Oddworld facing imminent destruction by money-hungry Glukkon? (hello Lorne!)
 

Given the wretched in-game SoBe product-placements, the blatant disregard for Oddworld's mission statement: "For Oddworld Inhabitants to live in every home" by agreeing to Micro$oft's "Exclusive on Xbox" nonsense, the new glossy and tamed (read: mass-market appeal) look of Oddworld, and the recent fire-fest of top-notch talent (from a gamers' perspective, read: http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=2001-10-08), it seems Lorne has completed his money-fueled transformation into Glukkonhood. The creativity and conscience of the original Oddworld games have been replaced by crass advertising and corporate hacks. Seems to me this spells the end of any possibility of enjoyable Oddworld games to be released in the future.

This quote from Oddworld's own site seems to sum up their new corporate philosophy quite well:
Oddworld's Industrial cultures are at war with the land, with each other, and with themselves. To them, Moolah is all that matters, whether stripped from the earth, torn from the flanks of living creatures, or stockpiled with mechanical efficiency behind the imposing facades of their smoke-belching Franchises. They are short-sighted, greedy, and pushy.

Congratulations go to Lorne and his cronies for reaping the wealth off the backs of dedicated gamers and game developers while killing off a world that was once a fun place to visit.

R.I.P. Oddworld Inhabitants 10/08/01

I totally agree. As Dakkan Blackblade once said, PS2 got OI where they are now, and then OI dumped it. Lorne Cowdung said that MO would be a whole new amazing experience, then hypocritically says that PS2 can't cope with MO and needs a mor epowerful console, when it would be far less painful for everyone if he'd just admit that he sold out to Microsoft's millions.

um...oh dear...

mesa thinks thats a bad way to intro yourself on this board...and ripping off one of our forum members names to boot...

*runs to hide from the impending fight that is about to start*

I don't read this board, I'm not a member of this community, and I don't know of any other members' screen names to rip off from. I just felt like this needed to be said and said in a forum that the Oddworld creators (or what's left of 'em, anyway) are mostly likely to read. I apologize if anyone thinks I ripped off their name -- it was just an obvious alias to go with the post. I'd much rather the discussion was focussed on real issues (or as real as any video-game related issue can get!) rather than ridiculous rants about my stealing someone's screen name.

ah ok...forgive for accusing you of it then. Now if you'll excuse me...*goes back to digging her fox hole*

Dementa: Does she always overact like this?

Spider: not normally...I think her pessamissic side came out...

*pokes head out* I heard that..

Spider: *grins innocently*

Dementa: *snickers*

Guys guys guys chill man all of a sudden you guys are gettin so pissed with O.I just caus they put sobe into their game I dont get it and now you guys are making up excuses that lorna is just after the money, man no offence but that is pathetic once again no offence, :mad: but but guys I think it is kinda cool that sobe is in M.O I wonder what it does to abe or munch?So chill!!! ;) :)

It's time to flame this dumb glukkon.

Oddworld Inhabitants is a company. They are not making these games for free, or for there health. It takes a lot of money to put out games. Of course they are doing it for the money...But it's a lot more than that. Put it this way - as long as they come out with Oddworld games, I will give them all my money. :p

well, i dont know if I would give them ALL MY MONEY, but why are people so dedicated to Sony? I realize that it sucks for people who already bought a PS2 and cannot afford another system, I'm on eof those people. (I almost have enough for an X-Box, but then there's Munch's Oddysee itself) But when you look at it, there should be one universal system that one can play all games on, and i'm not talking about the PC. System wars suck big time: they divide people on dumb issues, we should really concentrate on the quality of the games by creating one universal system.

Of course this will never be done because Sony will not make its millions just lisensing games. Nor will any of the other console companies. What we should not do is fight over each other about the systems, we should fight over each other about the quality of the game. And since Munch is not quite out yet, I dont think anyone should complain about it.

*applands Mr. Boj* Thank you! That is EXACTLY how I feel about all the console bashing going on! We should be worrying more about the quality of the games then which system will kick the others A$$'s!

you can't make a game without capitol!

- need i say more?
if yes, tell me and i'll explain it...

--------

you've been told you ripped off someone's name...hmm who could that've been...
i don't blame ya, i made mine up by using 2 rhyming words related to Odd...'Gluk' - as in Glukkon and 'Schmuck' from the what happened in the last game FMV of AE...

Oddworld Inhabitants is a hard-working group of people dedicated to bringing people entertaining games with heavy morals in them. If they decide to do what's best for the fans, then they'll do it. If they want to make the best game they can possibly make, they make it. And, darn it, they have.

