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  #1  
01-05-2009, 10:52 PM
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Jesus Parables

Are these things supposed to make sense or am I just dense?

Seriously.

I kinda get the Tortured Debtor one, but all the others seem like they're missing a punch-line.

Has there been any real progress towards understanding these things from a scholarly perspective?
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Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.
If we were girls, we could get popular by doing anything:
rock band, jazz band,
karate, kendo, mahjong, cyborg, synchronized swimming...
On the other hand, high school boys are
useless outside battle and sports anime.
But they're recklessly trying to make a slice-of-life anime about us.
Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.

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  #2  
01-06-2009, 03:36 AM
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These are certainly not the translations I used, and I went to a Catholic primary and secondary school.
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  #3  
01-06-2009, 12:50 PM
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So what did those ones say? did they make more sense?
__________________
Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.
If we were girls, we could get popular by doing anything:
rock band, jazz band,
karate, kendo, mahjong, cyborg, synchronized swimming...
On the other hand, high school boys are
useless outside battle and sports anime.
But they're recklessly trying to make a slice-of-life anime about us.
Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.

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  #4  
01-06-2009, 02:03 PM
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In the Parable of the 'Harsh master' he wasn't harsh and he chided the servant because he failed to do anything with what he was given, the moral of that story was that God gives us talents such as musical aptitude or academic skills and we must make the most of them to appease him, the first two slaves used their abilities to increase their given sum exponentially and thus found favour with their master, as above so below etc etc.

In the second parable I distinctly remember a lack of torture, and that the overriding message of the story is that we must show others the mercy shown to us by God, the old Golden Rule of Catholic education: Do unto others as you would like them to do unti you.

I'm afraid to say that the other two are so different from anything I learnt that I can't recognise them, maybe you could get a better analysis of Splat. My family hasn't owned any bibles for years.
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“I always believe the movies I've made are smarter than the way they are perceived by sort of mass culture and by the critics,” Snyder said, a statement he immediately followed by saying, “Also, ‘It looks like a video game.’

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  #5  
01-06-2009, 02:30 PM
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Firstly, don't accept the Brick Testament as representative of Biblical teaching; the guy behind it all claims to be a pastor, but he's not a qualified pastor and he generally picks up intentionally on passages that look controversial, particularly by taking them out of their context. Also, he's given his own titles to the parables.
However, I will try and explain them. I'll be using another source for the Bible because I'd rather not go through things one verse at a time, but I'll try and have a quick look through the Brick Testament versions to see what he's done.
Just for a note, Jesus' parables are often hard to translate and I may not be right on every point; some people will read them differently, and there may be more than one true interpretation, which is one of the several reasons Jesus used parables instead of just telling people things (another is because hearing about people fighting and stuff is more interesting than a guy just lecturing you). They're often hard to understand, but by comparing them with the rest of the New Testament (the chunk on the Bible written after Jesus' birth) we can come to understand them. If something contradicts another part of the Bible, you've probably translated it incorrectly.
The other thing to note is that Jesus was a very good public speaker and he knew how to get people's attention. If Jesus talked about blood and murder, people would remember better than if he lectured, or gave less 'Hollywoody' metaphors. Some of the parables will be emphasised to be controversial, which Jesus did to get people's attention.
Some of these parables deal with somewhat hard-core stuff, and while I'll try to avoid jargon, I will still be talking about big, challenging Christian issues. Probably the most important thing to say now is that God, as our creator, is the one, rightful King over us; he ought to rule and we ought to let him; he won't treat us harshly because he loves us even more than we love ourselves (which is saying something!). We, however, will spend most of our lives making ourselves rulers of our lives, doing our own thing and rejecting God. This is what Christians mean by sinning. Since Jesus died, we've been given the opportunity by God to be forgiven of our sins and go back to worshipping him.

I've given each a link to a clearer passage, and it's real name.

Harsh Master (Biblical name: The Parable of the Ten Minas (minas is currency the servants were given))
Jesus is referring to himself here; he gives his followers a deposit in telling them about him, and then goes away. While he's gone people will deny him and his right to rule as King.
When he comes back at the end of the world, he will address his servants. Those who have been open about their belief in Jesus and who have done their best to live according to his law will be rewarded. People who haven't, and those who denied him, (his enemies) will be rejected from Heaven.
Jesus has given Christians a gift that is salvation from our sins; we have to use it to bring glory to him and tell others about him.

Tortured Debtor (The Parable of the Unmerciful Servant)
I've included a few more verses in the link in the parable title, which the Brick Testament omitted. This story is about forgiveness. Quite simply, if we are not willing to forgive one another, then why should we expect Jesus (the king) to forgive us?
The difference between us and the first man is that we can never work off the debt that we owe God; we need his forgiveness.

