The Debate Thread
 

Hello, If you have something that you'd like to debate with others about, please post it here and debate! Thanx!

I'd like to debate why you did this, when Off-Topic is perfectly suited for individual debate threads.

I wouod like to debate why thread Ideas are becoming lame.

I'd like to debate why my brand new brown pants have a hole in the crotch.

Well seemingly Grig you have a lot of critics here I won't critisise you on this thread. I will start a debate. And here is the juicy debate topic. Ooh I know I am going to be crucified for this one!:lol:

Homosexuality is wrong and emoral, it should be viewed as a crime aganst humanity. Its a sin, its disgusting and humanity was never ment for it. God did not put a Man and a Man on earth in the beginning, God put a Man and a Woman so they may produce and be fruitful. Who ever thinks otherwise is commiting a crime against humanity and the nature of the Universe. The one thing I can't stand is Gay librals. Their logic is absurd, they seem to think that gayness is a natural occurance which is pathetic! If I had a magic wand I would cast all the fu*king gays into oblivion! Gayness is not Normal!

Heh yes that should be a nice juicy topic to debate about bring on the critisisem Mahahahahahahaha!:smokin:

Dude...no.

I'm not homosexual, but that was just wrong in many, many ways.

Even if you were joking.

It was rude and politically incorrect, and not funny at all.

I'll make fun of people in almost every way except for their sexuality.

Again, even if it was meant to be a joke, you should just stay off those grounds.

Ok I went over board here but I did that to see what kind of effect it would have on everyones opinion here. I am not pointing any fingers or anything. All I am doing is starting something that could turn into a heated debate. And I know this topic does turn into debates on this forum. I am trying to bring it to the next level. Its basically suppose to be politically wrong because that starts the debate. Theres lots to dig into on this so called crime against humanity. But I can most defenitly assure all of you I am not pointing any fingers here and I am just seeing what sort of debate this could turn into. View this as fuel for a debate thats all. That is the point of this right? Basically I am over exagerating here but thats what I intended it to be. If its rude I am sorry and to let everyone know all this was is to see how deep of a debate we could take this to and that is why it was so politically wrong in nature and very rude. It was never ment for hurting anyone though I just want to let everyone know that. Basically its an expierment thats all. I wrote it like that on purpose I know its wrong but thats the point its suppose to be wrong.

Hey, I think that paramiteabe is right! It's sick and immoral! My sister had her heart broken by a gay guy who said that he loved her and he wanted to marry her! My sister cried for 1 1/2 months everyday! That's really depressing! I think it's wrong!

I don't have a soft spot for homosexuals, but I'm not the kind of guy to go around and harass anyone. I do think it is wrong, however I think I'm going to leave judgement between them and God.

I personally wasn't offended by what PA said, but thats mainly because i've lived in a family were that was stated as fact...anyway -

How so? Why is it "wrong"? I really don't get that part...

Why?

1) If you're gonna go on about sinfulness please take all of your sins into account.
2) If you're gonna go on about sinfulness then that means you're going to go on about Adam and Eve. Which was incest.

No, but he also never put Chickens on Earth. They evolved. Are they wrong? By the by, you do realise you can get Gay animals right? Which means that God is, in effect, creating Gay animals. Which would also lead me onto him creating Gay people in general. As well as Transgendereds etc.

Again, if we're going to go on that logic then we're going to have to say God put man and woman on Earth to have kids...and then to have sex with their kids...or for the kids to have sex with their siblings...

Then that means that over 85% of people are committing that crime. The other 15% are the Religious people who are misguided and the un-educated who will eventually die from a Drugs overdose anyway...

Again i revert to the Gay animal thing.

Magick? Doesn't that go against your religion? All magick is deemed as Lucifer's power...and so...that means you would go to Hell.

There is no such thing as "normal"...

My dear, that was a consequence of American society (i am assuming your a Merkin). If you American's accepted Homosexuality and your society wasn't so anti-Queer then you wouldn't get Homosexuals repressing themselves and getting married or having intercourse with females to try and "turn straight" instead they would accept themselves and realise its normal. But because you don't do that then you get gays trying to be straight and ultimatly torturing themselves until they realise it is ok to be gay...that is when the trouble starts.

