Respect and Fairness Issue...

[Rex Tirano]

Firstly I would like to say that this is a nice change for you Dino. Usually when you're banned for a week you turn into a toad and threaten to hack OWF, and after you're permo banned you come back again. You say that if the OWF turns to shit you won't lose any sleep over it, then how come you keep joining time and time again even after you've been banned at least 5 times? Is it that you love us? Is it that you want to f*** us over? Please tell me because I'm quite confused.

Dino, you complain about being picked on, and yes I do know that this is going on. I'm sure other members have seen this as well. But in my opinion sometimes you just scream out for a warning.

I know that one of your points is favouritism, and I really can't say anything. I know that I am probably favoured by Rich, if not other staff. But like Ambi says, it's not so bad here, I've been on other forums where it's hard to become a liked member because of the favouritism of the staff is so over bearing.

And wasn't DI elected when he was nice and funny?

- Rexy

[Dipstikk]

Firstly I would like to say that this is a nice change for you Dino. Usually when you're banned for a week you turn into a toad and threaten to hack OWF, and after you're permo banned you come back again. You say that if the OWF turns to shit you won't lose any sleep over it, then how come you keep joining time and time again even after you've been banned at least 5 times? Is it that you love us? Is it that you want to f*** us over? Please tell me because I'm quite confused.

And I suppose you have access to his IP address, so of course, you would know without a shred of doubt that he is Mawk, Codek, What'zisname, and that other ****er you keep claiming that he is.

Oh, and I lied. Though I won't be frequenting it, I'll be popping into this thread from time to time.

[Statikk HDM]

Yep, Majic, back in the day there never was a mass purging/defection that about halved the size of the boards. What? I can't hear you, la la la la la............
So a guy gets banned repeatedly and re-registers under different names. Following the Ambi Hypothesis Dino is/was Death, Mawk, Reese, whatever. AS far as I can tell they were all prolific posters who had something to offer. Following this hypothesis we come to these conclusions:
Dino got piled on a lot, in his various incarnations, all in all for nothing that everybody else wasn't doing.
Secondly, he is in all likelihood the post leader at this place. While that doesn't mean we should all "bow to him faithfully" it does mean that he should stop getting flamed so harshly.

[used:)]

Well, I will say one more thing (unless someone says something that I can't help but reply to ) There is favoritism among certain people. My friend puffy joined and you all attcked her because of her name claiming she was a troll. However, if it was a MOD'S friend, then we wouldn't be hearing the crap you through at her. It made me sick when I read your posts and i don't care if I sound like a pussy, she was my friend and she was really hurt and she left. I don't hold much against the mods except for a few slip ups but everyone makes mistakes and that is understandable in your case.

Why didn't I stay at neopets?

[Rich]

And I suppose you have access to his IP address, so of course, you would know without a shred of doubt that he is Mawk, Codek, What'zisname, and that other ****er you keep claiming that he is.

I would think it's fairly obvious that she has friends in high places. And sex partners in higher places.

I know that I am probably favoured by Rich, if not other staff.

Everyone loves you. I'll be the first to admit I'd be a little lenient with you if you broke the rules, you don't break rules, so I have nothing to worry about.

And wasn't DI elected when he was nice and funny?

I'm pretty sure DI was elected because of his bad attitude and zero-tolerance approach. I too think he took it to the extreme though, despite being one of the people I like on here.

[Majic]

Yep, Majic, back in the day there never was a mass purging/defection that about halved the size of the boards. What? I can't hear you, la la la la la............

Yes, but I wasn't a moderator then.

^

A statement that was only 2.3% serious deserves a response only 2.3% applicable. No hard feelings.

[Nate]

Jesus. Can't you get over the whole Dino/Reece thing. We've been discussing it for months and eventually decided that it was merely a coincidental similarity. Even the mods agreed so we can't be talking about any IP bullshit.

So, to conclude: give it up.

[Dino]

Y'know, if you all think you're so good at picking up on liars, why have none of you even mentioned the fact that I blatantly lied about my age?

