Anti-Christmas Babble
 

I was wondering if any of you have come across any 'hitches' in your christmas festivities this year. I'm not talking about Great-Uncle George setting the tree alight, or the power going out so your chocolate presents for your loved one is ruined. I'm talking about the political correctness of our society.

In my town there have been many recent debates about the use of the word 'Christmas' as it is about Jesus Christ and God. And it is incorrect in a multi-religioned society. So much so that the town center lights have been changed to "Winter Lights" instead of the much loved "Christmas Lights".

I think it's stupid. IMO I can't see how Xmas has anything to do with God [etc] because it's become so commercial.

Does Christmas [for the general population] have anything to do with Christianity? Is this political correctness gone mad with a chainsaw? What do you think?

- Rexy

Most cities have come to their senses and realized that there really isn't anyone out there who finds the word Christmas offensive. And if they do then they don't matter since they aren't Christians and they are going to hell anyways.:) Kidding. The reason that they don't matter is that with so many other things that people could pay attention to or get offended by Christmas would have to be at the very bottom of any semi-intelligent persons list. If it's on the list at all.

I'm celebrating Christmas not Generic Winter Celebration.
For me Christmas has zero to few religious connotations, and it never has done in my family.

Christmas trees. NOT effing "Holiday" trees... there is absolutely no point in calling them that. Christmas is the only damn American winter holiday that I know of which features a tree as a center piece.

It's just businesses trying to rope those pesky Jews and Blacks into buying trees. Bull shit.

England at least, I'm not sure about America or elsewhere, has come up with this big "Lets make the country as immigrant friendly as possible" idea. I'm not saying that's a bad thing but they're going way to far in many aspects and this is one of them. they're so obsesssed with making the country friendly to foreign religions that they seem to not care what they do to Christians themselves, the 'local' religion.
For the millions of unbelievers, I strongly expect they wouldn't care that much if it had been called Happy God Day. So why change the name and in doing so not only trash the christmas music and advertising industries, but also insult and anger millions of Christians?

You're totally right. I don't know anyone who is offended by Christmas at all.

This is like if we decided to rename Passover as 'Happy Tasteless Cake Week' to make it more palatable to non-Jews who aren't interested anyway.

Well its like that in my area as well.

Who the hell cares if its called Christmas? I mean you don't see people complaning about other religious holidays. Why Christmas is what I am woundering about. If anything nowadays I guess it is evil to be Christian.

In my experience only the radical extreme christian morons (I'm not calling all christians morons, in case anyone read that the wrong way) are being idiots about the word christmas, or any other 'outside' word that has anything to do with their religion. Such as GODDAMNIT! :).

Realy, how many people still see christmas as a religion thing? I sure don't. I don't think about the birth of jezus, or the 3 wise asses following a star and stuff. I went to a cristian school for 12 years, have been expected to go to church every year for the school service, so I do know the tale. But as soon as I got away from school, I never saw a church again and barely even celebrate christmas anymore.

Well from my little childhood years of being a minor I heard Christmas is Jesus Christ's birthday. Which for us christians is the savior. SOOOO why would we not celebrate the birthdate of a savior? Real or not.

Well, for christians ofcourse it's a day of jezus... but for most people it's just time for joy in which you get a week or two off from work.

Actually in the Catholic Church Christmas is not celebrated one day but it is celebrated for two weeks. If you think about it Christmas marks the beginning of AD if I am not mistaking. I mean there was BC then Christ was born in the year 1 AD. Is that correct I am not sure about that? Or does AD stand for After the death of Christ or after the crucifixion?

AD stands for Anno Domini, which is latin for "The year of our Lord"

In theory Jesus was born in December of 1BC then the next year was 1AD. In any case the calculations were off and he was actually born in 5 or 6 BC.

Am I the only person who thinks that 'Christman' sounds like a religious superhero; stronger than 20 centurions, faster than a speeding ticket, able to turn water into wine from thirty paces...

Isn't Christmas formerly a Paegan holiday, at that?

Funny how there will sometimes be such a fuss over a term for an item or event, when in reality, nobody truly cares, and in reality, the nobodies who care for some reason are just looking for a reason to piss on someone's lawn.

