Problems
 

For some time I've seen a lot of the Oddworld Forums members slandering Oddworld, or more precisely, Munch's Oddysee. Most times the reasons are quite inappropriate, as there are many reasons that can be justified to why this so called tradegy of a game is not such a tradegy.

I've created this topic as I know that a lot of the older forum users no longer find any interest in Oddworld anymore. Namely they blame it all on Munch's Oddysee, and how it has let down Oddworld's stance on a lot of our worlds many problems. I'd like all these people to post here what you don't exactly like or what you find wrong about Oddworld (or Munch's Oddysee) and I would be more than happy to reply with a suitable answer to those things you find wrong with it, and hopefully other Oddworld liking members will also reply with answers too.

On another note, I do not wish to have this topic turn into a topic where people will have there opinions slaughted. This topic simply is to try and justify the reasons you have against Oddworld, and to make sure a true response is given.

Alcar...

Uh oh, I can already feel this place starting to heat up...

Personally, I think that there are no REAL problems with MO. Sure, I'd have to say that AO and AE were much better, but MO is pretty formidable. That's just my opinion though...none of you have to agree with me.

MO was kinda cool at first. Well, very cool. Then again it was the first cosole game I'd played in a while. I went back for the perfect ending and by the time I beat it that way I was sick of it. Then a while later (over doage of Halo) I went back to play it. Wihtout a save slot on every level, it was hideous, and it got boring very fast. Many of the flaws stuck out, and I just couldn't sit through it. I got AO after MO, sadly, and realized that MO was quite different and time consuming. Then AO got boring to me in Paramonia.replaying what I already had done but for the perfect ending in AO got real old real fast, and left me with a grudge that it was rather boring, I knew the stuff, but there was no quicker way etc... Then I tried MO again. I found doing something once, then again but harder, then once again and hating it only led me more to boredom. I just found nothing more to do, and I just kinda thought, wow that was boring. It was fun at first, addicting, but now I can't stand to play it, nothing new, rather pathetic the way it just kinda seems like another boring game now. I have a feeling I may love ME, but then it'll get old to me. I foudn the games brilliant at first, then it just lost interest. Yick.

That is simply your outlook on games, you seem not to like the type of games that Oddworld are. For myself I have not yet played MO, which is a real shame, but I have trust that it will be an extremely good game, as I love strategy type games.

Quite simply, if you found AO boring and MO boring you'll probably find AE boring, it is just your taste in games, that is not bad, it is just what you prefer.

This topic was mainly for me to address issues from others such as how Oddworld supposibly sold out, with all the SoBe and Xbox issues and all the rushing to get MO released, leaving out all the creatures etc, and whatever else you can think of ;)

Alcar...

Re: Problems
 

1: Yeah, it sucked, didn't it? ;)

2: Actually, I haven't really heard any one blame their losing interest on MO. I didn't like MO that much, but it wasn't the reason I lost interest. I still think AO is a great game, but I don't really care about it much any more. I just don't feel like playing/searching for information any more. People lose interest/grow out of things... You've got to understand, that happens...

3. Sounds like you're trying to change people's minds about MO. I doubt you're going to do that to any one, especially since you don't even own it... But some of my problems include: Stupid humor and childish gags in place of the darker social comment in the first game. I mean, come on just listen to what the sligs scream... The 3D. So many are probably thinking right now "Boy, that guy is one tasteless mamajama! 3D is goooood! And so are sentences like 'Hey, buttmunch'! Damn him! Damn him!" Or something along the lines. But I just didn't think that OW works in 3D... Yeah, 2D is old and they wanted something new... It HAD to be, it was an xbox game... But it just didn't have the Oddworld feel. It was too easy, also. The environments weren't as cool as in AO... The plot wasn't as good... Many things.

4. Stupid Alcar, and his crappy old opinions... ;)

Re: Re: Problems
 

1: Your opinion.

2: I know that not everyone disliked Oddworld after MO was released, but there were some. I should have rephrased that to: "reasons to not like MO" not: "reasons to not like Oddworld".

3: Nope not trying to change peoples minds, just trying to justify some really stupid reasons. Finally! Something I can answer, see below answer number 4.

4: Stupid Melvin and his crappy comments... ;) But remember everyone has the right to have an opinion, whether you think it is wrong or not doesn't mean you can enforce your opinions on others as the right opinion.