I respect everyone's opinion and try to see their point of view, but I doubt 'imminent destruction' is a result of loyalty to fans, or that making money so that they can earn a living renders the wonderful people as 'money-hungry Glukkons'.

And I would not trust a single gaming platform, largely on the ground that such a machine would have no competition, games would not be as good a quality, and prices would be phenomonal.

And I heartily disagree that the theft of another forum members name is 'real issue'. In fact it is a serious problem. Okay, so you didn't do it, so I may seem a bit agressive, but it is not trivial.

[ October 08, 2001: Message edited by: Max the Mug ]

*applauds* GO MAX THE MUG! i agree totally with you man. no one seems to understand that if OI wanted to make money, they couldve mad a lot more on the PS2 by now. see, they could have made Mo for ps2, then a directors cut for peolle buyin xboxs. jeez, they guys have to make a livin anyway.

Look,

I work in software development myself. I know it's a business and I don't begrudge their right to make money however they see fit. It's astonishing to me how everyone has just completely glossed over the firing of their creative staff and instead turned this thread into another lame console war. I don't care that they are developing for Xbox -- this would have been the only launch title that I would have even considered buying an Xbox for. The problem I have that particular issue is that development on the PS2 version was at an advanced stage when they suddenly switched gears and signed an exclusive contract with Xbox. Did it seem to you that the limitations of the PSX hardware in any way impaired your enjoyment of the first two Oddworld games? Don't even start with this "fan loyalty" crap!

The more relevant and disturbing fact is that they fired the creators of your favorite games one month before the release of what is likely to be the most profitable Oddworld game ever. Why do you think that is? To make better games for you? When the money starts coming in from those sales, the ones who profit from it are not going to be the ones who spent long hours and poured their hearts and souls into bringing you the best gaming experience they could. Are you still convinced Oddworld is acting in you, the gamer's, best interests? What happens after the rosy glow of playing Munch's Oddysey wears off? Who is going to be working on the next Oddworld game? Certainly not the sales, marketing, and PR teams at OI who were spared the axe. Certainly not the professional game developers and artists who were canned nor their peers at other companies who saw how OI treated its creative staff right before the release of their biggest project ever.

I'm not trying to start a flame war over whether Xbox or PS2 "rul3z", I'm just throwing a few things out there that you need to know about before voting with your (or your parents') wallets which game developers you choose to support. If MO turns out to be a fantastic game, and I don't see any reason why it shouldn't be, enjoy it for all it's worth, because you're not likely to get anything better in the future.

Knowing Lorne personally, I take great offense from ones who attack him like that.. no names mentioned.. If you all knew him like I do, then you would understand. But unfortunately you don't. In fact, I would fund the whole operation myself just to stop everyone from whining and complaining about a very small item in a very large universe- namely the Sobe vendos. FOR SHAME

Are you even reading what I posted? I didn't even mention the SoBe thing in my last post. I wasn't thrilled by that decision either, but that's not the main issue here. People have been fired right before the launch of a major title! Does that not even register to you? The SoBe thing and the PS2->Xbox reversal are just smaller parts of a more disturbing whole. Before you pick out your favorite silly rant-byte out of this whole discussion, go back and re-read what I said.

Yes, I read that silly cartoon and found it Hilariously unfunny. And where did you get the idea that everyone's getting fired? That's ridiculous. And as for future games-- I've already seen them. They've already got the programmers happily working on those as well as the feature length movie. And I wish you too could see these so that you'd know how good they're going to be, and are already. The people who are mad are the ones who bought PS2s and found that MO wasn't going to be on that console. OHHH WAAHHHH! Does that defeat the whole purpose of buying a PS2? No.

Ah yes. I forgot to mention that the only "firing" that's going on here is Lorne's decision to give the Inhabitants a well-deserved 1-month vacation for the month of October now that Munch's Oddysee is complete. I'd like to ask you as kindly as possible without sounding sarcastic to have your facts straight next time you come through here scaring everyone. Thank you.

Feature-length movie? Whatever you say, but this might be a good time to get back on your meds. First off, I didn't say *everyone* was getting fired. But why are they firing anyone at all? They're going to be rolling in cash soon, so it's not like they need to scale back or conserve resources. Believe me, one month before release of a title, *no one's* going to be "happily" working on anything but that title. And I wish you too could see the yummy, fluffy, flying dinosaurs so you'd know how tasty they are!

And once again, because you seem to still not be paying attention, this isn't a console war. Get over it.

