Munch's Oddysee sucked, that's all that you need to say, really.

It didn't 'suck', it just didn't hold up the calibre we expected it to based on preconceptions and our expectations of Oddworld Inhabitants.

What STM said.

Let's say it AE was waaaaaaaay better than MO.

Let's not make this into yet another 'Best Oddworld game' discussion. I'm sick of those.

Abe HD, is this being created or what?

Yeah Wil, what gives? You've had weeks to get this shit done already.

Yeah, you haven't even created a thread in FC or anything.

OK, so for an Oddworld game, it sucked.

Yes. But Oddworld delivered a relatively exceptional standard of game play, our cult following is testament to that. Munch's Oddysee wasn't what we expected, but to most people it was a pretty average game. Might I add that while it didn't hold up to Abe's Oddysee, I found that I enjoyed most of the game, I've played worse. MW2, for instance.

For fucks sake, Munch's Oddysee sucked and there's no way around it. People say it's just because it didn't live up to the other games but no that's not true. If Oddysee and Exoddus hadn't existed it still would have sucked. If it wasn't even an abe game and the just replaced all the sprites it would STILL suck. It's an awful game and there's no point in defending it.

For an Oddworld game, or ANY game in the world it was terribly below par of the standards we expect in today's market.

Seriously. It was a shitty game. It was unexceptional in every way except for how much it sucked.

The FMVs were quite good.

I thought the FMVs were terrible. They were pretty, but stupid as shit, and told a really awful story.

How could you not find it hilarious when the Almighty Raisin was just going to say something important and then he just took a nap?! It's as LOL as The Pirate Bay!

You're right. That was pretty funny. I forgot how funny that part was.

Man. The funny.

And when you play the game more, for about one or two hours, and you're starting to forget how great this joke is, they do it again, in an exact same form. Just for you to remember it...

I feel like I have a debt to OWI for that.

I was thinking of the animation actually. I didn't even notice what they were saying the first time I watched them. I was just all "preeeeettyyyyyyy".

But the FMV's in the first two games were good, even by 2001 standards. There isn't anything special about it, especially not the main character, who, for me, was the nail in the coffin.
Exactly.

Sometimes I reckon there's a bandwagon that some people like to jump on when bitching about MO

IMO it is a below average game though

I think the fact that we still talk about MO at all is an indication that there is actually nothing to talk about.

Then what would indicate that there is actually something to talk about?

I am definitely not part of this wagon. I always talk shit about Oddworld whether it's popular or not. But certainly Munch is the most egregiously bad thing they actually made. There are plenty of worse sounding ideas that thankfully never came to fruition though. I mean, thank god Citizen Siege died a slow, quiet death. That sounded horrendous.

...MO not being the subject of the discussion?

I thought the context was talking about MO.

I thought the context was talking about shit. But I always think that's the context when MO comes up.

Agreed.
From the first time I saw the logo with the American flag covered in dollar signs, I thought to myself "Welp, looks like Lorne finally crossed that event horizon between integrity and stuffing his worldviews up our asses".

People may remember how much that infuriated me when it was first found. I just hated it because it destroys suspension of disbelief. What tyrannical, Orwellian government is that transparent about what their motives are?

Was that the actual flag within the fiction, or just iconography for the IP?

Bearing in mind that it's an element of a logo for an IP, not actually the flag of fictionalized country.

EDIT: BM beat me too it, using an eerie amount of similar words.

Stole your idea with a time machine.

I figured it was iconography from the beginning. I still think it's way too on the nose. The only thing less imaginative would be incorporating a picture of George Bush with devil horns into the logo somehow.

It's set in the future. He would be a cyborg zombie.

Also good.

http://png-5.findicons.com/files//ic...xon_s_head.png

So, in conclusion. MO wasn't that bad?

Nope, it was awful.

So, it was quite good, it just didn't stand up to AO?

Nope, it was awful.

I promise you that with Lorne's inability to be in any way subtle that it would have also been the country's flag.

I can't wait until the Steam beta goes public. A week ago I made a thread in the MO discussion forum about how incredible and influential it was, and I want to see how people react.