Okay, as you said you think that there are many problems in MO, I haven't yet played it but i've seen it in action, I could have played it although i'm waiting for the right time. To fully explain this matter it will take some history writing.

Well MO moved from the PS2 to the Xbox so that it could create a better game, performance wise and graphics wise, plus more. As you know Oddworld is trying to get the Oddworld message out to everyone in the world, so having the promos with SoBe and having MO a Xbox Launch title would promote it even more, so that the message would get out to even more people. Same with the so called childish parts of the game that is trying to cater for all ages, hopefully one day the Oddworld message will get through. So if you don't like it quit your critising and play another game ;)

Alcar...

Re: Re: Re: Problems
 

1. I know, I never said it wasn't. :P

3. I have seen some stupid reasons, but my complaints were perfectly reasonable.

4. Alcar, I was kidding... It was just in reply to the "slaughtered opinions" part. I didn't mean it seriously.

5. I never whined about it being on the Xbox. It would have been just the same if it were on PS2, to me. And I didn't say any thing about Sobe... As for the childish part, I would never dumb down a game just to get small children using my name as a household word...

6. Oh, come on... you practically dragged me in this topic, beat me with a stick and forced me to criticize it... ;P (winky tongue...)

Alcar, I realize what you are trying to do and understand why, but could you give it a rest? People who no longer like the Oddworld games can't change their interests just because some of us fans on the forums want them to. Although many people were disappointed in MO that is not the reason they lost interest in the games. If they were true fans they wouldn't care about what MO lacked and focus on the possitive. Plus, there are still many more games to come and seeing how OWI is such a fan based game developing company (something rare indeed) they will do their best to give gamers what they want.

As for MO being bad... I wouldn't say that. Munch's Oddysee was to the Oddworld Quintology what Episode 1 was to Star Wars. A very good movie/game that couldn't compared to the originals.

MO, a strategy game. Ha!

It's as much a strategy game as Spyro 3, Project Gotham Racing or Mario Kart.

well there is one strategy:
posses a big bro and kill all the other sligs...

you are not realy free to do what you want in the game, it's true

I think that making the change to 3D wasn't such a great idea myself.2D was working really well, it kinda lost some of the novelty for me. The competition is important too. If there are lots of games out there that are better and people would rather play them, it makes MO look bad even though it might be quite a good game. People tend to look at the faults instead of the good points in games...

Re: Re: Re: Re: Problems
 

1. Heh! *sarcasm*

3. I never yours were stupid.

4. I know, but i needed to reply to that numbered question :P

5. I know you never whined about it being on the Xbox or SoBe, but its all linked in the end. Oddworld still seems like a challenge, I ask all of you have you found ALL the secrets in MO yet? Or are they too strategicly hidden away? (And im sure someone has found some)

6. *drags Melvin out of topic and beats him with a stick* ;)


1. How do you know that in AO or AE there were masses of things that were taken out, the point is that OWI was very generous with the amount of information that they gave to the public or fans. But when it came to when they had to take stuff out, some got angered. A lot of stuff could have been taken out of AO or AE like I said, but we weren't all that informed.

2. At the end of AO you were able to get the movie featuring the Shrink and his chat with Abe. The Shrink never appeared in any of AE.

3. I agree that spooce wasn't all that neccessary but every game has its flaws. They tried something new, which is a good thing. Whether people like it or not can not be told until the game is released. As you know people hated it.

4. OWI had a deadline to make in getting the game finished so it could be produced and sent away to be one of Xbox's launch titles. OWI up until the very end was still tapping voices, not everything can go into the game such as enemy gamespeak etc, maybe in ME.

5. It is still evident in the game, but im mainly focusing on the Oddworld message. Not the MO Message. And don't ask me to tell you what it is :P

6. Yes, yes you have, thats the longest post so far! :D

1. Im not trying to make them change there interests what im trying to do is clear up some reasons or problems MO (Oddworld) is a bad game. I know and chat with people who are feed up with the bitchin that is going on about the problems in MO.

2. I know that, and I know that some dislike MO while they like the first too games, therefore again its problems with MO that they have.

3. Yes, sometimes it is very hard to have your sequels match up to the originals, or maybe people just set their stardards too high, and when it is not met...well you know exactly what I mean, its the same reason I started this topic.

