Hell

Statikk HDM · #1 12-29-2001, 05:30 PM

I always wondered how hell came about. It seems to be one of the most recent additions to the christian church that I can think of. in the entire old testament ,hell isn't mentioned once. I know it seems weird to me to write this topic, but where did the idea of hell come from. all religions hav one form of punishment or other if you,"don't to the line" so to speak. From being turned into a really shitty animal or being thrown into big pit of firey badness, religions all have them. it always seemed a form of intimidation to me,Believe in fill in the blank or go to hell"know what i mean. So, if their was no hell or bad hot place, would you still be a christian? How did you people get the balls tell god to screw off?Arn't you even vaguly afraid of eternal torture?

Joe the Intern · #2 12-29-2001, 05:45 PM

Many people on this board have no religion. Religion doen't mean only throwing away the thought of some almighty good being, it also mean throwing away whatever else the religion has. I believe Hell was just a way to intimidate people into believing in God.

Roop · #3 12-29-2001, 05:49 PM

Okay this is what I believe and what i think most of you think too, I don't believe in God but I believe in the concept and by that I mean believing in God and fearing hell as probably kept a lot of people from doing really bad things like killing themselves and other people and given them confidence to do things.

Sl'askia · #4 12-29-2001, 05:53 PM

What is Hell? Life.

All kidding aside. I also believe the concept of 'hell' was used to intiminate people into joining their religion and to be 'good boys and girls'.
Feh...life is hell enough if you ask me...

Danny · #5 12-29-2001, 06:27 PM

Hell was a way of getting money for the church. Anyone who's seen the first season Blackadder episode "The Archbishop" will know what I mean...

Steve · #6 12-29-2001, 06:31 PM

hel is a norse goddess who as we all know got sent to Niflheim which is often refered to as hel also if you don't die in combat you go there for eternity. hel is exept for being a punishment is the opposite of hell it is basicly the north pole in winter dark and cold(if you die in battle you go to valhalla where you kill people who are then resarected to be killed again and at night sit around eating). when it moved to christianity was probably during the norman invasions.

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #7 12-29-2001, 06:48 PM

:

Originally posted by Rettick:
Hell was a way of getting money for the church. Anyone who's seen the first season Blackadder episode "The Archbishop" will know what I mean...

Not all churches are all about money.

Hell is real. Hell was not meant for us. Is was meant for Satan and 1/3 of the angels who follwed him. Now, it's for people too who rebel against God.

Danny · #8 12-29-2001, 06:55 PM

Not just for people who rebel against God. Apparently, it's also for people whose parents decided not to Baptise them. Unless, of course, you think that being born to those parents is an act of Rebellion...

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #9 12-29-2001, 07:36 PM

:

Originally posted by Rettick:
Not just for people who rebel against God. Apparently, it's also for people whose parents decided not to Baptise them. Unless, of course, you think that being born to those parents is an act of Rebellion...

Um yeah, it is people who rebel against God and are against him.

Just because your baptize, doe not necessarily mean your going to heaven. SOme so called christians who say they are with God, and who are hhypocrites, go to hell too.

Danny · #10 12-29-2001, 07:52 PM

Yes, but those who are unbaptised go to Hell without fail, even if they are the nicest people in the world.

Joe the Intern · #11 12-29-2001, 08:06 PM

Statikk, I thought you said in another one of your topics that you didn't want to start another religious debate.

Sydney · #12 12-30-2001, 03:03 AM

The bible refers to a place called hell only as a mechanism to seperate the true Christians from the false. Obviously, if you're a Christian because you don't want to burn eternally in a pit of burning sulphur, you should rethink your position...

[ December 29, 2001: Message edited by: Sydney ]

Surfacing · #13 12-30-2001, 08:00 AM

Hell is a Metaphor, Man has created hell through time with myths and story's, God has not created hell man has in his own mind, therefore it does not really exist, it just made up to frighten people that to bad things or people that don't follow the so called "10 commandments", i'd say don't waste u'r whole life thinking about it, just live u'r life that's all.

[ December 30, 2001: Message edited by: Surfacing ]

Steve · #14 12-30-2001, 01:34 PM

ha ha if it was in the new testament like Statikk said then nobody noticed the huge error in my post that my explanation is off by about 1000 years and 500 miles.

SeaRex · #15 12-30-2001, 02:33 PM

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Originally posted by Rettick:
Yes, but those who are unbaptised go to Hell without fail, even if they are the nicest people in the world.