I don't look 21, because I'm not 21. I'm a 17 year old college student, I work as an assistant artist in a low budget games studio for work experience, and I'm doing a couple of degrees through the open university in what little spare time I have so that I can make job at the games studio permanent. I'm not some high level games exec with 6 bagillion qualifications, and the only reason I ever got into E3 is because I got a work colleague to lie for me when he was getting the tickets - he managed to sneak me in through a fire exit. I was bitterly disappointed by how boring it was and spent the rest of my holiday in the states watching cable TV in the hotel room and playing billiards in the games room because I didn't look old enough to get into any of the bars and clubs.

Not bland enough for you?

I don't make enough money to afford the vending machine in college, so I welded a steel wire to a £1 coin in welding class so that I could fish it back out again. That's the coolest thing I've ever done in my college, I'm probably one of the most boring students there. The only reason people like me is because I sell them weed, but all that means is I get all these irritating dodgy-looking townies and wiggas hanging around me if I'll fix them up with some pot for free until they can pay me. (which they never do) Nobody in college knows my band, and none of them have heard my music - they don't realise that I'm the one who does all the "wicked-bad stencil graffiti" because I'm too much of a coward to risk getting arrested and charged with every single stencil I've ever sprayed.

So yes, I'm not captain fantastic. But you guys backed me into a corner way back when I was threatening to leave, I had to say something that would put me in a position of authority. Unfortunately my lies only made me look like more of a dick than I already did.

But despite all this that I've been covering up (so badly) nobody has ever questioned me about it, and instead made far fetched suggestions about how I'm some guy who used to be here before but got banned. You were all concentrating so hard on something that there was no evidence for, that you were missing the one thing I'd been obviously decieving you all over. And ok fine, maybe it isn't that serious, but don't you all think that in light of this you should drop the Inspector Clueso act? I'm not a criminal waiting to make my next nefarious move. This isn't an orwellian conspiracy/ufo coverup. I'm just a kid who's trying to get everything all nice again and back to how it was before half the respected regulars went on a crusade against me. It's funny how you don't realise how bad things are for some people until you're in their shoes, and now that I am on the other side of the favouritism I can see just how bad it is.

Heck, put yourself in my shoes - how would you like it if one minute you were a respected member who could get away with stuff, and the next minute you were banned for the spam that you see your peers getting away with on a daily basis? It sucks, and it makes you realise that there needs to be a change in the way we act or the way the rules work, cause right now it's damn confusing.

[Hobo]

Not bland enough for you?

Would have been more interesting with some Ninjas and a cameo by Megadeth but hey.

One point is just that which other members do we know what were all compulsive liars? The same list of members comes up as many suspect you of being meerly another form of. Ok maybe other people lie, but does anyone else lie to the degree of you or any of your other suspected forms? I think not.

[Facsimile]

Jesus. Can't you get over the whole Dino/Reece thing. We've been discussing it for months and eventually decided that it was merely a coincidental similarity. Even the mods agreed so we can't be talking about any IP bullshit.

So, to conclude: give it up.

No, no one has ever agreed to anything like that, except maybe you, but no one else was with you.

Anyway, nice post Dino. Respectometer up a little. See, honesty is a great thing! *Hint hint hint*

[T-nex]

This is getting waay stupid. I really hate this favourism-thing, and personally, i thoight that Ambi wouldn't back it up. But she's faved by evryone too, so i should have known. I made be moving out on deep water, but i really hate how many of the members get favorized, and can't get away with stuff, while other members just get flamed for no reason at all.
Like in Angel-fox' thread. Well, she PMed me, and told that she honestly wasn't looking for pity, but just wanted to say goodbye to her friends, and yet, some of the most respected members of OWF, came with their: "Don't go all boo-hoo on us, cos we don't care."
I really felt disgusted by that, and it has really made me see OWF from another point of view. I really don't have much respect for many of the members here anymore. But I respect Dino because he dares to go against the authority, and tell his opinions. He aint a lap-dog like the most members here.
Well, i don't care what comes after this, but i just think that this has gone too far...

[AquaticAmbi]

Um, Dino, I think you must have missed everytime someone like Hobo had the guts that I think quite a few of us didn't have to call you a liar, like the age thing. I clearly remember him confronting you about that. Jacob made some points to a few times that you could be lying too. And you've also missed a hell of a lot of sarcastic remarks about everything you've ever said you were. My belief is that you got to be "a respected member" by these lies. Sort of.. because I think a big handful of us were only playing along.

