are using is not holding out.

[Jordan]

Bitter Buffalo, I've just read everything you said. What a load of s**t!

[Bullet Magnet]

The verdict on equality laws and Catholic exemption in the homosexual adoption debate in Britain is a resounding "Do as we say" by the government. Legally, no agency may now turn down hopeful world-be-parents due to sexuality.

And on an unrelated yet somehow related matter... [link]

[Havoc]

Part one: Making you laugh wasn't the object. Making me laugh was. And it was a success.

Part two. Did you even read what I said? If something is good for you then how exactly does that translate to destroying the temple. Huh, dragon ball boy?

Part three. No. That is not what I'm saying. Noone is born unclean. That verse does not refer to PEOPLE. Read it again.


Edit: Your attempts to make me look stupid have backfired every step of the way. You may want to calm down on that. All you are proving is that you are a bigot. Oh, yeah. I said it. You disrespect me just because I am christian. That makes you a bigot. Oh, I know what you'll say "I'm just pointing out your own stupidity and awful beliefs". Except that doesn't work since nothing you have accused me of has come anywhere near the mark. You just don't like Christians. Bigot.

You're not just christian, you're a christian with an attitude. Haven't seen those to much around here. Go you! Still, you suck. Stop shouting bullsh*t if you don't even believe what you're saying and debate normaly.

Havoc

[Bitter Buffalo]

If you make a joke, other people are supposed to laugh at it. It's not a joke if only you laugh at it. But that's not the point.

Well, apparently, not all things beneficial are said to be good things, according to your bible. For example, sex is apparently a sinful act, yet it's healthy, and ensures that the human race does not die with that generation. And wine is only beneficial to our bodies in small doses. Certain people abuse it, thus damaging or even destroying their "temple".

Dragon ball boy? Wow, we're really getting desperate here, aren't we? When I said that joking wasn't your fortè, I should have included insulting me as well. So, I have a DBZ icon. Whoop-dee-freaking-doo. You have a name that I can easily apply to Silence of the Lambs and go on joking about for hours. Is any of that relevent to this topic? I think not.



That verse doesn't refer to people!? Are you insane? That is the perfect metaphor to suggest that anyone who is different from the group is an outcast. What are you going to tell me it means? That God thinks fish should have scales and swim with the current? Please.

Your final words made me laugh the most. Me, a bigot? You couldn't be more wrong. I have nothing against christians, to be honest. In fact, I've had many christian friends over the years. It's those of you that preach and attempt hopelessly to render anyone else's beliefs invaluable that I attack and argue with. You came into this thread, saying that homosexuals should not be able to adopt because they aren't "godly". So, I challenged that theory, as did Havoc, Sirap, and Nate. I don't see you attacking them and intentionally insulting them just because they're arguing against your opinions. That's what this forum is about. Spreading our opinions, and supporting them with evidence of their relevence. All you've been doing is going on and on about homosexuality being a sin, and going off on these pointless tangents just because the "evidence", and I use that term so loosely, you are using is not holding out.

Not one single time did I say that homosexuals should not have the right to adopt. So maybe you should get YOUR facts straight. And sex with multiple partners without discretion becomes meaningless and can be extremely bad for you.

The verse is not meant to be a metaphor. You may think differently but you would be wrong.

I have not gone out of my way to alter anyones views. I merely stated my views in a forum which asks for me to do so. My views were questioned so I answered. I have no problem with that. It is you who has relentlessly made attacks against my intelligence and tried "hopelessly" to change my opinion. I have gone off on no tangents. At this point I am merely defending myself against your unprovoked attacks.

Oh, and you called me buffalo bill before I called you dragon ball boy so don't start acting like I'm the one who came up with the idea of changing my adversaries name in a petulant manner. Cause you did that.

[looney-bin]

HEY GUYS! DID U NO ALL BLK PPL LIK WATAMELON N CHICKEN? DEY ALL NEED SHUTIN! LOL! ALSO LIK DID U NO AMILLION PUFFS DY A YEAR?