I feel sorry for the Americans, they say they're a free country and all that yet if a (blatant) gay walked down the street he would get stabbed or shot...atleast here we're left alone...the only time we get trouble is if we kiss each other or hold hands...which is wrong (the getting beaten up for it)

Sorry Jacob, I do like you, but I dissagree with you! Homosexuallity is wrong because GOD sent 1 man and 1 woman here first, not 2 guys or girls! What's the point of being gay anyway? I know that we all sin, but that sin you can't go back on, not ever! Adam and Eve wasn't insest, GOD sent them here to populate the planet, and for there children to do the same. GOD put all the animals on the earth, remember when Adam named all the animals? How do you know that there are gay animals? Do you walk up to them and say "Hey, are you gay?" I think that all gays are just very confused and when they realize that they're doing is wrong, they'll regret what they've done.

Sorry, but this subject is just bound to get people upset, so I'm going to start another debate if you guys don't mind.

Debate Topic #2: Internet Piracy.
Places like Kazaa, in my opinion, are just convienient methods of stealing. I plan to be Writer/Director and I find that downloading movies off the internet is totally wrong. Pirating movies hurts everybody who makes that movie. Not the "Big Guys" as much as the "Little Guys", like the union workes that build sets, make props etc.... Whaddya you guys think? Who's with me?!

Yeah, I don't like to steal movies that people worked really hard to make. Plus XBOX doesn't read burnt CD's. :crying:

Oh yeah, internet piracy. That's wa-a-a-ay more interesting than another ramble about homosexuality.

*yawn*

God, I don't even know if I'm being sarcastic anymore...

Leave my kind alone!!!!...*cough* :fuzconf: ...lmao! :lol:

You're free to come up with something better if you like! :fuzgrin:

I say...did you hear the one about Prince Albert? Yes exactly! That's how, off topic you people are. Listen...this whole gay thing...is just...it's, well it's a way of life for some okay...so stop teasing!:( I'm soooo drunk right now...

Righto. First off
I don't think that's at all physically possible.

If you people want to discuss the gay thing, there are two very good threads open already for that: The one about the bishop, and the interracial one.

I do think that piracy is wrong, but that's not stopping the fact that it's cheap and I'm doing it as we speak.

Now I would like to throw an idea out there on the table:
In America, some places have the death penalty. Do you believe it's right? Or wrong?
I thought about this while watching some movie. I also learned that you spasm while killing yourself.

I'd like God to come down to Earth and proclaim that Gay's are against his 'plan of the earth'.

Gay's as far as I know were not around in the beginning, and thus God/Jesus did not say that they were 'bad'. It is humans that ruin and change the teachings of the religion. The Christian religion itself is pure, it has however been warped by so many into what it is now.

And, God loves everyone in the end. So why should Gay's be any different?

And another thing, all the males that adore and idealise Lesbians, like my God! They are Gay as well! But they don't have a problem with that, now, do they?

Alcar...

Action: Adam and Eve procreate.
Consequence: Their children are born.
Situation: For futher procreation, either Adam and Eve have sex with their children, or the children have sex with one another.
Basic obviousness: Since they procreated further, incest took place.
:)

That's because neither two males nor two females could produce offspring. Or didn't you realise that? Since he places the bare minimum of humans possible for the expansion of the species, rather makes you wonder why he didn't create enough people to avoid incest. That leads to the assumption that incest is morally acceptable, and therefore so is any other sexual orientation.

Besides, once Eve gave birth to a child, homosexuality would have been possible, since there would be two of the same sex. If homosexuality is truely wrong in God's eyes, then there would be 6 hundred million different sexes to avoid the possibility.

Nobody can 'go back' on sin, simply because it's not possible to go back in time and change what we did. It's just that we are pardoned of sin.

