Hunting: Barbaric, fun, or what? -

Facsimile · #31 08-05-2005, 01:57 AM

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I don't want to sound like your parents, but consider the feeling of animal when it's being killed. If you were running away from some huge biped with a boomstick, would you not be slightly scared? What of your family, what of your territory?

I feel exactly the same way. I could never hunt, because I always put myself in the animals... feet areas.
Even freakin' bugs I feel really bad for like ten minutes about killing.

Munch's Master · #32 08-05-2005, 03:00 AM

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My personal opinion on it, is that killing animals for meat is natural. So if you can't justify killing an animal for food, then you're simply not natural.

Also, you need to understand that hunting is ingrained, so it's natural that we get a kick out of hunting. Helps ensure the survival of the species. Enjoying the hunt, means catching food isn't a chore, so staying alive is no big deal.

The thing is though, Dino, we don't need to kill those animals for food, we do it out of preference. I eat meat, but I would like to be a vegetarian, yet I can't. Although that doesn't stop me thinking what I just said. You say hunting ensures the survival of us and is enjoyable, well,I personally don't see how someone can enjoy killing something? And this discussion goes in a circle all over again. I still think that if we have to kill something, we shouldn't enjoy it.

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There's also hunters who torture animals. I remember a while back, I saw a programme, and the hunters cut a deer's belly open and it fell on the ground with it's guts hanging out. They left it there as bait for some cheetah, which in the end, never showed up. Am I the only one that finds that finds that wrong?

You arn't the only one Cyber, I find that sick as well. Slowly and painfully injuring something and leaving it to die so you can try to catch and kill an endangered animal is wrong. Again, do these people enjoy what they do?

soulstice · #33 08-05-2005, 03:42 AM

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And Dino does have a point, after-all, some animals do try to eat us. It's nature. Worms eat us, Birds eat worms, Cats eat birds, Dogs eat cats, we eat dogs (Well, wolves and foxes), worms eat us etc. etc.

That's not a valid point. The scale on which humans kill animals heavily outweighs the number of humans killed by animals. By billions. We bother them without them bothering us. I mean, for bloodsport, what has a deer in a wood stretching thousands of acres done to the hunter that has never been bothered by it? I can accept a person having to kill a lion chasing him to save his life, but while on safari in Kenya, our guide told us that there is 'no need to bother lions' (an East African proverbial phrase relating to all wild animals) - something we all already know. If the man is stupid enough to travel into the Savannah on his own into the lion's rightful territory, maybe he does deserve to be killed. After all, other animals keep out of the lion's territory, shouldn't humans also? Why do we have this insatiable need to infringe into places that aren't ours and then kill the rightful inhabitants?

Cyber-Slig · #34 08-05-2005, 06:56 AM

You mis-understand, Soulstice. In another post, I also mentioned most of us aren't killed, because we're more intellegent (Well, most of us -.-), and we do have technology. Most damn hunters are armed with a rifle or two, hence we don't get killed.

Has anyone also thought why we need to kill these other animals? Even for food. We've already got meat from farm animals, why do we need more?

soulstice · #35 08-05-2005, 07:26 AM

As we're more intelligent, surely we should minimize unecessary suffering to less intelligent animals, shouldn't we? If we're so evolved, why do we still commit attrocities against beings that are defenceless to guns? It's utter nonsense.

Jacob · #36 08-05-2005, 08:26 AM

I can see the appeal in hunting, the adreneline rush, the tracking the prey, but unless the being been hunted is of high intellect, i don't think i'd ever hunt. The thought of being a Bounty Hunter appeals to me, purely 'cos you're tracking the most clever and dangerous animal of them all, but, like Fax, i feel bad for killing insects.

soulstice · #37 08-05-2005, 01:17 PM

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I can see the appeal in hunting, the adreneline rush, the tracking the prey, but unless the being been hunted is of high intellect, i don't think i'd ever hunt. The thought of being a Bounty Hunter appeals to me, purely 'cos you're tracking the most clever and dangerous animal of them all, but, like Fax, i feel bad for killing insects.

