Nick Griffin goes live, makes cock of himself

[OANST]

As for national identity i would be delighted to raise a family, i don't care about the ethnicity of my parter or if my children are white. I think that having different cultures here is very helpful in the growth of this country and indeed as human beings. But only within reason, i do not agree with the displacement of our culture for another. Which even if not deliberate, is still occuring.

Get off it. You don't have a culture to be displaced.

[Bullet Magnet]

What he said about there being a modern motion to exterminate the idea of an English nationality or indigenous people is also true. Nobody would say an Aboriginee isn't an indigenous Australian. Nobody would say an American Indian isn't an indigenous American. Yet nobody can be indigenous English anymore. MY interpretation of indigenous is nothing to do with colour. Nick Griffin claims his isn't-whether that's true I don't know. But there's an active denial of indigenous British/English/Scottish/Welsh/irish nationality. If you trace ANYBODY from any country back far enough, their ancestors will come from somwhere else- including aforementioned groups such as aboriginees or native American Indians. Yet this is more actively campaigned about with Birtish nationality than most others.

The difference is, Native Americans and Australian aborigines are indigenous in a way we are not. Their ancestors have been there for tens of thousands of years without cultural or genetic contamination from the outside. Britain, however, has played host to invasion after invasion after invasion, each one bringing their own cultures and ethnicities into the British peoples. Whereas many other indigenous peoples are defined by their historical separation, we are defined by being this melting pot as far back as archaeological evidence can show us.

In reality and indeed in nature an area can only support a certain number of people, since we are overpopulated as it is we do. not. need. anymore. people. here, It is unfair and it is unwelcome. Culture is not an issue with me.

As for national identity i would be delighted to raise a family, i don't care about the ethnicity of my parter or if my children are white. I think that having different cultures here is very helpful in the growth of this country and indeed as human beings. But only within reason, i do not agree with the displacement of our culture for another. Which even if not deliberate, is still occuring.

It's evolution. Cultures and nations change. The world you know is the direct result of ceaseless change for billions of years. Do not expect it to stop now that you have grown attached to the form it took in one brief and insignificant moment that you happened to be alive for.

[MeechMunchie]

You don't have a culture.

Try shouting that in a Northen pub.

[OANST]

Next time I'm there I'll give it a shot.

[Munch's Master]

As for national identity i would be delighted to raise a family, i don't care about the ethnicity of my parter or if my children are white. I think that having different cultures here is very helpful in the growth of this country and indeed as human beings. But only within reason, i do not agree with the displacement of our culture for another. Which even if not deliberate, is still occuring.

I agree with this. We quite rightly celebrate differences but that requires there to be differences to celebrate. We are approaching a country with no culture or identity of its own anymore that is indistinguishable from anywhere else on the world. I am not against other cultures. I am not against other races. I merely wish for Britain to preserve an identity of its own in the process.

I don't see why to be indigenous it has to date back thousands of years. My family, as far as I can trace it back, is from the British Isles- mostly England, some from Northern Ireland, some the Republic of Ireland. I consider myself indigenous British. I'm not the only one in that situation. What more is required to be indigenous? How far back does the "melting pot" have to go before you can be called indigenous?

Self-hate and self-denial does appear to have become ingrained into a large portion of the British psyche- I can think of few other countries in the world that actively try to deny the exitence of any indigenous or national people, and openly seek to get rid of any pride in one's own country and heritage. Patriotism in the UK is a dying thing. There's a difference between patriotism and jingoism, and it appears the quest to exterminate the nasty latter has led to a reduction in the perfectly acceptable former.

[shaman]

Get off it. You don't have a culture to be displaced.

Putting aside how offensive i find this, Why don't i have a culture? I think mine is as valid as anyone's.

It's evolution. Cultures and nations change. The world you know is the direct result of ceaseless change for billions of years. Do not expect it to stop now that you have grown attached to the form it took in one brief and insignificant moment that you happened to be alive for.

So what? you expect me to sit there like a plant pot and watch my culture vanish? Just because change has occured before, doesn't mean i don't have any right to feel conservative of my own culture.

You're a smart guy, but that comment is like saying " people have been waging wars since the birth of humanity, don't even bother trying to preserve peace".

[Wings of Fire]

Here we reach an impass between Conservatism and Liberalism, there really isn't much more to say.

Except that we're right.

[shaman]

Yeah, there really is very little common ground here is there.

EDIT: I'm guessing that when you say "We're right" You mean the .... *shudders* liberals

[OANST]

Correct.

[Bullet Magnet]

Even if there was no immigration, our culture would still be changing at a rate of knots. The culture you love was born of the foreign influences it had already experienced, particularly since colonialism, which is both considered the height of British culture from which we are descending, and the days which brought out the worst in us.