Don't get cocky now. Homosexuality, incest and bestiality have been observed in hundreds of animal species around the world. Take two un-neutered Tom cats, keep them away from females for a long time, and they'll have sex, with one acting the part of the female. Homosexuality is especially common in apes and swans.

No, confused is when you don't know or are unsure; not when you realise what you are.

They'll only 'realise' they're wrong if people like you get to them. They'll only regret what they've done if they're foolish enough to fall for it.

Couldn't it be that he was bisexual? I don't understand why her heart broke when somebody said they loved her. Most people's hearts work the other way round.

Sorry to pick on you, Grig, but you said a lot of silly things. However, I can't seem to see anyone who has stated that people don't actually have any choice about their own sexuality, it's decided before we're born, when our brains are developing. Spiritually speaking, since it's God that creates our souls at this stage, it's His doing.

Wait, is this coming from the same America that blathers on about freedom and liberty or some new one that I hadn't previously been aware of? *makes a note that PA is right-wing*

Point the first: You make it sound like people have any choice.
Point the second: A natural counter to the dangerous over-expansion of the human population.

God doesn't hate gays, he's just pissed off at em' cause they found a loophole in his system.

How's this for a first hand testimony:

I used to be homosexual. But God, with a little help from science, CURED ME! After 13 months of medication, I'm almost completely heterosexual.

Well there we go now wasn't I correct on starting a heated debate? It worked just like I thought it would. Ok now heres my real view on Homosexuality. I don't believe in it because Man created it. Its nothing from God thats just what I simply believe. It is a way of life though that some people like to have and thats fine. Thats all it is. We are not perfect God knows that. But God also loves all us and will forgive us if we truely ask him on a personal level. And you may ask then why is there sickness and evil in the world and why do we have wars and all these horrible things in our way of life? Why does God let it happen to us his very own creation?

Simply because we sined against God and we are literaly being punished for it. God simply hates sin but Man sined against God. As a loveing Father to all of us evil and good he loves us as our children of his. But he is a just God and there will be consequences for the mistakes man kind has commited. Just like how children act up to parents in manner of speaking the same is with our relationship with God.

Those consequences are death, sicknesses, the evil things our world conducts, wars, hatred, lust, killings, aldultry, marrage problems, devorce, greed, power, coruption, etc the list goes on and on. The thing us individualy need to realise is that all of it is wrong and we must learn from that to improve ourselves. God is willing to help us we just need to ask him.

God doesn't like sin but he uses that for his will to bring good out of it. He doesnt want us to follow that way of life and thats what we need to realise. He lets it happen so we can realise it. Look at it as pretty much tough love. Thats all it is. Now you don't believe me and thats fine. I am not forceing anything onto anyone. I am just stateing my opinion. But thats what I truely believe on this matter.

Oh, I get it. :fuzgrin:

We also invented the Internet, chimney pots and radish rosettes, yet I doubt you'd question their existence. :p Ooh, it's only humour.

Yeah, I've studied people's many explanations of why God allows evil and suffering. But that's not quite on-topic. However, I don't see how

are consequences of our sins. More like, they are our sins, or at least are our fault.

He-Hee!!

Max has answered most of the queries put to me. But on the Queer animal thing there was research about it, in Gay sheep to be precise. Anyway, these Sheep were studied all their lives and showed signs of homosexuality such as choosing to have intercourse with other male sheep when it was clear they were male and there were other female sheep around(and also the fact they had Pink wool, a camp "baa" and an interest in knitting). Anyway, when these Sheep died they examined their brains and realised that the Queer Sheep had some kind of extra hormone in their brain which the other male Sheep didnay have. Or something like that. It was on 'The Truth about Gay Animals' which was such a good programme...

On the Piracy case...i couldn't care less. So long as i get my music...i do nay care...

On the Death sentence thing - Yes in some cases. Such as Paedophilia and mass murderers/serial killers.

Don't you spasm anyway when you're dying?

I'm just wondering if you religious types will regret your ways when you die and realise there is no Heaven, just a new existance. I'm tempted to end my life early just to see if there is...life's overrated anyway...