Yep, Majic. Almost all major Christian holidays are pagan influenced and deliberately staged on the dates of famous pagan festivals to take away the influence of old religions. Secondly, Earth is filled with a lot of people. Shocker above all shockers, not all are Christian. Many have doubts and questions about God, have other gods, or outright refuse to believe that a God even exsists. Christmas is more than baby Jesus now, okay? Its turned into an all-encompassing consumer and cockle-warming orgy, a Unitarian beast that cannot be fed. Call it "Holiday" because thats what it is. A Jewish sect doesn't have be-all/end-all ownership rights on a date that wasn't even theirs to begin with. Happy Holidays, from my Devils' Advocate heart to yours.

erm. I know what you're trying to say but Christianity hasn't been able to call itself a Jewish sect since they started telling the Romans they didn't have to be circumcised to join back in about 100AD. (seriously, that's when the rift occurred)

There are actually some people out there who call themselves Judeo-Christians (not Jews for Jesus, in case you're wondering) who say that they practice Christianity as it was when Jesus was alive, before his followers (allegedly) took it in another direction. So their practices are basically Jewish with some of his teachings brought in.

But anyway, my point is to quit with the Christianity = Jewish sect thing. That's offensive to Jews and probably to plenty of Christians as well.

Sect
A group of people forming a distinct unit within a larger group by virtue of certain refinements or distinctions of belief or practice.
A religious body, especially one that has separated from a larger denomination.
A faction united by common interests or beliefs.
Its a proper use of the term. Messianic Jews, the group you referred to, are a sect. A distinct unit within a group. Its refinement and destinction of belief is that the Messiah came.
And you know what? I don't care if people take offense to that correct word usage. I'm a proud member of a sect myself. All Protestant denominations are sects from the one of the first, and certainly the largest, branch of Christianity.
Oh, did I just piss off some Messianic Jews in this piece? My bad.
Happy Holidays.

Hmm, well, according to someone at school. I can't celebreate Christmas, listen to Christmas Carols, or be active in any of the other Christmas traditions. All because I have no religion.

Used, your school... That's stupid, and ignorant.

Lol at Statikk.

- Rexy

Did he mention breathing? Is breathing allowed?

But you can, as christmas is celebrated by everyone. Even muslims and sikhs round here get x-mas presents.

You know what, it really pisses me off how Chirstians are getting pissed about how the media is saying "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas."

What a load of shit, This time of year covers other holdiays, such as Kwanza and Jannuka (or however you spell that).

I beleive Christmas has evolved into a more global holiday (so now it iz l1ke LuKe!!!!1111!!!one) and will probably be renamed something like Global Day in a few hundred years. I mean, in all ignorant honesty, who DOESN't celebrate Chirstmas? It's linked itself to the world society too much to not be celebrated. Those damn Christians can't hord all of the holiday for themselves.

I don't celebrate Christmas and I think you'll find that outside of the US where Christianity is practically a state religion, few people of other religions do.
You've bolded the wrong words here. You should have bolded "within a larger group" because Christianity is NOT within Judaism and has not been for the last 1900 years. And the two religions are certainly not united by common interests of beliefs, even though they may share some holy texts.

In addition, I was not referring to Messianic Jews as they classify themselves as being Jewish (whilst other Jewish people classify them as being Christian). The group I was talking about call themselves Judeo-Christian and classify themselves as being Christian.

Well, shoot, I would like to tell people in my line at the grocery store (I'm a cashier) Happy Yule. It's the original holiday that the christians copied. The christians made the pagans look like into devil worshipers and satanic, when they don't even BELIEVE in the damn devil! It's a nature based religion, and because the christians thought someone's views were different than theirs, they decided to but a negative stigmata on the pagans. Pagan religions celebrate the turning of the seasons in Sabats and Esbats, that actually occur on the day of the solstices or equinox. So, Yule is actually on Dec. 21st this year, whenever winter officially begins. It celebrates winter and the coming of spring. --Just another holiday to throw in there! ;)

Christmas is by all rights, a mockery of Christianity... it demonstrates the sheer lack of tolerance and respect for the beliefs of others, by originating from a time when the christian church assimilated all other cultures and religious practices. To celebrate christmas is to celebrate closed minded intolerance.