Nate and Dipstikk, Fax is right.

T-nex, I never said favoritism was right or moral. I said it happens; there's no way around it. Trust me, I'd love it if everyone was treated perfectly equal, but much like the real world, life on forums will never be completely fair either.

[Mudo]

Rules are meant to be broken.Thats all Im gonna say.

[used:)]

T-nex, I never said favoritism was right or moral

You didn't have to say,what you did was enough.

Fax is right.

Right and wrong are merely points of view.

because I think a big handful of us were only playing along.

Just like how you were playing along with Hobo's little favoritism clique. And to top off your little sophmoric acts of favoritism, you've just tinted Dino's name with red. Might as well tint everyone elses now! How about purple for Jacob and Cheese's green for prosperity!

[Shrink]

I think the most recent moderator-placements are interesting.
Hobo, for example, I see as being made a moderator merely because of who he is friends with. Which is fair enough, of course, but he certainly isn't the best choice of moderator, regardless of his experience on OWF.
I'd be surprised if Ambi isn't made a moderator in good time.

I said it happens; there's no way around it.

I'd say what you said was closer to 'It happens, get over it.'
It is possible to stop it happening, and more than correct to question it. Authority that is supposed to be fair does not do well to show favouritism. Look at teachers, judges, juries and suchlike. People would rightly be unhappy and outspoken if these positions showed favourtism and leniency towards certain people.
Perhaps they do show favouritism where you are, and everyone is fine with that, but I cannot see it happening in my life/surroundings.
You may also say that a forum is unimportant, irrelevant, doesn't matter, or something. This is avoiding the issue. Hopefully you wouldn't say that.

[Kimon]

Godammit. What the hell happened to OWF?

I remember there was a day when if somebody said something funny or cool, they gained happy points, and if they said something stupid or spammy, they were warned or otherwise punished. That's how it should be.

This is quite a parallel to the oh-so-many threads there have been on corruption in the US and UK governments. Hysterically ironic, if I do say so myself. But in other ways, it's sad. Mods should do their fucking jobs, and police the forums. No special treatment, just justice.

Why can't the forums go back to the way they used to be? When we could have fun according to the rules, and nobody questioned it. No one got off for breaking the rules, but no one did (aside from the occasional shitty member), and the forums operated themselves. Those were the golden days.

Remember what these forums are for? Oh yeah, fun. Discussion of Oddworld, but, seeing as how there are no real Oddworld-related anythings anymore, it's about the discussion of whatever the hell needs discussing. We are voluntarily visiting these board. We are not paid, we do it of our own volition. We do it to enjoy ourselves. And to me, this thread (not meant to rag on Dino) is bringing to the foreground that which should not even have to be considered.

So my proposal is that we let this thread die, and whoever has been offended, wrongly punished, or not punished at all should just forget about this whole thing and the events that led up to it, the mods can actually start doing what they were elected to do, and the public can enjoy themselves once again.

Let the forums be restored. Please.

[Leeum]

Let the forums be restored. Please.

To do that the OWF staff should let this whole thing go tbh

Feel the <3!

[Hobo]

I think the most recent moderator-placements are interesting.
Hobo, for example, I see as being made a moderator merely because of who he is friends with. Which is fair enough, of course, but he certainly isn't the best choice of moderator, regardless of his experience on OWF.
I'd be surprised if Ambi isn't made a moderator in good time.

*puts on kill list*

But seriously, i've had experience at being a moderator on this forum before, though no one noticed, i was the RPG mod who breathed life back into the old thing before i grew out of it. True I am friendly with Peter. But pissing off the admins is hardly going to get me anywhere but banned.

I come with an idea. Every person who believes they have recieved a warning through mistreatment can oppose it. No matter who they are, with a PM to me. A thread can be created in our cushy employee lounge and we will review the warnings with a voting system intact. People will be notified about whether their warnings were repealed or not. And we can try to do it as fair as we can. In exchange we will expect a bit more of a formal atmosphere from you all, and all the *sleeps with Super Munch* or what have you will have to go.

Insert opinions here -

[Cyber-Slig]

The only thing I hate about Dino is his attitude. I don't care if he is Reece, Codek, Mawk or whatever. If he's a good member, then I'm cool with him. Sadly he isn't. It takes allot of guts to admit you were wrong and stupid, which is what he has done. Aslong as he changes and becomes nicer, your whole ''omfgzorz itz teh c0deck!!11'' conspiracy will end, and noone will warn you.

