Stan "Tookie" Williams
For those who don't know the issue, Stan "Tookie" Williams co-founded the Crips gang in LA. In 1981, he was convicted of the murder of 4 people. The jury that pronounced him guilty was all-white. The evidence against him was circumstancial and inconclusive at best.
But assuming he really was guilty (even if he hadn't committed that crime, he was definitely guilty of other crimes). Tookie Williams spent years in jail writing children's books, which discouraged young readers from joining gangs. According to savetookie.org, 150,000 kids have reported that his books influenced their decision not to join gangs. He was nominated multiple times for the Nobel prize in Literature. Arnold Shwarzenegger (sp?) is the only one at this point who can stop the execution. This is his chance to prove that prisons, in fact, rehabilitate criminals. But no... The governator, who is famous for his rhetoric about the children of California, is reluctant. Aside from the fact that the death penalty is barbaric... If you look at this case objectively, you'll see that Stan Williams has saved many children from gangs, and probably will save more if he remains alive. If he is killed, however, inter-racial tensions, already very high in the US after Hurricane Kathrina, should be expected to rise considerably. Opinions? Discuss. |
You = news n00b.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4523780.stm :
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What a great topic, I thought that [Did I do it right? ;)] he should've been saved. As he had reformed, he didn't even need to be discharged from Prison.
I dislike Shwartz., he just runs on slogans and I don't think he was a good choice. [However that's a dif. subject...] But I disagree with the death penalty anyway. [That too! ^_^;;] - Rexy |
Ok, So i got it wrong he is already dead. But still, Do you think he should have been killed?
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I heard an interview with him where he was asked whether he would prefer to live even if it meant he would spend the rest of his life in jail. He said that he would, simply because as long as there's life, there's hope. Plus, he wanted to continue his work with his books and try and reach out to as many people as possible.
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Tookie has been dead for about a day as I type this. It seems as though this guy was fully reformed and he did a lot of good things with his writing. Regardless, though, he broke the law and got convicted in a state with capital punishment. Some part of me thinks this is a waste of a good human life but he is responsible for killing. I wish he would have said some last words to throw a light on this situation. I sure hope they would have been words of remorse and warning about gangs.
This is a wishy-washy post, its because I'm wishy-washy on the subject of killing convicts. This seems cut and dry to me, though. Hopefully this will be a deterrent to others. The best thing would be a reforming of the entire death penalty system, but I don't see that happening. Too many innocents die with capital punishment and too many obviously sick and evil individuals live with a life sentence. Its drain on society and a lousy situation either way. |
Sure, he wrote some childrens books, but he also brutally murdered quite a few people. And just because you heard someone say that the evidence was circumstantial doesn't make it so. I do disagree with the death penalty, however. The only reason that I would not allow it is that it sends a contradictory message. If someone kills my child, and I hunt this person down and kill them, then I will go to jail. But if the state kills this person it is okay.
As for him being rehabilitated. So fuucking what? Will the people he murdered ever be given a chance to rehabilitate? Or hold their children? No. Fuuck him. He deserves to die. |
Right, This is just info from todays issue of The Sun im just gonna type it all out :P
MURDERER Stanley “Tookie” Williams offered to help his executioners yesterday as they prepared to give him a lethal injection. d up one last time to stare into the eyes of the five friends in the room — and he kept it raised until he passed out. Plungers pressed by unseen hands behind a screen filled his veins with pancuronium bromide to stop his breathing, and then potassium chloride to stop his heart. Williams’s chest heaved several times as he lay with his eyes closed. Then a voice from behind the screen announced: “He’s flat-lined.” Williams — who refused a final meal before death — was declared dead at 12.35am Californian time. Williams was convicted of killing a man during a grocery store robbery in February 1979 and of murdering a couple and their daughter at a Los Angeles motel a month later. He denied committing the murders but has apologised for founding the Crips, a bloodthirsty street gang blamed for thousands of murders in the Los Angeles area. Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger refused repeated appeals for clemency. He ruled in a written judgment: “Is Williams’ redemption complete and sincere, or is it just a hollow promise? “Without an apology and atonement for these senseless and brutal killings, there can be no redemption.” After Williams’s death supporters chanted in unison: “The State of California has killed an innocent man.” Williams has since received support from celebrities, including rapper and former Crips gang member Snoop Dogg. Singer Joan Baez and the Rev Jesse Jackson were among 1,000 opponents of the death penalty who demonstrated outside the prison. Baez said: “Tonight is nothing less than planned, efficient, calculated, antiseptic, cold-blooded murder.” But Lora Owens — stepmother of grocery store worker Albert Owens who was murdered by Williams — said: “He chose to shoot Albert in the back twice. “Albert didn’t do anything to deserve it. He begged for his life. But Williams shot him not once, but twice in the back. “This man fully deserved the punishment he was given when he was sentenced 24 years ago to be carried out.” There you go. Also, This is Minute by minute: Minute by grim minute - how he died 11.59 Williams, wearing chains and handcuffs, is led into the death chamber by five prison guards. He lies down on the execution table and is secured by straps at the shins, knees, waist, chest and wrist. Williams is breathing heavily. 12.03 A medical official inserts into the killer’s right arm a needle hooked up to an intravenous line — the first of two sedatives. 12.06 A woman medic tries to insert the second, back-up line into his left arm. But she struggles to find a vein in Williams’s powerfully muscled arm. 12.18 Williams lifts his head and says: “You doing that right?”. The second line is finally in place. A heart monitor is placed on his chest which will record the moment of death. A saline solution is pumped into the first intravenous line to check that it is working. 12.22 Sodium pentothal is added to the saline solution to sedate Williams. When used during surgical procedures doses of up to 150 milligrams are given, but Williams is given 5,000 milligrams. Williams struggles against the straps holding down his shoulders, arms and chest to raise his head and stare at the witnesses. The former gang leader fights to keep his head raised. According to Amnesty International it takes 30 seconds for the sodium pentothal to reach the brain and take effect. Williams’s head slumps. A witness reports that he is now motionless. 12.26 The IV line is flushed with saline and a paralysing agent — pancuronium bromide — is administered. Also known as pavulon, this is a muscle relaxant that stops breathing by paralysing the diaphragm and lungs. It can take up to three minutes to take effect. 12.30 The IV line is again flushed with a saline solution before a third and final drug is administered — potassium chloride, which blocks electrical signals to the heart and triggers a cardiac arrest. 12.35 A voice behind the walls calls out: “He’s flatlined” and it is over. Williams is pronounced dead. |
Morally and with a few logic reasons (Example: outrageous cost of an execution), I am against the death penalty. But I know my feelings would probably change if the worst thing happened and someone murdered a loved one of mine.