Okay. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. It's all relative, my friend. Everything in our lives can only be what we want it to be. You say that Christianity is intolerant, but you are intolerant to Christianity. 99 percent of religions believe that they are the only true religion. You have probably had Christianity shoved down your throat, so you strike out against that. Muslims are no different. Or pagans. Or Hindus. Most of those religions don't try their damndest to convert people, however. And if you think about it, you ought to appreciate the fact that these people care enough to try to save you from what they believe will be an eternity in torment. They take time out of their day to do what they think will help you.

Buddhists don't try to convert people. They just live in temples where they learn to be ninjas and do extreme origami.

I celebrate at christmas, but only because my family do, and we aren't christians, we're heretics (me and dad) or agnostic (mum).

That would be a badass t.v. show. EXTREME ORIGAMI! Special Las Vegas episode.

No I'm not! What have I ever done to christianity? Just because I point out the fact that christians have a history of being incredibly intolerant, doesn't mean I'm being intolerant to christianity.

What? It's not shoved down my throat at all.

That's rediculous. That's actually the kind of thing that these people get in their heads... that's why they're so intolerant, because they think they're doing everyone a favour.

There is no excuse for it. None. I don't force my beliefs on other people, and I would appreciate it if they did the same.

But that is the point. They truly believe that if you don't come over that you will go to hell. It is extremely intolerant to get upset with someone who is trying to save your soul.

But it's even more intolerant to truly believe that everyone who doesn't agree with you is going to hell.

Damn, I'm glad I'm in a religion that bans missionarising (if that's a word).

That is isn't intolerant. It's stupid, maybe. I'll give you that. But if you believe something and there is another belief that is completely contradictory to your belief it is well within the realm of tolerance to think that you are right. Intolerance would be WANTING people to go to hell because they belong to a different religion. Thinking that they will and trying to help them is not intolerant.

Enlighten me about heretics. I forgot... what they do.

Mostly, they engage in acts of heresy.

I've just had a word with my Dad who is a christian, and he says that basically the only person who saves your soul is God himself. People cannot believe without having a personal experience. Educating people about Christianity puts them in a place where they will be able to make the right decision if they have a religious experience, or they come across something inexplicable that can only be explained as an act of the christian God, due to relevance that they would not have noticed if they were not educated about Christianity.

The same is true for all other religions. It's not about going round saving souls... people should be educating where the education is wanted. It says in the Bible that Jesus himself pointed out that it was counterproductive to attempt to force people to hear things they did not want to or were uninterested in. That makes sense to me to be honest. I'm put off by all these people who try to convert everyone... they scare me in actual fact, as I suspect that many of them are insane.

Getting my licks in on the sect thing: For centuries there were more Jews than Christians, and as Christianity accepts all the Old Testament and their entire New Testament is pretty much this:Jesus was the Jew Savior I'll say that for hundreds of years they were a sect. Then the whole Schism things and now there are more branches and factions and SECTS of Christianity than friggin' ice cream flavors. The Messianic Jews thing is a little harder, but since they teach everything Christianity does I think they're Christians with great facial hair.
Also, Dino, I'll hazard a guess and say your dad is evangelical. Not a big deal, its just some people say that man is born a complete enemy to God and they'll never be able to "decide" to follow God by themselves.They say that the Holy Spirit has to work faith into them. Some people would talk your dad's ear off about that(Dean) but since he believes Jesus lived perfectly and died for the world's sins then 1 ticket to Heaven for him. Its too bad churchs frown on ecumenical stuff otherwise we could all just sit down and hammer it out. 1000 years of "You're going to Hell because you think Z instead of Y" is pretty silly and counterproductive if you ask me.

Sorry, I'm confused: what do you mean by "Jesus was the Jew Savior"?

OANST: perhaps I wasn't clear enough what I meant. I think it's intolerant because missionaries are saying that no-one has a right to a religious opinion unless they agree with what the missionaries believe.

That is intolerant. I can agree with that.