Edited...

Bwahahaha!

Well, let me just say that it makes me SICK that people are defending this! I know it's wrong, and unfortunenly not everyone has my oppinion! So what can people do in this situation...defend what they believe so that people can reallize that it's wrong! The whole gay sheep thing, in the Bible it says that Satan's evil minions possessed a whole herd of PIGS!!! That could be happening to those animals, so that people can think that it's ok to be gay because animals are doing it!

But God works through people. He really did make the internet and other things, but he gave the ideas to someone to make.

I don't want to make people mad, but this is dumb that people are defending this! I dissagree with a good portion of the people on this thread, but that doesn't mean I dislike them. I'm sorry if I hurt peoples feelings, but I think that it's good to stand up for what you believe in.

Exactly. Some people believe it's God who is allowing these things to happen to use. It was meant for us not to have sin in the world. Everything was suppose to be perfect. It was all part of Satan's plan because he persuaded Eve to eat the fruit and she shared it with her husband. Satan was to destory and do whatever it takes to allow people turn their faces against God. Did you know, that Satan is actually going after the people who follow God more than people who worship him or who are atheist? It's True. Anyways, Adam's and Eve's sins grew the roots leading to death, lust, violence, incest (they did not commit it at all, that's false), homosexuality, etc. Like the Cain and Abel story. Abel was favored from God because he would always give him the best offering and Cain would give God the bad offering. Cain was jealous of Abel and killed him. Jealousy and death was first occurred here.

Also, the sins that are here today, were out there back then it just wasn't as common because sin was young and it just entered the Earth. That's why in genesis, you would read about people living up 10 900, and the years would go down as sin started to mature.

Satan's plan was to rule Heaven and tried to do it deviously. Satan (Satan use to be gorgeous, he could sing, and was most admired by God) thought, since I am so special, why can't I sit on the same throne that God sits on? God said no, because he does not share his glory with anyone. Satan rebelled and was cast down in Hell. People misunderstood when they say that Satan rules Hell. No, Satan is down there burning like everyone else. He still roams on the Earth and can possess and persuade people, because he is an evil spirit.

Ok, firstly the whole "Satan badness" thing is obviously wrong. "Why!?!" i hear you cry...well;

When God created people and shtuffs and first made Heaven he was forced to allow people up when they died to experience eternal bliss in his light. But, unfortunatly for him, the uncleansed ones who shunned him from their lives would also be forced to come into his light, this would somewhat...harm him. So, with that in mind he had to decide what to do with them and so he thought. Upon thinking he decided it best to reincarnate them. But during the course of a 100 years or so, the reincarnated uncleansed Souls started to fester and became more and more evil with each rebirth. This made life hard for him, he was now forced to watch as these creatures killed from an early age and destroyed the people who believed in him ever so loyaly. And although the deceased were happy to be with their creator, it meant utter turmoil for some of their relatives, who had not passed on, who were going through the grieving process. Now he was faced with yet another dilemma. Let the evil beings that he was forced to shun from Heaven continue their evil spree or design a place for them. They were not welcome in Heaven no more and never would be. So he called a meeting with all his Archangels. From Michael to Lucifer. And he pleaded with them, pleaded for their advice and comments. Upon the first 30 minutes they had all decided that God was right in creating a place of turmoil for them and so that factor had been decided. Now all that was left was for somebody to watch over them to make sure they don't escape and they get what they deserve. Punishment. Again, he asked for comments. Should he create another batch of Angels? Should he create some dedicated humans? All this would take time however and as every second passed more of his beloved children were being killed. So, raising his hand the first of his Angels stepped forwards. Knowing that the other of his kind would not want to step out of Gods-light to rule such a horrible place, Lucifer knew that nobody would volunteer. Yet he wanted to be on a equalness with God. He didn't really like been under him or, most of all, the humans. So, he raised his hand and volunteered. God was ecstatic with Lucifers willingness to aid him and quickly gave him the position of Ruler of Hell...