Anyway, I'd like to believe this man had truly reformed. From a Christian perspective, it's definitely great news. This doesn't change the brutal murders and other violence of his past, however, so I definitely believe he should never have been set free. But I do believe life in prison would have been the best choice for such a man. |
Well, at least he died happy, knowing he has caused many, many deaths in his gang.
I'm with OANST, kill dat biatch sucka. |
capital punishment=stupid.
He may have killed 4 people in the past, but think of how many he's saved by turning youngsters' minds away from the gang track. Thats something to take into consideration. |
I don't know about that statement, Used.
That's like saying... Well, this pedo saved 4 children from a burning house and only raped one. |
Screw the death penalty!
Its one of the most hipocrytical things. "Oh he killed them so we are gonna be morons and kill him". Screw you, your being just as bad as him! Anyway, I think he should have been put in jail for life, but not death penalty! I know he himself only killed 4 people, but he started the crips and members of that gang kill people everyday, so baaily he has killed thousands! |
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And don't these two comments contradict eachother? :
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If he would have gotten life in prison, he would have had a chance to write more and more books, and that is what he truely wanted.
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I don't give a fuuck what he wanted. He didn't even have the balls to come out and admit to what he had done.
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Exactly how do you know thats what he wanted Cullen? I believed he should have been given a full pardon.
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Eh, I'm against the death penalty. I think it's a cruel thing ter do. Sure, Tookie deserved to die, but like that? Ugh...I'd rather rot my brains out in a prison cell fer the rest of my life, rather than to have terrible poisons injected in my veins, or to get the electric chair.
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Hey, Used. Did you just say that pedophilia is worse than murder because it will stick with you for the rest of your life? I wonder....You do realize that if your murdered you will no longer have a life, right? And he never once apologized for murdering those people. And one of the people that he was convicted of killing was a child. He got less than he deserved.
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Heh, wow, Mr. Birth of the Crips regrets killing four people, let's all bow down and lick his ass! ^_^
He gets what's coming to him. Not only did he kill four people, but he started the Crips for Anus sake. And Used, you cannae forgive him for inspiring you and your hiphopery. ;) |
Here's a good blog post on the subject... funny and true: http://magnusrock.blogspot.com/
Scroll down till you see the picture of King Kong. That's the beginning of the blog post. |
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I don't like death penalty. I believe Tookie should have been pardoned. End of story. Good night. |
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OK dude, NO racisism please!
Old and not so tasty, why do think he dhould have been given the death penalty, then other people would be just as guilty as him. |
I was in no way racist, foolish honkey. I was merely stating his race. Would you prefer if I wrote 'African American'?
And they wouldn't be as guilty as him, as they would only have killed 1 person. |
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Leto just needs his injection. :p |
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What Rich said also.
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Pwnt. |
Well its how he said "Its because hes black" That really pissed me off!
Forget it just drop the subject, I dont want to takl about this! |
'Scuse me, boss. Shine your shoes then?
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I dont know about you but I've never heard of a children's book saving a life...
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Those books were directed to children to Prevent them going into gangs. And because of that there are (considerably) less gangs, which could kill people. |
Ah right, seems was told wrong. I was told that he wrote books for children (as in childrens books). Also, I didn't read any of the thread before so... meh.
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I wouldn't say there are *considerably* less gangs.... There might be a couple less gang members.... But really, who's life gets changed by a book when you're that young? One book vs. thousands of other causes of someone turning into a gang member.
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And this is why I think he should not have been given the death penalty. If he could have been given life prison instead, he would have been able to write more and more books, thus saving more and more lives.
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Cullen, try and think empathetically for once.
Prison is not the most comforting of places. And you cannot expect someone to just keep writing. Even someone like Tookie would know there is so much more in life.There is no proof he would have just kept writing books anyhow. |