The phase 'tracking the prey' sounds very barbaric when in relation to humans. Also, there are activities that give you more adrenaline than hunting and don't cause suffering to animals.

Jacob · #38 08-05-2005, 01:37 PM

'The phase 'tracking the prey' sounds very barbaric when in relation to humans.'

It depends what sort of humans we're talking about. There're a fair few that don't deserve the title of 'civilised'.

Loup Garou · #39 08-05-2005, 02:59 PM

Hunting is according to me, right, if he's doing it to survive. Then it's really necessery, but if someone is going to hunt something for fun, then the hunter can use paintballs or tranquilizers....or perhaps a camera and take a picture of it. Then it's just a game, nothing else...

Havoc · #40 08-05-2005, 03:23 PM

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I live in the South of the U.S., so this is something that I hear about probably way more than most of you, but what do you think of this sport?

While I understand hunting is necessary to a certain extent to maintain some species' populations in avoidance of overpopulation, I can't understand how anyone can find taking a wild animal's life fun.

Additionally, I find stuffed animals, especially mounted heads, grotesque and disgusting.

Depends on a few factors for me. Species, reason and part of the world.

For instance. Killing to eat is diffrent then killing for fun. Killing an animal in Africa is something diffrent then killing an animal in France.
Killing animals for fun I don't approve of in the first place, but as long as it's no endangerd species thats being hunted there is not a big problem as long as it's monitored right.

I do tell you tho. Kill a tiger infront of my eye's for no reason or worse; for fun. And I swear I will have your guts for dinner and put your head on a silver platter (Sorry, had to vent :P)

soulstice · #41 08-05-2005, 05:29 PM

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'The phase 'tracking the prey' sounds very barbaric when in relation to humans.'

It depends what sort of humans we're talking about. There're a fair few that don't deserve the title of 'civilised'.

Wait a minute, if you see the appeal in hunting by tracking the prey surely you're one of the people that doesn't deserve the title of being 'civilized'? You kind of contradicted yourself in a not so obvious way.

Jacob · #42 08-05-2005, 07:27 PM

' if you see the appeal in hunting by tracking the prey surely you're one of the people that doesn't deserve the title of being 'civilized'?'

I didn't say i felt the appeal, i said i could see the appeal. As in, i can understand why people would do it. It doesn't mean i'd do it.

used:) · #43 08-06-2005, 05:54 PM

This may seem a litle weird, but what do you guys think about bug catching? Some inscects, like the bird wing butterfly, can only be taken down using guns (loaded with stuff like mini nets and tranquilizers). But some bugs are really hard to catch and are only found in certain stores.

Facsimile · #44 08-07-2005, 01:40 AM

... Why would we hunt bugs...?

used:) · #45 08-07-2005, 06:54 AM

Why did we hunt elephants? For their ivory. In butterflys, it's because they're are a prized possesion in some countries.

Jacob · #46 08-07-2005, 08:52 AM

'(loaded with stuff like mini nets'

MINI-NETS!?! That's hilarious!! Awww.

And i find this "bug-hunting" vile as well. What's the point? So your status is increased. Ugh.

Rich · #47 08-07-2005, 08:54 AM

Hunting for 'fun' is naughty, and I dissaprove of it. Hunting for food is natural but we've passed that stage in our society and we can just farm everything now. So essentially hunting is just cruel and pointless.

used:) · #48 08-07-2005, 08:58 AM

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'(loaded with stuff like mini nets'

MINI-NETS!?! That's hilarious!! Awww.

And i find this "bug-hunting" vile as well. What's the point? So your status is increased. Ugh.

Hey man, the birdwing butterfly gets pretty friging big, it can eat your head off

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Teal · #49 08-07-2005, 09:21 AM

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Hunting for food is natural but we've passed that stage in our society and we can just farm everything now.

...although the conditions some animals are kept in, in those "farms" that are more like high-output production lines with little care towards the animal's welfare (just "grow 'em big, grow 'em fast"), it often seems LESS cruel to me to go out and shoot a wild deer than go out and buy a broiler chicken. Healthier, too, since it won't have all the antibiotics (and resistant bacteria) they feed farm animals these days - and you'll at least get meat rather than water (I read somewhere that between 30% and 50% of your average supermarket chicken is water and gelatine and "fillers" - they inject it into the meat so they can make it heavier and sell it for more).