I don't think this is a console war. I think the PS2 is a perfetly capable machine. I'm just saying that I know him better than anyone here and I get inside information. To make good, I'm just going to say, "We'll see who's right." Time will tell.

Ok this argument has gone on far enough, if Oddworld Inhabitants did fire anyone (and I exagurate "did") then thats their buisness, not ours. It may have been wrong but what if thoughs people that where fired where the ones doing a lousy job and not trying to make our gamming expereiance as fun as possible.I am sure Lone would not fire anyone without a good reason I am not trying to take any sides I just think the argument should end before it gets out of hand.

[ October 08, 2001: Message edited by: Oddsville ]

Thanks.

No Problem...

The people at OI want their games to look as good as possible. The only way to do that on the PSX was to make it 2D rendered sprites. Esentially, it was the best looking you could get with 2D.

They want to go 3D, but want to keep that same FMV-like quality. Xbox still can't produce fmv quality graphics, but it's a lot closer than the PS2 is. If another system came out that had more processing speed and a video card better than the geforce 3's, then OI would jump to that system in a snap. But nothing will anytime soon, and so thats why they're making the rest of the games on XBox.

I'm not going to argue or anything (mainly 'cause Pilot,Elum,Max others have already took the words out of my mouth), but if you think OI is evil and doesn't like his fans (cough, hack) then why buy his games? There have been members of this forum that have said basically, over the SoBe issue and some others, "I hate OI and don't want to play there games." My answer to that is more power to ya. If you want to avoid anything Oddworld related and never buy their games, find by me. Oddworld doesn't need fans like you. But if you hate OI, then don't whine about on the Oddworld forums. Deal with it. We like Oddworld here, and know some people don't, and that's fine with us, but just posting on how OI is evil and you hate them isn't very productive.
P.S. Name cloning is pretty bad lately. I'm finding a new forum after Max a Mug and FuzyFuzzle joing... :)

Well said.

Well, it's a good thing you're not going to argue, because nobody here seems capable of *reading* *basic* *English*! I never said anything about personally hating Lorne Lanning or that he "hates his fans". I did not simply state that "OI was evil" nor did I ever say that I "hate them". I gave several reasons for why one might reasonably draw the conclusion that the leadership at OI was acting out of greed, not out of its customers best interests. This *could* actually be the basis of a very productive discussion, if someone actually took the time to read and seriously think about what's going on.

I did not realize this was a forum only for "We Love Oddworld"-type posts, I was under the impression that it was for general discussion about Oddworld-related events.

So I'll leave you guys to your regularly-scheduled console war sniping and inane discussions about which arm the Slig's gun should go on. At some point, I would hope that some of you would grow up to think and act responsibly and reward companies that do the same and punish those that don't, rather than merely be mindless consumers of whatever's fed to you. Isn't this the underlying message of the Oddworld games, anyway?

So, let's all start a happy thread! Here's a topic: if you were a Mudokon that had to have parts of its face sewn shut, would it be your eyes or your mouth? Mine would have to be mouth, so you won't be hearing from me anymore. Looks like most of you have already chosen the eyes.

great wording fuzzy. but listen, people registering and wasting bandwidth just so they can come along and waste peoples time by saying that their favorite game sucks, is well... incredibly moronic. most of the people who come on here and make this kind of topic are people who bought a ps2 and then figured out that MO was goin to xbox. if thats your reason, GO BACK TO YOUR GOPHER HOLE!

Such hostility, a real shame. And may the wind be behind you pushing you far away from here for good.

I'm proud of you defenders of Oddworld, good for you.

;)

Oddworld are pro's, they are creative talents, whom do it for the love and creativity. What money they get is well deserved and just.

Oddworld could have made buckets full of money by sticking with PS2, and then going to a Directors cut for the XBOX. They chose XBOX only for they felt XBOX was the machine best suited to show there creativity in the best way possible.

As for firing of Oddworld staff, that's an unknown to all, heresay to all outside of the actual situation. The series will only grow and mature and get even more detailed and rich with details.

Hey I have a choice if I wanted, to work for any studio in the world of CG and games. I choose my own thing. But if I would work for someone it would be Oddworld due to there originality and talent along with there great creativity, and don't forget "FUN" gameplay.