With increased travel and communication, cultural contamination is now entirely unstoppable. Cultures are spreading around the world and being deliberately exported, the distinct cultures within our country are also blending and becoming homogenised. But at the same time, cultures do remain ingrained in our minds to be associated with different regions, and new cultures are emerging, of blends of distant cultures and born of common experiences. People aren't just losing their cultural identity, they are also forging their own. This process is only going to speed up, and as much as you may love what has past, new generations will decide they like it the way was now, and later ones how it will be after this, and so on. That will be considered the best, and that any deviation in any direction is degradation. They too will try and fail to prevent change, not realising that change is the only source of cultural vitality.

There has never been a "British culture" to preserve. It has always been varied and different throughout the country, and no particular state of it has ever lasted more than a few years. You're fighting a futile battle to protect an imaginary past.

[MA]

yeah but i like tea and scones.

[MeechMunchie]

I have to admit that what most people think of as 'British culture' is English upper middle class culture.

[MA]

yeah but i like beer and chips.

[MeechMunchie]

I like fish and chips.

[shaman]

There has always been change of course, but i disagree with the extent and regularity to which you think culture is contaminated. True, things change, it's not like i want total and utter conformaty to the past. I can accept new ideas, but there are aspects of culture that have remained the same since time imemmorial. These are the things which should be preserved, they are the things which define us and as you said, our geographical loacation.

Also, i am not fighting to protect the past, i am concerned with the future, with regards to immigration, regardless of race or culture, a community having countless people turn up where they are not needed/necessary and putting untold pressure on the facilities of that community, Without a referendum or any form of addressing the population already in that community is unfair. I find it sickening that our government has long ran out of excuses ( and has been offered many excuses against) mass immigration, and still tries to encourage it at the expense of the community they have been employed to protect and to better. It is short sighted and inconsiderate of the original inhabitants.

EDIT: People posted before me, this is why it sounds out of context.

2EDIT: Chips n' gravy mothafuckaz!

[Wings of Fire]

WHAT ARE THESE THINGS? HOW DO YOU DEFINE BRITISHNESS?

[MeechMunchie]

Here's a fun game! Why don't we all draw a picture of a stereotype of our respective countries?

[OANST]

Yeah. Like what?

[shaman]

Make a thread about this .

Somebody.

[OANST]

Make a thread about this .

Somebody.

You're in one.

[Bullet Magnet]

[Wings of Fire]

Alright, if my country was like that then I wouldn't want any sandniggers ruining shit.

But it's not, so for want of awesomeness and unnatractive geeks, progress continues.

[Bullet Magnet]

Come on, Steampunk combined with Prince of Persia would be even more awesome.

[Wings of Fire]

Actually that's a setting in my original fiction story I'm writing, bizarrely enough.

[Bullet Magnet]

God dammit. *rips out first half of notebook, starts researching India instead*

[Nate]

I don't see why to be indigenous it has to date back thousands of years. My family, as far as I can trace it back, is from the British Isles- mostly England, some from Northern Ireland, some the Republic of Ireland. I consider myself indigenous British. I'm not the only one in that situation. What more is required to be indigenous? How far back does the "melting pot" have to go before you can be called indigenous?

Okay, I'm going to ask the same thing back to you. If you consider yourself indigenous British, how many generations will it take for an immigrant to be considered equally so?

Specifically, what about a second or third generation person of Indian or Pakistani heritage? Would you consider him absolutely British, given that he's grown up in the same primary culture you have, with some familial influences?

[looney-bin]

I'll say that immigration is good for our culture and economy, but only if it's controlled to a reasonable extend. Labour screwed that up when they basically opened the flood gates to everyone, not regulating who comes into the country for genuine work and those who just want to start shit (a certain islamic Captain Hook comes to mind). It's because no one has been able to properly regulate who comes into the country and how long people on visas (I think that's what they're called) stay for that the BNP have been given a chance to flourish and thrive off working class people's fears and prejudices. Not all those who vote for the BNP are necessarily racist, and just vote for them because the main parties do not properly address people's concerns about immigration. Those people have been misguided by an extremest party that not only wants to kick out illegals, but also anyone that looks remotely ethnic.

[shaman]

Specifically, what about a second or third generation person of Indian or Pakistani heritage? Would you consider him absolutely British?

Yes.

And on a different note.

Not all those who vote for the BNP are necessarily racist

This.

[Wings of Fire]

All of this stuff really boils down to one issue: Immigration, you just can't make an argument to national or cultural purity without refering to it, which makes about 95% of what the BNP says dumb and superfluous. A one issue party.

[shaman]

They have policies on lots of other issues as well i think.