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  #1  
09-13-2009, 01:38 PM
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Worldwide Breeding Restriction

Our planet is overpopulated. We're depleting resources, water is slowly starting to become one of those things we might have to start a war over in 50 years, thousands of children ranging in all ages are in foster homes (in the USA alone). We're growing at an enormous speed. Right now there are almost 7 billion of us on this planet and with the constant advances in medical science people stay alive longer and longer.

Governments are dealing with problems like global warming, the financial crisis. We're fighting wars that have no meaning, fight each other over money and resources. Why are we not paying attention to the biggest problem currently in existence? Over population!

China is dealing with this already. There you can only have 1 child per household and it's done wonders for population control and health care. What if we took it a step further?

What would happen if a worldwide breeding restriction was implemented for 15 years? How much would the world population decrease and would it help? Or should we follow china and implement a world wide rule that says you can only have one child under certain conditions? Or better yet, need a license/permit to have a child?

Many people believe it's a human right to have a child. I believe it's even included in the actual human rights law. But should it really be a human right? Even if the planet is starting to shatter under the weight of our 7 billion bodies, should we still be allowed to put more of us on here? Because keep in mind, if we keep this up there will be no more planet to speak off in a few hundred years.

What is your opinion on the current over-population of our planet? How do you propose we fight the problem?
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  #2  
09-13-2009, 01:41 PM
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As long as you never breed I couldn't care less what anyone else does.
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  #3  
09-13-2009, 01:47 PM
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ohaithere Jacob of 2004

welcome to "out there opinions" of yesteryear
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  #4  
09-13-2009, 01:48 PM
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Hey Havoc, ever read A Modest Proposal?
As for dealing with overpopulation; lets eradicate all the furries and zoo fetishists!
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  #5  
09-13-2009, 01:58 PM
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I back you up all the way on this, Sekto Springs.
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  #6  
09-13-2009, 02:10 PM
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We don't need to put a limit on those who feel the need to have children, just force them to fucking adopt.

As for depleting resources, how about all of you fat fucks just stop eating so much?
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  #7  
09-13-2009, 02:16 PM
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It's a law that's uninforcible without severely shitting on more human rights than just the right to have children, and an instant way to become a hated government. Human overpopulation is a major contributing factor to all the greatest threats to current life and civilizations on Earth, but the only feasible way to tackle it is by educating people. It's the slow path, but that's better than the quick fix.
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  #8  
09-13-2009, 02:21 PM
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Max speaks truth.
Havoc, please move to China. I'm sure you'll find plenty of people there who agree with you on the matter of ethics vs. efficiency.
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  #9  
09-13-2009, 02:57 PM
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havoc IS right. But unfortunately this is a case where the right thing to do is also the wrong thing- the backlash.backfire/whatever term you want for it that'd result would be immense. As it does basically inhibit human rights. But so do many other current policies being put in place for our ssupposed safety/protection/benefit of society.

Limiting childbirth would turn the world even more Orwellian than its rapidly becoming, but the population crisis does need to be tackled. There's only a handful of solutions:
1) Mass Culling/when you reach a certain age youre killed. Highly radical, not advised at all and no society would toleate a government doing this anymore.
2) Limiting number of children. Possibly the most effective, certainly the quickest fix yet 2nd most unpopular. Human rights activism would increase, potential civil unrest. It would work and could be the best solution, but the ethics of it are highly problematic.
3) As Max suggests,educating people about population control. Slow, but it would work in theory. Problem is some people wouldn't care- theyd have the attitude of-"Meh, if everyoen else limits it its ok for me to have a bunch of kids, right?". Some wouldnt care to start with/take no notice. It'd require an enforced law to go along with it-perhaps implement it to preced #2, but then you'd have the government conspiracy/slow brainwashing argument and there'd still be unrest.

4) More gay people, and allow adoption but not artificial insemination. While the "genetic child" thing is a nice thing to have there's tons of kids who need adopting, and if gay couples were adopting the population would dwindle. Problem is you'd need to prevent artificial insemination for all, so the infertile would probably claim discrimination and gay couples who wanted genetic children would cry homophobia. Also not easy to induce a mass gay movement in society.


It's not an easy solution at all, and its why, as horrible as it is to say, the human race NEEDS wars/mass plagues. As horrific and grisly and distressing as they are its a natural population control. War is skirmish now, not mass battles. And health improvements mean killer bugs like Swineflu and Birdflu kill thousands instead of millions. It's a horrible reality but these natural population culls are needed. It doesn't make them justified or right, just means the human race needs them to avoid overpopulating. And we are definitely headed for a mass overpopulation spike.
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  #10  
09-13-2009, 03:07 PM
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Don't worry folks, I'm convinced that mother nature is going to take care of the lot of us pretty soon anyway.

It's Natural Selection. Survival of the smartest and fittest. We're too moronic and selfish to keep ourselves and our world alive by our own choices and means.