Anyway, it goes on. Lucifer wasn't able to cope with the overwhelmingness that was the ever-more sinful humans and thus asked other Angels to help him. These included Sin, who he later concieved Death with.

In time the people who read/co-writ the Bible realised that this wasn't exactly the storyline that would bring in the punters. Lucifer and co. would still be beautiful and in Gods light which meant there wasn't really a sense of terror. Not only that but they couldn't blame anyone for the wrongness of man, only man himself and so with that the story was changed. Lucifer turned evil, attacked God, got thrown to Hell and was forced to remain there until the end of the world. This way he could be blamed for everything as could his "Demons"

Yeh, so i just realised that the majority of people who are against gays and such like are Americans. Which makes me thankful to be born in England and shtuffs...phew!!

Ok...i suppose Legion could be possessing Animals and making them Gay, but how would that help with the "evilness" in the world. Its from my understanding that Lucifer is trying to turn people away from God and bring them under his wing...if that's the case then wouldn't he make all animals gay? And then all people gay? Or do something more sinister and constructive than making people gay?

Extract from my soon-to-be game. Lucifer talking with a Priest in Hell;

Lucifer: "Oh no, Legion never possessed Pigs...No. They can't even possess anything. They can turn into people and animals...sure...but not possess."

Priest: "So, what sort of people do they turn into?"

Lucifer: "Survey taker...people. The ones that ask for '2 minutes of your time' and keep you 10 minutes. This makes you late. You're forced to hurry. Your temper gets worse and worse until the people with the inner-nastyness snap and end up doing something Hell-worthy. I had a woman here the other day who had stabbed her husband 14 times because he made a snide remark about her mother..."

Priest: "Any...others?"

Lucifer: "Some Lawyers...not many mind. Erm...a quarter of the Clergy. God wants to make sure that the ones he lets past the Pearly gates are truely pure...most aren't...oh and door to door salesmen. Legion are kinda spread out everywhere...in all professions...testing all kinds of people. You can see through the extra rooms we're getting that work is speeding up and that's due to more sinners...i doubt that Heavens had 10, none babies, pass through its gates in the past 18 months. Whereas i've had millions of new workers in under a week...kinda depressing..."

[Copywrited by me, do not snatch away please]

Damn you Pinky!! Forcing me to Edit, make my post longer and thus make people read it less!!:

Well, if God didn't want to have sin why did he -
1) Create her?
2) Make an Apple tree which was, apparently, sinful?
3) Allow Lucifer to tempt them?

Their children did...

That's abit mean. I'm sure they loved God just as equally. Why did God care about such material possessions?? He created that Jealousy.

Sin was an Angel. She was Lucifers lover, infact. They were not allowed to have a child until they were (apparently) thrown from Heaven, were they then concieved and had Death...

I am going to do more Research on the Angels and such. Apparently it was Gader'el who first tempted Eve with sinfulness.

Edit:
More about Sin. Apparently later interpretations of the whole Demon thing and the whole Heaven uproar state that Lucifer was upset because God had made Lucifers brother, Jesual, the son (i don't know what this means. I'm assuming placed Lucifer second to Jesual.). From his head (who's head?? Lucifers...Jesuals!?!) he gave birth to Sin. And through copulating with her, fathered Death. He was then cast from Heaven.

Also, in the Old Testament Lucifer is referred to as 'Light-Bearer' which is marked out of the New Testament were Jesus is classed as 'the bearer of Light'.

I read somewhere else on that site that Lucifer was the bearer of Death...can't find it now. Site is - Demonness

Jacob, you have your opinion, I have mine. Mine happens to be right, but if you don't see that it's your problem. I think that wherever you got all that info, it's clearly wrong! I know your trying to prove your case here, and i'm trying to prove mine, and I think that if you had an open mind that you'd think that what me and the rest of the normal people on this thread are saying is true. I think that your very confused and if anything sounds like it's proving your case, you'll believe it. I know that Satan is evil and stuff that says otherwise is evil too! I chalange you to read the Bible all the way through, study and pray about it and you'll get the right answer!