Many Murders (The Parable of the Tenants)
This parable appears in two of the gospels (the books of the Bible about Jesus life). I've linked the one from 'Matthew', which is slightly more compressed than the other version.
God created the Earth and gave it to humanity to look after. We're told this in Genesis, the first book of the Bible. But then people rejected God and did their own thing. Eventually he sent prophets (the servants) to talk to the people and call them to join God, but one by one they were all rejected by mankind, some of them even killed. The Jews would have been familiar with these stories and would easily have seen this meaning in the parable, as the stories of many, many prophets are told over several books of the Old Testament (Jewish Scripture) (some of those books are Judges, 1 Samuel, 2 Samuel and particularly 1 Kings and 2 Kings).

Eventually God sent his son, Jesus, to talk to mankind. Here Jesus prophecied about his own death; he tells the people that he will be killed, that the tenants killed the owner's son.
Jesus is telling this parable to pharisees, the Jewish religious leaders, the people in charge of God's Nation on Earth. Through this parable he was condemning their sin. In the version of the passage I linked to, he asks his audience howthe owner should treat the tenants. They answer,
'"He will bring those wretches to a wretched end," they replied, "and he will rent the vineyard to other tenants, who will give him his share of the crop at harvest time."'
In saying this the pharisees were condemning themselves, which they realised later.

Unpopular Banquet (The Parable of the Wedding Feast)
Once again, Jesus is telling this story to the Pharisees, this time having been invited to a meal by them.
The King again represents God. He calls his servants, the Jewish leaders, past and present, to obey him, offering them a seat in Heaven. They make up excuses, they turn from God and do their own thing, they disobey their King. the servants once again represent Old Testament prophets, some of whom are even killed by the men. God punishes the people who rejected him.
Jesus' upcoming death and ressurection would make God accessable to everybody; from that time on, everyone, not just the spiritually trained and spiritually clean, would be able to come to God, talk to him and read his word. This is represented by the King inviting everyone else in to his feast. God lets us all come to him.
But if we still refuse to let him rule over us as we should, since he's king, then he will reject us, like the man who did not wear wedding clothes.

Purpose of Parables
This is probably one of the toughest passages in the Bible. First thing, Jesus is most definately not saying that he doesn't want people to be saved; we know this by looking at the rest of the gospels where it is made clear that Jesus most certainly did want people to be saved, and even earlier in the book of Mark than this passage, Jesus had been forgiving people's sins.
Jesus is deliberately mysterious here, saying things that don't make sense compared to the rest of his teachings and actions, and what he;s saying can be translated in different ways. It will be translated differently by many people, and I've attempted to give a possible explanation here.

When Jesus talked about the 'Mystery of the Kingdom of God' he was referring to himself. The Kingdom of God on Earth, God's reign on Earth, was established by Jesus when he died on the Cross and rose back to life. The Kingdom of God on Earth today is Christians; his people living on Earth (God's Kingdom is people, not a geographical area). In this passage Jesus was talking to his disciples, people who were already members of the Kingdom of God, and Jesus explained his parables to them later on. 'Those on the outside' would seemingly refer to everyone who wasnt one of his 12 disciples. But since then, the Kingdom has grown, to the number of Christians today.

Because the number of 'insiders' has grown, it would suggest that what Jesus is saying is particularly refering to the people back then. There's also the fact that we can understand the parables now, through translations written in the Bible, though word of mouth and through information passed between people, for example like I've translated several parables in this post.

When talking to the pharisees, Jesus was talking to people who all their lives had been hearing God's word but never understanding what it meant, and now when they were face to face with Jesus (who was God), they saw God but did not perceive, did not recognise him. Jesus was setting himself up for the fall; he was preparing the way for his own Crucifixion, which in turn allowed for the forgiveness of sins for all people, not just those who sacrificed and were spiritually clean (as in 'Unpopular Banquet'). If the pharisees had repented of what they were doing wrong, then the Crucifixion would not have happened and very few people would have been saved. It's enough to say that being saved before Jesus died was a lot harder than it is now.


Hope this has made things clearer for you, Ghost. Sorry I can't give a definitive answer for that last section, but still I hope it helped, and the rest of it helped. I tried to be clear, but if anything confused you more let me know
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Last edited by Splat; 01-06-2009 at 02:50 PM..
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  #6  
01-06-2009, 02:45 PM
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I now prefer the Parables of Zarathustra, though I've always mostly admired the teachings of Jesus in their purest versions.
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  #7  
01-06-2009, 03:30 PM
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That makes a lot more sense, thanks.
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Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.
If we were girls, we could get popular by doing anything:
rock band, jazz band,
karate, kendo, mahjong, cyborg, synchronized swimming...
On the other hand, high school boys are
useless outside battle and sports anime.
But they're recklessly trying to make a slice-of-life anime about us.
Ah, we are high school boys,
the miserable high school boys.

Reply With Quote
  #8  
01-06-2009, 04:35 PM
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Jesus christ Splat, chill out.
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  #9  
01-06-2009, 04:43 PM
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You have clearly not read the Gospel According to Biff.

Why yes, I did need to quote his entire post.

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