Challenging what many feel are 'basic human rights' to most people, in stark contrast to what we desperately need at this time, will result in a selfishly driven battle to maintain these "rights" and choosing to lay aside all personal responsibility and common sense. "Well, you can't take away my rights! Go take away someone else's to solve the problem."

Now when the shit hits the fan and we start having massive die-off worldwide, we can all remember, "We made this choice." It's a world we can all look forward to because we are currently too attached to establishment to want to let go... so it's going to have to be ripped away from us; the hard way.

Topic Closed.

P.S. The US government has mandated that all vehicle emissions must meet certain efficiency guidelines by 2025.

2025!? Why not NOW? Indeed, why not now. I ask every reader, "Do you care?" If you do, you're reading this and seeing someone genuinely concerned about the state of the world and its people and not just a doom and gloomer.

Given our past track record, come 2025, legislation will be passed, quite over our heads and wishes, to extend the deadline. More of the same.

It's up to each of us.
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  #11  
09-13-2009, 03:37 PM
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2025 is when our oil reserves will be officially tapped out.
Here's the solution; ride a fucking bike.
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  #12  
09-13-2009, 05:01 PM
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Havoc appears to be missing the point that birth rates have already dropped significantly across the Western world. The USA has a birth rate of 2.05, which means that they're only just keeping a constant population from generation to generation (though the childhood mortality rate will mean that they're probably not even doing that). Australia and many other countries has a birth rate well below 2.

In order to solve overpopulation, you would have to focus your efforts on the third world. And, frankly, there are a lot of other issues you would have to solve before that. You'd need to educate the population on birth control, you'd need to set up some sort of social security infrastructure so that people are supported in their old age when they only have one or two children. You would essentially need to create a middle class out of nowhere so that families could support themselves without having such a large number of children.

And, frankly, if you managed to acheive all that, you wouldn't need to mandate low birth rates - it would happen on its own.




In case you're interested: List of countries and their birth rates.
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  #13  
09-13-2009, 05:35 PM
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The Depopulation plan in China created tons of problems.

You fucking idiot.

Also Ex-fucking-Dee at "Fighting over water in 50 years." Do you know ANYTHING Havoc?
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  #14  
09-13-2009, 05:57 PM
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I think before we worry about the rights to have children, we should worry about the right to choose NOT to have children... seems people get offended when you wanna make choices about your own body.
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  #15  
09-13-2009, 06:17 PM
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I agree with Nikki, fuck the overpopulation issue - lets hammer about abortion first.
I'm pretty sure that if Christianity or similarly narrow-viewed religions still have merit, we won't advance far as a race at all.
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  #16  
09-13-2009, 06:58 PM
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Abortion is killing lots of babbies. So there's that.

Also, I want a war to happen. I mean, Sci Fi is awesome. Let us make it real. Solve the population 'problem' and encourage us to build them fancy space boats.

I'll be cryogenically frozen so I can go on space adventures as the token gay guy and have sex with aliens.

pilot can come too
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  #17  
09-13-2009, 07:04 PM
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Way to counter my buttery-smooth transition from Havoc's psychotic totalitarianism to a circuitous political hot topic, Anonyman.
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  #18  
09-13-2009, 07:08 PM
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You can come too, Sekto. Do you want to be the captain? I'll let you be the captain.
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  #19  
09-13-2009, 08:12 PM
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Yay!

Why are you so sweet all of the sudden Anonyman!?
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  #20  
09-13-2009, 10:08 PM
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I want to be the Captain!
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Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.
If we were girls, we could get popular by doing anything:
rock band, jazz band,
karate, kendo, mahjong, cyborg, synchronized swimming...
On the other hand, high school boys are
useless outside battle and sports anime.
But they're recklessly trying to make a slice-of-life anime about us.
Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.

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  #21  
09-13-2009, 10:35 PM
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you're not really in the plan

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  #22  
09-13-2009, 11:32 PM
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I'm sure you're doing your part, hey Havoc?
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  #23  
09-13-2009, 11:47 PM
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:
you're not really in the plan
Well FINE

I'll have my OWN SPACEQUEST

with AMAZONS

and JAILBAIT

In fact, FORGET THE SPACEQUEST
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Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.
If we were girls, we could get popular by doing anything:
rock band, jazz band,
karate, kendo, mahjong, cyborg, synchronized swimming...
On the other hand, high school boys are
useless outside battle and sports anime.
But they're recklessly trying to make a slice-of-life anime about us.
Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.

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  #24  
09-14-2009, 12:28 AM
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Next off-topic poster gets bonked on the head by Banny Mallett. Havoc may say some incredibly uninformed things, but he has raised one of the most interesting topics on OWF in quite some time, and I'd like to see it get the focus that deserves.