1. Maybe you are just really, really good at strategy games, I mean you do have lots of Xbox games to practice on ;)

1. I'm sure there are many more.

2. MO does have a preset path, but it is also not a path as such as you can travel around alot! It is preset in the fact that you have to start and end at a preset point.

1. Your opinion

2. "People tend to look at the faults instead of the good points in games..." Absolutely true!!! Look at this post alone and you'll see how many faults people have proposed.


Well, I have got to admit, that is the longest post i've ever posted, I 've spent quite a while writing it too...45 minutes or less.

1. I know, but if OWI were to be mean in the future reguarding the release of ME information then people would also get angry over them not releasing the info. OWI can't win. Maybe it is best to be ignorant of what has happened, so that you will play the game and like it.

2. I know that you were talking about Queen Sam, and I have gotten that piece of text at the end of AE. But I was referring it to a similar situation where in AO the shrink movie gaves hints that the shrink would also be in the next game. The shrink never appeared in the next game, the same as Queen Sam never appearing in MO after AE said she would.

3. Absolutely, although if they do, hopefully it will be better in the way it is used...no more spooce locks or chanting through spooce. You see, even I can see flaws in MO :P

4. I like being insulted ;) Its just a matter of preferance.

5. Again the comparing of MO to AO or AE is evident, MO made a big leap from 2D to 3D. This is always easy when OWI is used to doing 2D programming. But the message is still there in MO.

6. Sure does! :D

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Problems
 

Yes, but the movie never said the Shrink would be in AE, whereas the AE movie specifically said that you would learn more about Sam "when you mee Munch"...

But the "Oddworld Message" wasn't present in MO, and that was the point Rach was making.

So what? This whole topic is about people's opinions...

2: To be honest I don't remember seeing the bit with the Shrink in AO (but then again...I don't think I bothered to get a 'prefect' score...max number of muds I rescued was 93 if I remembered right.). But I think that is because I was more concerned about seeing female muds in game (don't ask...this was before I found out mud, slig, and gluk reproduction was based on ants and termites...which basically screwed up one of my fic ideas...so I had to compramise by making the main character a different race of mud...this was way back when I first joined the forums).

5. If I remember right...there was plenty to mention the 'message' in MO before the move to the X-Box...I could be off though...as I have a hyper immagination...

Spider: you got that right...

Quiet you!

1. When you see a character appear at the end of something it usually means they'll have some part in the sequel, if there is a sequel. Example: Big Face in AO was up with Abe in the Monsaic Sanctum and Abe farted etc, etc. In AE Big Face is there again at the very beginning.

2. How do you know, maybe you looked past it while you were taking notice of all of it's flaws.

3. Haha! I laughed when I saw the part that said "Alcar said this repeatedly"! And yes its your opinion, I can't change it only the person can. What I can do is proper some supposable problems people have against MO.

1. Not your imagination. Like I stated somewhere in this topic before, a lot of things were stripped from gameplay but not the underlying message.


Any more contendors? ;)

I liked MO a lot! I saved the game on each level the first time through, so I could play the levels again after beating the game. This made the replay value grow amazingly for me. I've played through the game about five times. I like MO better then AO and AE, they just seem too old now. Sure MO wasn't all it could be, but the positives over power the negatives. I've anticipated MO for about 2 years and the changes were more then obvious when it swiched to XBOX. I find it hard to believe that PS2 could handle those early screenshots anyway. It is too early into the quintology to judge it. I also find it hard to believe someone could loose intrest in games that haven't even been released yet.

*My opinion^^

Erm...i have no idea what we're going on about here...but have we covered the fact that MO was basically a little kids game, i haven't played it so this is pure speculation but didn't it have stuff like 'Fart Breath' i mean come on, the message is going to be lost with stuff like 'Fart Breath'. It tries to be serious and yet lets itself down immensly by doing sumat like that.

(Again, i have no idea what we're going on about...i just felt that 'Any more contenders' was very provative and so i felt the need to lash out, as it were.)

1. Yay! *adds MojoMan220 to the list of MO liking people*

1. It ain't a kids game, people around your age and older tend to get out of video games and therefore they now seem childish. Example: Im sure you liked Ronald McDonald when you were younger, but now he seems very childish.

2. Jeesh, can people take a joke! Come on "fart breath" was clearly OWI having some fun! Making games isn't all about boring things.