This perhaps is a disgruntled emplyoee or "TROLL" venting for whatever reason really never to be known to any of us, thank the Gods for that. ;)

Who ever this person is, is being punished already,just being whomever he or she is , is punishment enough. ;)

Long live Oddworld, and yes it will be a great game now a classic later, and it's sequels again will take up the torch as next-gen classics. You see I am an artist myself, and I have a very good eye for these things, :)

Good fight there everbody, stand up for your beliefs. ;)

Hello gang,

I've never posted to these discussion groups before, but here goes. I'm curious where people got their information about the supposed "firings" at OI? I'd like to read the substantiated information for myself to see what's going on.

:confused:

*laughs at Glukkon Schmukkon or whatever-his-or-her-name-is*

I do apologise, but why is everyone getting so mad? It's a game! It's a console! Neither of which I have the funds to purchase! I don't care whether it's on Playstation or Xbox! I hang around here more for the people I've made friends and had lively discussions with than a game I can't afford! It's not like its the end of the world...!

And as for our "silly discussions" - hmm, someone must have read them to know what we talk about... I am sensing perhaps much jealousy from our angry little software developer...

Sorry, I've been watching the news and I think I feel the hysteria setting in.

frankly, i see no reason for this argument. if either side would actually listen to what has been said here, you would both see that there is no real argument here, neither side has really said much contradicting the other...

i have to say, although i disagree with a lot that Glukkon-whatever has said, a lot of it also makes sense, and i respect him/her for being prepared to speak out like that when he/she in obviously in the minority. he/she had some well-thought-out arguments, and i thought the comment about the parts of the faces being sewn up was very funny, actually.

i have a kind of neutral position here, since i am not mad keen on OW really [i mainly come to the forums for the people here] and i can see that [no names mentioned and no offense intended] a few of you do seem to be refusing to listen to what Glukkon-etc is saying. i know that you pro-OW people COULD come up with some convincing and devastating arguments if you thought about it, but most of what i have seen amounts to a gut reaction to criticism of OW.

what is so shocking about the idea that Lorne *shock horror* is trying to make money, anyway? i mean, he's a businessman! of course he's going to put profit first! i am not saying that that is a nice thing to do, but i think we can hardly expect better, really...

oh, and Pilot, i appreciate that you know Lorne better than the rest of us, i am just looking at the arguments that have been put forward and coming to an opinion here.

way to make an entrance, Glukkon...

[please don't flame me for this, i am attempting to mediate]

Rettick: Good show!

It seems that the forumers are not really being the open-minded people they should be. Just because someone has different opinions doesn't mean you should flame him. You've just convinced him you're a bunch of Oddworld-freakish-zealot people. And admit it. Those cartoons were funny.

The persons thing was that the next Oddworld games would be nothing much due to the real creative people being axed. It's heresay, who knows what's up with people being let go and people staying. That was the whole point in a nutshell.

Where is the proof that all the talent have been fired. No where to be seen, if the clown had proof, the clown would have shown the proof, therefore talk is cheap, and bullshit walks.

It's a game. Have fun with it.This is what it's about, not negativity of future games that have no "SUBSTANTIAL" evidence to the clown's statements.

Some of you say you are here for the people, don't forget that for the most part the people here are ODDworld fans.It's a game, the next will be too. Take them all with whatever you feel at the time.This person states that top people that got Munch to where it is have been canned, who says, who is this person? Where's the proof? Sometimes even the best talent move on, and other great talent come in for another project better suited for there individual needs of that new praticular game, there are many intangibles. Stop giving credence to "UNSUBSTANTIATED" crap. At first people were giving the game back up rightfully so, now a couple have soured that pot in my opinion. So very easily giving up on our Oddworld and giving some statement from out in leftfield credence.

We have a right to believe for ourselves what we will, but not one person asked this person for validation of what they stated. All the talent have been fired just before the games release. Where, show me, and if so do not forget the intangibles. People move on from project to project, maybe there individual job with Munch is finished, on and on it goes.

It's going to be a great game, I'll be all over it on November 15th, when the next one comes out I'll be all over it as well. This company has already proven to me it is of a top notch calibur in all ways possible as from a games viewpoint.

Has anyone looked on the other side of the coin? Even if talent was let go (And of course that is just heresay and false until proven) who says new talent have not been hired to create the next chapter?

An unknown come in here from no where and a couple or 3 of you start leaning away from Oddworld so very quickly. What upset still over the PS2 not getting the game, get over it. It's on XBOX, live with it.

Prove it big mouth. How can some of you be sooooo gullible, it's a shame. Maybe it's just the ones that have this anger still for Oddworld and there move from PS2 to XBOX huh, that's it huh?

Anyway, it's a game, creativity deserves it's reward, why not make money with your talent. And as for the people getting fired, show me facts and proof before you go spouting off .