I hope you were being sarcastic, cuz Pinky can't prove or deny that. The thought that devout people of other religons going smack-down to hell is absurd. But, then again, I can't prove or deny that either. If ppl go to Hell or not could all depend on faith. If you believe Hell exists, than it does for you. If you believe in Nirvana and spiritual enlightenment than you could possibly reach it someday. If you believe in reencarnation, than perhaps you shall come back to Earth and start anew when you die. Faith gives something back to us, the gift of goodwill and kindness. And even if there is nothing after death, you can die knowing that you have done everything you can to be a good person. And if our hopes of paradise aren't granted, being a good person is a reward in it's self.

Statikk HDM · #16 12-30-2001, 02:41 PM

What I meant was that topics that get out of hand and abusive should be closed. I don't see anything wrong with this topic, as everyone is being cordial and cool headed. Anyway, I think that the idea of someone being born into a family who doesn't believe in the christian god but still wanting to believe happens all the time. If they really believed they would get baptised. I knew a person who didn't believe and be baptised until they were thirteen. People who really believe want the gift of baptism.

glukkon_daniel · #17 12-30-2001, 04:00 PM

If God is all-forgiving, then why would there be a hell? I mean, if you're an athiest all your life, then you die and meet God and you're like, "Whoops"... Wouldn't God forgive you?

Steve · #18 12-30-2001, 04:06 PM

in early christianity it said that it would punish you for your crimes then you go to heaven and not be punished for eternity.

•[cyrus]• · #19 12-30-2001, 04:11 PM

If your more on the Heathenly (means Heavenly) side you go to God's sancuary. If your more on the demoentic (means evil) , you go to Saitin's Kindom.........

...Mudokon101

Danny · #20 12-30-2001, 04:30 PM

:

Originally posted by SeaRex:
[BI hope you were being sarcastic, cuz Pinky can't prove or deny that[/B]

I meant that, according to Christianity, you have to be baptised to go to heaven.

Statikk, do you believe there is a Heaven and a Hell? If so, would you exclude people of other religions from Heaven, even if they were incredibly virtuous? As an example, would Mohandas Gandhi be sent to Hell?

The Magog On The March · #21 12-30-2001, 07:12 PM

:

Originally posted by Daniel Brown:
If God is all-forgiving, then why would there be a hell? I mean, if you're an athiest all your life, then you die and meet God and you're like, "Whoops"... Wouldn't God forgive you?

Look, I'm a christian, maybe not as much as I used to, but I still definatly believe in god and hell.If god was completely all forgiving, then that means truely evil people (hitler, being my prime example. Have you seen the pictures of what he did to the jews? Hell is too good for him) could just waltz into heaven. There has to be a line drawn somewhere.

Danny · #22 12-30-2001, 07:41 PM

So are you grouping Atheists along with Hitler? That's a BAD mistake, Buddy...

Gluk Schmuck · #23 12-30-2001, 08:01 PM

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Originally posted by Statikk HDM:
How did you people get the balls tell god to screw off?Arn't you even vaguly afraid of eternal torture?

*feels balls*
I didn't tell God to 'screw off', actually, I haven't said that to anyone (at least not for a looooong time). Not one of my favourite insults.
And I can't say anything to God because I don't belive in it.

Eternal torture? Nah. If there turns out there is a God and I've been wrong about it God can hardly blame me for not beliving in Christianity, the evidence to support Christianity is hardly convincing for a free-thinker like me.

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #24 12-31-2001, 10:38 AM

:

Originally posted by Daniel Brown:
If God is all-forgiving, then why would there be a hell? I mean, if you're an athiest all your life, then you die and meet God and you're like, "Whoops"... Wouldn't God forgive you?

No. Because what you did in this life, refelects what your going to spend eternity.

You can ask for forgiveness, get baptized and submit your life to God now. But when you die, that's it. It's too late.

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #25 12-31-2001, 10:45 AM

:

Originally posted by Rettick:
Yes, but those who are unbaptised go to Hell without fail, even if they are the nicest people in the world.

Yes, because that means, that you don't want Christ in your life, and your not sorry for what you have done in your life.

If your baptized, it's like saying

"I submit my life to Christ, I don't want to be the old person anymore. I believed that you died in order to save my life. I want to be obedient"

Which also, you would have better communication with God because God does not hear a sinner's prayer.

Because in order to get to God, you have to go through Christ.