Having said that, I eat very little meat these days anyway, so...

Facsimile · #50 08-08-2005, 02:09 AM

Oh so wait, people actually do hunt bugs?
What the hell?
Explain.

Dino · #51 08-08-2005, 07:23 AM

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The thing is though, Dino, we don't need to kill those animals for food, we do it out of preference.

Actually, we DO need to kill animals for food. Without meat of any kind, the human body never functions properly. It's been proven that vegetarianism stunts growth, causes bone problems, and can result in health problems usually assosciated with people who live in poverty in third world countries.

While it's true that some animals can survive without meat, we are not one of them, or at least, we were not designed to be one of them.

Dino · #52 08-08-2005, 07:29 AM

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Hunting for 'fun' is naughty, and I dissaprove of it. Hunting for food is natural but we've passed that stage in our society and we can just farm everything now. So essentially hunting is just cruel and pointless.

Not really, hunting is the only way game can be farmed. You can't actually have them grazing on a field then round them up into a slaughterhouse, because that's not how they live. Now, if you need people to do this job, why not have people who do enjoy it? I imagine they'd be more accurate anyway.

And why is it that nobody has really commented on fishing? I don't see how that's any different to hunting for fun. See this is what always happens, people go nuts about hunting on land but when it comes to fishing they're oh-so hypocritical.

Munch's Master · #53 08-08-2005, 07:32 AM

We can always substitute. People could farm chickens in healthy conditions for their eggs, or cows for yoghurt, butter, milk and cheese. That would provide the protein for growth. I'm not a vegetarian, but that lifestyle could be lived by. Using animal products rather than just killing the animals means hunting and killing doesn't need to happen but we still get the nutrients from other products such as what I listed above. So surely that would fill in for bone and growth problems? Also I voiced my opinions on fishing earlier, I'm sort of torn on that one. Yes it's cruel but, I don't really know what I think about fishing. I don't fish though.

Dino · #54 08-08-2005, 07:54 AM

Eating an egg is identical to killing an animal for food, therefore vegetarians refuse to do it. It is -impossible- to get protein on a vegetarian diet. You can get calcium, fat, starch, and various other stuff, but you cannot get protein. That's why they have to take protein suppliments, otherwise they'd never be able to heal or grow. However there are vegetarians who refuse dairy products on the basis that it's an animal product and is therefore bad. But yes, dairy products would solve the bone problems, at least to a certain extent.

The fact of the matter is, one way or another, we need to eat meat. It contains things that you have to eat and otherwise must be supplimented, and those suppliments are made from animals anyway. If you leave them out completely, you'll find yourself with some serious health problems later on in life.

Munch's Master · #55 08-08-2005, 07:58 AM

Well, I don't know about these super-strict vegetarians. My cousin is a vegetarian, but she eats dairy stuff and eggs, so that's what I was basing my reply on. Hmm, wel if some people cut out all of that then you're right, you can't live off that diet healithily for long-term.

AquaticAmbi · #56 08-08-2005, 08:11 AM

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Eating an egg is identical to killing an animal for food, therefore vegetarians refuse to do it.

Not really; the eggs we eat are unfertilized. No little chickies are being killed.

Hmm, but if they were fertilized, it'd be almost like an abortion argument. Is it considered murder when the organism isn't even born?

used:) · #57 08-08-2005, 08:31 AM

I totally forgot about that Ambi *high five*

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Facsimile · #58 08-12-2005, 02:52 AM

No one answered my bug hunting question...

AquaticAmbi · #59 08-12-2005, 03:12 AM

Yeah, Fax, some people truly do hunt bugs. Usually, the bugs are stuck on little tooth pick-like sticks, and the collections are kept in display cases of some sort.

Facsimile · #60 08-13-2005, 12:39 AM

That's... That's just creepy...

Dino: It's true, some people are hypocritical when it comes to fishing, but I'm not a fan of that either. I don't eat anything that lives in water, but that's because I find all seafood disgusting.