3. The "Any more contendors" thing was just a joke, notice the wink smilie at the end of it?

(1) - No, unlike my un-sarcastic counterparts i do still play video games quite alot, however, i do prefare something that appeals to me. From what i saw/heard of MO it was very kid like, and sounded IMMENSLY kid like (Fart breath...etc) and stars around the head of a character once he has been hit. Something like 'Devil May Cry' or even 'Buffy the Vampire Slayer' appeal to me...mainly cos they have a dark undertone.

(2) - Well...OWI should stop having fun if thats their sense of humour!! Thats not funny...if a teen heard that he would go "O-M-G!! UNFUNNY!!" however, i personally would just be disgusted. And what do you mean "Making games isn't all about boring things" i know it isn't. But there's humour, there's controversial humour and then there's humour that appeals to 6 yr olds.

(3) - I know it was a joke...but it made me reply...so no good came of it.

1. Keyword in what you just said: "Prefer".

2. Im a teen, I find it funny to see that happen. It all depends on your preferances. There is humour in the game, but it is an all round humour. You have to cater for everyone, you can't have the game targeted at the teen audience all the time. Wanting to have a game always targeted at your age group is extremely selfish.

3. Good did come of it, I was able to express my points from what you said.

To tell you the truth, it's pretty funny when Abe farts by Munch and then Munch says "Damn dude!":lol: :lol:

Also most of the enemies gamespeak is quite mature... "PISS OFF!" It's not that bad, but still not for little kids.

Like i said...i haven't played it, so i am only going on what people are saying...and never said anything about the 'Piss Off' thingy.

The humour is what put me off in Munch's Oddysee. Oddworld's image also seemed to change drastically with MO, everything being bright, colourful and candied. I'm sure there's a new audience who appreciates this combination, but most of the fans of the earlier games seem to have moved on.

You have more of an idea than Alcar. He seems to think the game is a strategy game in which you can choose what you do.

Pay attention, Alcar: MO is not a strategy game and it is entirely linear. So linear that the only choices you have are which slig to possess and which intern you want to drop an explosive on first.

Another problem with MO: The mines respawn! It doesn't make any sense for the mines to respawn...
AND since you can pick up a lot of things, why can't you pick up stones and then throw them at the non-respawning mines?

1. Not completely, but as the saying goes: "New times call for changes" or something like that :P

1. How can you be the judge of what strategy is or isn't when it is simply based on MO's predecessors, AO and AE.

2. In the end every game has linear points, hmmm...take Halo for example you must defeat or pass certain things for you to continue on. MO has you do strategic things to get to these linear points on the game. You can not have a completely non linear game. Well, not at this point in time.

3. Sligs respawn in AE, it don't make sense but it is very funny and stupid at the same time, something which makes Oddworld very odd indend.

I hoped we can do more choses...
here you can just choose if you kill, leave or save the mudokons, Eggs and Fuzzles.

You must posses the glukkon and give moolah to the lulu fund.
You must find some mudokons to open doors.
You have to collect spooce

you'r not free

What the hell does this sentence mean? "Proper" isn't a verb... "Supposable" isn't even a word, I don't think...

Ha! You don't make a big deal out of it being their opinions when they agree with you, do you? :p

I was shit-scared of Ronald McDonald when I was younger, and I still am...

The point Chris was making is that "Fart Breath" is a very childish joke, and therefore will only be considered funny by children and childish adults... Still, I'm sure we can all see the "fun" in making a little computer sprite say "fart breath"... Ha ha ha, Wheee!

Why do you make out that anybody else's opinions can simply be dismissed because they are Opinions, whereas you seem to believe that your own opinions are some kind of Noble Truth that can be used to refute any arguments made by anyone else?

See?

No, it isn't. It's childish humour. "All-round humour" would be something that appeals to all kinds of people. "Fart breath" only appeals to children. And you, apparently.

We don't want it targeted at a Teen Audience, because then we'd just have Dawson's Creek in a computer game... (Oh, the horror...) What we want is a return to the original games, which weren't targeted at any particular age group, but appealed to children, adolescents, and adults (as can be observed by noting the wide variety of ages on the forums).

Look, if you want proof that MO is targeting a much narrower (and younger) age group than the first two, just look at us. When the forums were first founded, we got members coming in from a wide variety of age groups. Many of them are still here today.

But look at the people who have joined since MO, and you will see that the vast majority of newbies are now young children. This is living proof of OWI's change in target audience. What more do you want?