Rettick, there will be no one who is perfect and the nicest person in the world except Christ. Everyone has fallin short on the glory of God.

So SeaRex, I canProve that.

So people like Hitler, are not in heaven.

[ December 31, 2001: Message edited by: PinkHaired Mudokon CWR ]

Sl'askia · #26 12-31-2001, 12:16 PM

so basically...you are saying that me, Rettick, Gluk, and a few others are all going to 'hell' because we don't believe in your 'god'? Thats F*cked up. 'God' gave us free will, and the free will to not believe in him.
You said before in another topic that you were not forcing your religion on us. Well saying sh*t like that is forcing your religion upon us IMHO.
Here's something for you to chew on: There are indian tribes in South America that have never been exposed to 'your' religion...tell me...are they going to hell?
Here's something else that bugs me.
I know of several Christians (one of them very religious...almost got me to read the bible again more carefully. Note the 'almost'.) that play RP games (AD&D, OW RPG and the like). Now I know there are 'christians' out there that say that playing games like that condems you to 'hell'. Tell me...do you feel this way? (just curious).

Steve · #27 12-31-2001, 12:22 PM

so pinky what your saying is that babys who get babtised without realiseing it's "importance" are thinking and I quote "I submit my life to Christ, I don't want to be the old person anymore. I believed that you died in order to save my life. I want to be obedient"

Sl'askia · #28 12-31-2001, 12:43 PM

Babies don't have the 'awareness' (for lack of a better term) to know what baptism means...so how can they understand what the ritual means? I think its more for the peace of mind of the parents if you ask me...
Oh and here's a shocker for you...I was baptised and I went through 'Conformation' (I don't remember what it is called exactly...but it is supposidly the last step in becoming full Roman Catholic). The 'big' difference was that I was forced to go through with it. Well yes I technically willing as I went along with it...but thats because I didn't have the guts to tell my parents that I didn't want to be a part of their religion.
This goes back to the free will thing...would 'god' really try to force someone to follow him? That sounds like a bully if he does.

PinkHaired Mudokon CWR · #29 12-31-2001, 01:45 PM

:

Originally posted by Dragadon:
so basically...you are saying that me, Rettick, Gluk, and a few others are all going to 'hell' because we don't believe in your 'god'? Thats F*cked up. 'God' gave us free will, and the free will to not believe in him.
You said before in another topic that you were not forcing your religion on us. Well saying sh*t like that is forcing your religion upon us IMHO.
Here's something for you to chew on: There are indian tribes in South America that have never been exposed to 'your' religion...tell me...are they going to hell?
Here's something else that bugs me.
I know of several Christians (one of them very religious...almost got me to read the bible again more carefully. Note the 'almost'.) that play RP games (AD&D, OW RPG and the like). Now I know there are 'christians' out there that say that playing games like that condems you to 'hell'. Tell me...do you feel this way? (just curious).

I'm not telling you what to do Dragondon so stop putting words in my mouth. I'm just telling you what thus said the Lord so there is no need to get mad at me.

Yes, God did give you free will. In order to go to heaven though, you have to believe in him. How can you say you wanna go to heaven when you don't even believe in a heaven? My Gosh, it's like you want people to force you to believe in christianity. I don't. You can believe in whatever I'm jsut telling you the truth.

I mean, it's not too late or anything. If your dead, it's too late because God's going to judge us what we did on this Earth.

No, playing games are not evil. Unless it's gambling, casinos, tarot readings, and all those psychic games. Unless they don't lead you into sin or anything.

People who never were exposed to believe in God, well, God has a say on that. Just like he has a say in people who want to be with God, but die before even getting baptized. I'm not sure on that either.

Well, here's something for you to chew on:

What would you do if you find out there is a God? Are you going to try to argue him down? When if there is a hell? People getting tourtured for eternity? Are you going to argue him then also if you never believed in him?

[ December 31, 2001: Message edited by: PinkHaired Mudokon CWR ]

SeaRex · #30 12-31-2001, 02:03 PM

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Originally posted by Rettick:
I meant that, according to Christianity, you have to be baptised to go to heaven.

Really? Did you actually read this in the Bible, or did you just get that impression over-devout Christians?

Perhaps it is only Christians that go to Heaven or Hell. That would partially explain the whole Baptism = Heaven thing. Mabey ppl of other religions just die. Or perhaps they go to their own veiw of Heaven or Hell. I, of course, can't back any of this up though...