Secondly, there is allot of favourism. One person posts something bad, they get told to shut the **** up and get a warning. Then a favoured member does something the same, and the thread/post will just be left alone or locked/deleted, without a warning or anything.

Thirdly, allot of mods are slacking off. Most posts in serious threads (like this) have been a pathetic, smart-ass joke.

Yes, I'd prefer the OWF age before the whole Rule enforcement shizzat. Before we had all these threads about a guy getting offended because his friend doesn't masturbate and a guy wanting his penis en-larged. And where mods did their job a bit better.

[Leto]

*sleeps with Super Munch*

OMG yue slepe wiff me y tank u ^_^ *sleeps with Hobo*

I'm all for rule enforcement. But sometimes there can be a little too much rule enforcement... And since OWF isnt full to the bursting point of life, there isn't as much of the rules being quoted around, and bannings seem to be a rare occurance.

So, erm, yeah, Mods, try harder, but also, don't try harder. :/

*sleeps with Super Munch*

[used:)]

Hello? You can't just spew out "bring back the golden age" crap. You expect us to return to an age months ago? It is bad to go back. You have to keep moving foward otherwise you'll just end up maiking threads like this with a shit load of nostalgia. There will be hardships but wounds heal and good times will come. They may be entirely different from this "golden age" you are all refering to, but you can't try and make a substitute.

[AquaticAmbi]

Since Used, Shrink, etc.(?), have quoted only part of what I said and left out the very important last part, I'll quote that for myself.

Trust me, I'd love it if everyone was treated perfectly equal, but much like the real world, life on forums will never be completely fair either.

Maybe it is possible for there to be more equality on forums ... but highly improbable for there to be perfect and pure equality with no favoritism. But seriously, take a look at the members who seem to get away with stuff more, how many of them do you have a serious problem with for spamming or whatever? I honestly can't think of a single respected member who annoys me when they get away with something. It's because they've proved themselves as good, reliable, and contributive members and they deserve more leniency and whatnot.

I don't mean to sound like the bad guy in favor of favoritism as I think some of you think. If respectable member was ridiculously mistreated for something that everyone else did, then I'd be furious, but I honestly don't think anything awful like that really happens here. And I'm pretty tired of people throwing my relationship with Luke in my face--as if I'd be treated completely different if I weren't with him.

Oof, I just want this to all be over... and for Alcar not to go all nazi on us, but I have a pretty big feeling something very bad is going to result from this if something doesn't happen/isn't done to stop all this horrible drama.

[used:)]

And I'm pretty tired of people throwing my relationship with Luke in my face--as if I'd be treated completely different if I weren't with him.

Well, according to what I've read, this gooney act was only unveiled just recently (in this thread). And like the whole favoritism thing, we were just annoyed, not necessarily ready to take it, burn it, and piss on its corpse.

[Kimon]

First of all, I'd like to ask everyone to stop pissing on Ambi. Thanks.

Hello? You can't just spew out "bring back the golden age" crap. You expect us to return to an age months ago?

Why the fuck not?

It is bad to go back.

Well, that's a sack of crap. Since the old days were better, I don't see why we shouldn't "go back" to them.

You have to keep moving foward otherwise you'll just end up maiking threads like this with a shit load of nostalgia.

Actually, this thread was a result of "moving forward".

There will be hardships but wounds heal and good times will come. They may be entirely different from this "golden age" you are all refering to, but you can't try and make a substitute.

It wouldn't be a substitute, it would just be better.

I honestly can't think of a single respected member who annoys me when they get away with something.

While this contradicts my earlier point, it is rather true. Suck things can be overlooked if the member is overall very contributive to the forum. I still think repeat offenders should deal with Los Consequencos, but yeah, not many respected members are repeat offenders.

[used:)]

What I meant was not trying to make it like it was. Maybe if you would consider it "moving foward" into good times then that would be better.

[Kimon]

What I meant was not trying to make it like it was. Maybe if you would consider it "moving foward" into good times then that would be better.