Seriously Buffalo, quit getting your facts from stereotypes and "the place where the sun doesn't shine", and stop being so narrow minded.

[Jordan]

And sex with multiple partners without discretion becomes meaningless and can be extremely bad for you.

And, it can be very pleasant! A person has to have fun once in awhile!
No, I'll stop it now. That might be how some people are.

Seriously Buffalo, quit getting your facts from stereotypes and "the place where the sun doesn't shine", and stop being so narrow minded.

Oh yeah, and you forgot to add: "Get your head out of yer arse."
Right, I'm saying no more in this topic, so bye, I guess...

[snuzi]

Not one single time did I say that homosexuals should not have the right to adopt. So maybe you should get YOUR facts straight. And sex with multiple partners without discretion becomes meaningless and can be extremely bad for you.

The verse is not meant to be a metaphor. You may think differently but you would be wrong.

I have not gone out of my way to alter anyones views. I merely stated my views in a forum which asks for me to do so. My views were questioned so I answered. I have no problem with that. It is you who has relentlessly made attacks against my intelligence and tried "hopelessly" to change my opinion. I have gone off on no tangents. At this point I am merely defending myself against your unprovoked attacks.

Oh, and you called me buffalo bill before I called you dragon ball boy so don't start acting like I'm the one who came up with the idea of changing my adversaries name in a petulant manner. Cause you did that.

Well, you pretty much implied that if they were to adopt a child, that they would not raise the child in a "godly" manner. And to provide evidence of this, you said, and I quote:

I just don't think that a homosexual will raise a child in a godly manner. That's the only problem I have with it.

Well, god forbids homosexuality and for a person to purposely defy him in that way must remove god from the home. The family itself is an affront to God.

There. You implied that if a homosexual couple were to adopt a child, that they would raise that child sinfully. If that isn't basically saying that homosexuals shouldn't adopt, I don't know what is.

Not all people have sex with multiple partners. That is not what I was talking about. True, that you can get some pretty horrible STD's from sleeping around, but, if you were to take some precautions before doing so, to ensure the safety of you and your partner, then nothing would happen. I'm strictly against having multiple partners, as I don't understand what the point of not saving yourself for the one you truly love would be, but if we're getting technical here, then sleeping around may not or my not be harmful depending on what you do beforehand.

It's not? Ha. Then what does it mean? That God enjoys fishing? Honestly, if you're harboring some information, I implore you to share it with us.

I am attacking no one. You typed up an opinion that was only supported by some text in a damn old book. That is not evidence of its truth. I'm not trying to alter anyone's opinion here. I'm trying to prove to you that what you're saying isn't making any sense. So, what I'm really doing is trying to prove how ignorant you're acting by saying certain things. That's not trying to alter an opinion, that's an attempt at showing you your own foolishness.

But the difference between Buffalo Bill and "Dragonball Boy" is that Buffalo Bill can be joked about for days at a time, and still retain it's original homor. While "Dragonball Boy" is the equivalent of someone insulting you because you have a certain color shirt on. It's too obvious, and thus, is not funny. And what's mroe, I can use Buffalo Bill as an ironic statement, since you're against homsoexuals, and yet, Buffalo Bill wanted to be a woman in Silence of the Lambs. That makes it all the more amusing. Please, stop trying to convince me that you're being comedic, because you aren't.

[OANST]

You know, I completely disagree with the kids views and I agree that his basis for them is shaky at best but I can't really fault his presentation of them. It seems like he is doing his best to talk intelligently about it and is being very accomodating of other people's beliefs and rights. I know this will sound weird coming from me but I think you guys are being way too hard on him. I mean, it seems like he is taking offense to the way you are talking to him rather than your opinion. That's fairly rare for a fundamentalist Christian. This kid is acting the way that you should want these guys to act. And he hasn't really been wrong about what he is accusing you of. I'm reading this and all I see is him asking you to stop calling him stupid and you just keep saying "I'm not calling you stupid, stupid". That's what it amounts to. Looney-bin is the only one to actually come off really stupid so far. Seriously, that post was idiotic kid. You completely missed the point of his post.