:mad:

Stark you are a very smart dude but for once i am going to have to half disagree with you. The part i am disagreeing is the "Anyway, it's a game, creativity deserves it's reward, why not make money with your talent"
Yes money can by a guy food but THE REAL GLUKKON IS ADVERTISING. Advertising is just the topping over the salary the dudes make. The only problem that i have over oddworld is putting advertising in the game! its ok if they have advertising outside the game but inside is just plain crap.
Talent is something you should cherish not sell out to big brand companies only if you work for them! Stark you are right, you have to see both sides of the coin but advertising inside of the game is ignoring both sides and just buying something with the coin.

my opinion, do not hate me for it!

Apparently the rumors ARE true. The newspost today on Polymer City chronicles, by a guy who actually knows people who got fired from OWI, says as much.

I don't know how I feel about this. I could say that I'm detatched and don't care about the poeple who make the games, just the games themselves, but that wouldn't be true. In reality, this simply compunds on the strange feeling of resentment thats been growing in me since I heard of the SoBe ads. Oddworld has somehow changed from what it was when I was playing Abe's Oddysee and Exoddus, into something decidedly not fun. It's not easy being a fan of Oddworld lately. There's not much for me to like.

Well said, enversi. I want an explanation as to why these people were made redundant.
Oddworld used to appeal to a very narrow hardcore slice of the gaming community, but it's too widespread and mass-market now. (That's also one of the reasons why I was disappointed with Wip3out; it was too shallow and commercial. That's why I'm looking forward to WipEout Fusion, which is going back to WipEout's hardcore roots after the poor sales of Wip3out).

A while back, someone (can't remember who; if it was you, speak up) on this board said that Oddworld looked distinctly less odd in MO. It was less dark, harsh and mystical, and brighter and cleaner than the previous games. He/she said that he/she liked the fact that in AO/AE you were 'the skinny guy with no weapons', but in MO there are things like Spooce cannons, which appear far too powerful to be associated with the Muds in the first two games. It was a far more exciting and satisfying gaming experience if you were much less well-armed than the enemy.

It's definitely too late for OI to majorly change anything about MO. I just hope that they manage to put back some of the AO/AE originality into ME and HoO.

One, two,Middlesboogie States:It's definitely too late for OI to majorly change anything about MO. I just hope that they manage to put back some of the AO/AE originality into ME and HoO.

Have you played Munch? What do you know of originality in anyway within the new up-coming Munch game? How do you know of it lacking originality? You have been against Munch and XBOX from the beginning. What the hell are you here for? Poetry? Go to a poet's Forum.

The heart and soul of this Forum is ODDWORLD and it's games, along with it's favorite console the XBOX. Love it or leave it. You have a issue now and then fine, but you are a "ONLY" negative person towards Munch and ODDWORLD along with the XBOX. You don't like them, your loss, as far as I'm concerned, but leave your negativity only attitude towards ODDWORLD,Munch, and XBOX at the door. You want to talk with friends here fine, do so, but just quit with the "ONLY" negative comments on ODDworld and XBOX. You know a disagreement or two on issues fine, but only negative comments have come from you about XBOX and Munch, enough.

How about I go to a Wipeout Forum and say it's full of crap, just all negative comments on it. That would be a fool thing to do, a rotten thing to do, a waste of time for all. Basically that's what you do here.

Stop bashing. This is a Forum for Oddworld lovers and the XBOX comes with it.

Did you even read properly what I posted? I didn't say it lacked originality. I jsut said that it looks (from what we've seen so far) to clean, bright and garish, copared with the dark cruchiness of the last two.

"You have been against Munch & XBox from the beginning". So what? Just because I liked the previous games doesn't mean I have to like the next ones.

"How about I go to a Wipeout Forum and say it's full of crap" Did I say OI, XBox et al were crap? Did I?

Yes you have. Like a snake in the weeds. You have back-stabbed the game from every vantage point, every thread spills with your negativity of XBOX and in a smaller way Munch. You don't do it in a point blank way, you plant seeds of negativity here and there, always jumping on any thread with anything negative about XBOX and Munch. In a very un-assuming way.

No XBOX = No Munch. They go hand in hand, deal with it or leave. You need both. Stop trolling.You don't like them fine, why be here then, it makes no sense. The heart and soul of this Forum is ODDWORLD and it's partner XBOX, deal with it or get out little lady.

I don't have very much to say, but I think there's far too much speculation and negativity going on here.

One more thing: please be kind to each other.