I know what you meant. That's what I mean to. I want it to be like it was, when the forums were fun. I don't want to make a carbon copy of the forums 4 months ago, I just want it to be fun and carefree and gay-sounding like it did back then.

[used:)]

Well, we can make that happen iof we try and stop bickering and wining for once. (cheesy work together music playing)

[Dino]

And you've also missed a hell of a lot of sarcastic remarks about everything you've ever said you were. My belief is that you got to be "a respected member" by these lies. Sort of.. because I think a big handful of us were only playing along.

You know what? That doesn't do you any favours at all - it makes you look like a spitefully dishonest individual who goes behind people's backs to humour them and jest at their expense. Frankly if I was a friend of yours, after reading that I'd be instantly repelled, because god only knows what you'd been saying about me.

You can forget any ideas you may have of ever regaining any of my respect. I'm not going to be fooled by your act again.

there's no way around it.

Yeah don't you wish.

There's plenty of ways around it, that's what this thread is all about. And if you and your peons hadn't kicked and screamed and made such a big fuss trying to divert the attention, maybe I would've gotten somewhere a little earlier on. But it seems Ambi that as much as you like to take up your argument with Used and myself, there are many other members who are still very well respected who aren't falling for your shit, and I notice you're not taking issue with them half as much as you are with me.

Face it Ambi, you lose this time. You're never going to be able to slow this whole thing down unless you turn against almost half the regular members of the board, and I hardly think a little popularity queen such as yourself would ever do a thing like that.

Trust me, I'd love it if everyone was treated perfectly equal, but much like the real world, life on forums will never be completely fair either.

Total BS, you would hate it. You'd have to follow the rules and behave yourself. If you loved the idea of it so much you'd be more willing to give it a try. But oh wait I forget, your mastermind of prediction allowed you to work out in advance that the whole idea of fairness is 100% certain to fail.

First of all, I'd like to ask everyone to stop pissing on Ambi. Thanks.

I'll stop pissing on her when she stops pissing on me and my suggestions.

Why the fuck not?

Here's why the fuck not dude; Because it isn't a constructive suggestion, it's a vague wish. What the fuck was the golden age? When was it? What were the rules back then? I don't remember ever having a golden age.

And I've got news for you Kimon; the one time we were all getting along, was because of Ambi and her "friends" deciding to "play along" sarcastically and pretend to like and have respect for me, so that they could make jokes and insults behind my back. That whole time we thought everything was going great it was just a ticking timebomb, counting down to the day when Mrs Queen Victoria here would instruct her minions to remove me from the forums.

I hope you're not confusing that time with your "golden age". And no offense here Ki, I just don't want you getting fooled and burnt by these guys.

[Kimon]

Here's why the fuck not dude; Because it isn't a constructive suggestion, it's a vague wish. What the fuck was the golden age? When was it? What were the rules back then? I don't remember ever having a golden age.

There was no specific time of golden-ness, there was always turmoil, but it was never as deep as this. No ever really questioned the mods, because they were pretty much fair, and people abided by the rules for the most part.

And I've got news for you Kimon; the one time we were all getting along, was because of Ambi and her "friends" deciding to "play along" sarcastically and pretend to like and have respect for me, so that they could make jokes and insults behind my back. That whole time we thought everything was going great it was just a ticking timebomb, counting down to the day when Mrs Queen Victoria here would instruct her minions to remove me from the forums.

Honestly, I think you're being rather paranoid.

I really doubt that there was a master plan to get you off of these forums. Maybe they never did have respect for you, that may be true. Maybe they didn't neccessarily like you, and maybe the whole 'respect' thing was just a ruse to make fun of you. It's all possible, and it's probably true for some of the members. But I don't think you're as globally disliked as you think you are. But I dunno. I'm tired, and I don't know what I'm talkin' about.

I hope you're not confusing that time with your "golden age". And no offense here Ki, I just don't want you getting fooled and burnt by these guys.

None taken, it's a reasonable response, and your 'protection' of me is appreciated.

And good night.

[used:)]

Honestly, I think you're being rather paranoid.And good night.

That maybe true, but don't you think that the mods are a little bit paranoid for getting so worked up about an age old meber wgho survies in our realm through reincarnations rituals? (prefereably through the Fire God)

And you're tired? You try going to a band competition that lasts for four hours, ha! I'm not even drowsy .