Silly person, the 1st ammendment only protects porn and flag burning.
 

Well, in schools you can't say the pledge of alliegence anymore. Why? How can you argue this on constitutional grounds.
You see, there's this little thing called the first ammendment.
People can say whatever the hell they feel like
If I want to say the pledge of alliegence, I say it. If I don't I don't. Don't believe in any god like those peculiar 2 percent of the world. Fine. don't say it or modify it.
Chant the friggin communist manifesto for all i care. But don't bitch and moan and ruin it for the other 98 percent of the world who believe in God or who believe in odin or zeus or Bill Gates(applies only to bil gates)
And, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the supreme court rule that the pledge isn't compulsory.
DON'T SAY THE DAMN THING IF YOU DON'T WANT TO SAY IT!
Also, under the ten ammendment, isn't it illegal for the government to even be involved in education in any way shape, or form.
Then why do we have dickheads saying the pledge anyways. Why do atheists even have to pitch a hissy fit over this? And is it really that big a deal.
God, in this one nation under God, you know the
Supreme triune God, who is God over all of us, can't we find something else to brawl over.:fuzconf:

Re: Silly person, the 1st ammendment only protects porn and flag burning.
 

1. If other kids say it and kid A doesn't then kid A may feel excluded. That's wrong.
If kid B says it and nobody else does, kid B will feel excluded. That's wrong.
A non-exclusional way to do it: let them say it in their own time but don't force or encourage them to.

2. That's a stupid idea.

Re: Re: Silly person, the 1st ammendment only protects porn and flag burning.
 

No it isn't. The government shouldn't be intertwined with the school system. I'm not saying we shouldn't learn about the government in school, I'm saying that they should back off.

I don't even say the pledge anymore. I do stand up and place my hand over my heart, but I don't say anything. Because that's what the flag means to me, nothing. This works because I'm being polite and showing the flag respect, but I'm still keeping my dignity. People don't notice I'm not pledging, so I don't feel excluded.

Some of you people in other countries may not know this, but America came too damn close to praying in schools during the Reagen Administration. And not praying to respective gods or no praying at all, it would have been force praying on the Christian God. Can you imagine what a violation of human rights that would be? The pledge may be a bad show of patriotism, but it least it isn't forced praying. It seems they've got the forced praise to a subliminal level, now.

Re: Re: Re: Silly person, the 1st ammendment only protects porn and flag burning.
 

1. Well, I suppose you're right when it comes to America...

2. My hypothesis regarding exclusion was based on younger children. Just in case you knew that and you were making an unrelated comment, please replace the whole of this response with 'good for you.'

3. You (nearly) poor bastards. In middle school and first school we were forced to sing Christian songs. Who's human rights were actually violated? Mine. I win! Where's my browny?

Saying the pledge means nothing. Instead of history about america, the textbooks spout boring multiculturism, are often wrong in statistical ways, and are so boring and vapid that if you take the text and break it down it is less intelligent than a farmer talking to his cow.
Do any of these leftist, "commies are cool"(no offense Dan) kind of clintonite judges care about patriotism? Do we even know what patriotism is anymore?
Why pledge allegiance to anything anymore? Why would a third grader want to pledge allegiance to a country that takes away 50 percent of their money in taxes when they grow up and wastes it on crack pot schemes like the war on poverty.
They pledge allegiance to a country that would have them die in foreign countries being militant babysitters to the world.
A country that bombs the piss out of middle eastern hellhole but gives favored trading status to communist china, who has murdered over 65 million people since 1940!
And think of your governments, what do they do? Meddle in private business' business, making you pay more for healthcare? Take away your right to be armed. Do whatever their hearts desire, like raiding houses without warrent and with kangaroo style prosecution?
**** allegiance to anything.
All our governments do is taint a simple thing and make it complicated.

1. (He's not here). I know what it is - love and devotion to one's country. I'm not patriotic because my country isn't good enough to warrant that.

2. I have plenty more reasons why to hate America. Those two aren't in my list. Here's a sample: Bush, Bush, guns for everyone, Bush, 'In God We Trust', etc.

3. What is the government suppost to do, let businesses do whatever they want? Pay more for healthcare? We pay for it with taxes - everyone gets healthcare. I don't call that 'pay more'. Well, there are flaws in the laws but there aren't too many bad laws.

Really, guns for everyone? I wish! So far I only have one gun, and its a Benelli Nova. Great gun.
What I really mean is, why pledge allegiance to a government. What if they do soemthing illegal, immoral, force people to adopt the veneer of a belief in God? Then what? I don't support anarchism but I think the federal government should obey the 10th ammendment and stay the hell out of people's business. Whatever power they don't have, goes to the states. Also, when it comes to governments there is always the 90 percent rule:90 percent of the government is superflous, 90 percent of what they do is wrong and meddlesome, and 90 percent of everything it does is too complicated and costly.

Does the 90% rule affect the department of fish and game? what about the ATF? On to more serious matters, besides being unconstitutional, forced sayings make no sense, forced patriotism is practicly an oxymoron. And tom, you think "in god we trust" is bad enough to even be on the same list as bush, shame on you.

The ATF? Those jackbooted thugs who slayed theWeavers and the Branch davidians? Damn them, damn them to hell! Steve, I agree, bush is an idiot. He's pegged at 91 IQ, hell, I peg him at 85. And if Shrub didn't even get fifty percent of the popular vote he shouldn't be president. And if all those funny southwestern witticisms he spoke weren't said under the influence of something mighty potent I'll eat his kooky hat. The man almost died choking on a pretzel for Christ Sake, and to say Gore couldn't lead us better in terrorism is a joke. Now on the homefront, thats and entirely different thing.