Nikki, I agree with your post so much it's incredible. Same with Nate's, but with you it's heartfelt.
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  #25  
09-14-2009, 04:21 AM
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A worldwide breeding restriction can, in concept, be a very good idea. However, in practice, people are still going to get preggers without planning on it. unless we put spermicide in the water all year or only let people get Pregnant every X years, it's still going to just be a fucking huge Amount of Senior citizens with no one to change their diapers, whcih is EXACTLY what's happening in China. (Some government funded groups are handing out pamphlets explaining lopphole sin the one couple one child thing, such as a single child married to another single child being able to have two children.
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  #26  
09-14-2009, 05:55 AM
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:
I think before we worry about the rights to have children, we should worry about the right to choose NOT to have children... seems people get offended when you wanna make choices about your own body.
Hey look! Another problem that we can trace back to religion .

True, people should be free to do what they want with their bodies. But while eradicating religious believes would certainly help with overpopulation and do me a world of good personally, I do not believe it would make much of an impact on the current global birthrate. People getting pregnant unplanned isn't the problem. The problem is the couples who think it's a good idea to have 4 kids for no reason, they plan it out and do it on purpose.

As for it being a human right to have children, I think this rule should be reconsidered, if not taken out completely. The sole purpose of breeding is to make sure the species stays alive. In its most basic form, breeding is not a right but a duty. If certain animals don't breed at a certain rate they will die out.

The irony here is that if we keep on breeding like this we're going to hit problems which could actually mean the end of our planet and thus our species and all other species on it. So in order to preserve ourselves, in order to stay alive we need to stop breeding or breed less at least.

The right to have children is something that does not make any sense to me. Yes, we need birth to carry on with the species but should that mean that, in this day and age, everyone should be able to be a parent? Some people are just not suited to raise a child or responsible enough to even think about having them.

As for what Nate said about the third world countries, yes those countries form a big part of the problem. But the current approach of trying to make something decent of those countries has been failing since the dawn of time. African countries have received so much charity money from all over the world, I think they could pay off America's debt if they had saved it all over the course of the last 50 years. They received billions upon billions of dollars from all around the world and what do you see there? Some tribe gets a waterpump and a school? Gee, that's one damn expensive school.

The approach to take with third world countries is a different discussion all together, but Nate is right that it would be of significant impact if those countries would stop being third world and start being developed nations.

However, on the flip side, if they were to become developed nations that would mean that in the long run there would be more room for more people. Cities start to develop and more living space is created. In the long run would this not be counterproductive to the population cause? Just a thought.
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  #27  
09-14-2009, 06:11 AM
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Honestly, taking away the rights from a human being to have children is as bad as those people who try to outlaw abortion, if not worse.
Just let people friggin do what they want with their bodies. Ok from an efficient way of looking.. simply outlawing children would be the easiest solution ever... But easy isn't always best.
It is in our instincts to have children. Few people do not want children at all, and even though Im one of them, I've talked enough to my sister to know where people who want kids are coming from. Some people crave to have children so much, that being forced not to have one is just horrible. Think about how depressed the population would get.. What tension this would create. I can certainly imagine this wouldn't fly well with the majority, and i can also imagine a lot of riots taking place. Outlawing a thing so carnal to our nature is just .. retarded. Sorry.. I mean idealistically it would be a splendid idea. I wouldn't mind as I don't want kids. But in the real world, things are more complicated than that. And why discuss ideals when they lead to nowhere anyway?
Anyway something like this has already happened... In China!
http://geography.about.com/od/popula...a/onechild.htm
The one-child only policy...I don't know what to think of it but at least that makes more sense than allowing no children at all.
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  #28  
09-14-2009, 07:10 AM
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I think this would be a great idea in some parts of the world, but i can see a lot of bad things happening if the government suddenly turned around and said " Hai guys you now need a permit to have kids". As good an idea as this is, it is impractical becuase of the risk of public outcry it might cause.

Let us not forget about chinas fucking abominable humanitarian track record.
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Last edited by shaman; 09-14-2009 at 07:18 AM..
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  #29  
09-14-2009, 08:14 AM
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Yeah but you could ask yourself where do we draw the line when it comes to the majority being pissed off? Of course people are going to be pissed off but for the greater good of our species and our planet I would have to say ignore the majority. Any action shouldn't be taken overnight of course. But people should be made aware that having 4 kids in each household is not something we can get away with for much longer. What's wrong with 2 anyway?

T-nex: Not having any children wouldn't be that good of an idea since it would create an immense generation gap when we start having children again 10 to 15 years later or whatever. But restricting households to only 1 or 2 children would be a step in the right direction, especially when I still hear about people having 6 children or 10 or 12 or even 16 children. Not to mention that those children each cost money (not just the parents, everyone). So in a way it would even help the economy.
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  #30  
09-14-2009, 08:21 AM
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Well then as I said.. look into the Chinese one-child-only policy...
They've been having this for some time, and you could probably read about the progress and such by googling around for a bit. That's pretty much how the whole world will be if it's put into action.

I dunno if I'd mind restricting the number of kids one can have at a time... But that's just me. I just don't think forbidding children all together is a good solution.

Edit: anyway that's my world-efficient voice speaking... My freedom-to-choose side is alerted by these suggestions.
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Last edited by T-nex; 09-14-2009 at 08:24 AM..
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