@PA: I reeaaally hate the way, in every arguement, you ignore over half the points put against you.

Yes I can understand how that would work out to be so. But it wasn't what I mean't. I'm not blaiming you for getting the wrong idea.

Il reply once again... but can we PLEASE end this useless discussion!

Well talk about unthankfull. Its the f*cking Europians (Dutchs guys to be exact) who helped you guys build the country you are now. Or did you forget New York once was called York and was founded by The Netherlands? Did you forget we build that City in the first place till you took it over and is now taking advantage of our invests?

Once again, read above. And to add something: You are the BIGGEST nation on earth, but you guys sure as hell arnt the best, smartest or greatest. And thats not opinion, thats a well known FACT.

Now, can we close this shit!

You don't have to come here if you dislike it so much. I'm actually enjoying the debate.

-oddguy

me too. To add to Havocs first comment:
Just remember who created your nation, and pumped hundreds of pounds into getting it running. Though you was ungrateful at the time as well, what with wanting indendance and whatnot.

I use 'what' twice there, both in non 'what' situations. tsk.

rather pointless post here really. I think I'm bored. I'm gonna visit another forum now. Feel free to ignore this post at your own... something or other.

New York was actually named after the City of York in the County of Yorkshire, England. It was built by Americans. The only foreign thing about it is the statue of liberty and all those that came over from other countries - but they became Americans when they got there. Otherwise they were deported.

Random points and remarks

'I think I was the one that said to stop'

But you didn't apologise for what you believe...so you're free from the fury of spittle.

'C'mon PA, I'm still waiting for my hug...

Pretty please?'

Man-on-Man action!? Naaaayyy!! Hellbound is the way, i say...[if man on man action occurs].

'then praise your own England above all else'

Now, now. Let's not give him England. He is a Russian. Russians are not British.

'Then don't reply retard, as for the rest of you. I think this topic needs to come to an end before things start getting out of hand. PA made his statement, everyone gave his opinion about it one way or another, after that everyone apologised to PA for giving their opinion so rude and now we start all over again. Can someone close this pre-flame topic?'

And how exactly will ignoring disputes make them go away? They'll just arise in a new topic a couple of idea's down the line.

'I am ferious with the Europeans for being a bunch anti American trash. They are nothing but ignorant babies that I hope we bomb the hell out of!'

*Sniggers* Ooohhh, believe me, you do that and your country will be bathing in its own shreddedness. Just think how many countries would take the chance to bomb/attack you then? Japan and China with their masses' of foot Soldiers. Russia. Germany. Spain. Not to mention the terrorists then taking their chances to attack.

'We are the greatest nation in the world and you Europeans are just jealous of us.'

Personally i think that'd be quite close to the truth if you all weren't so drugged up with the Bible...and vaguely stupid...and quite arrogant.

'Did you know the Red Cross said that it was more than 60 percent civilians in the prison? Now they're saying it was around 90 percent civilians! That is really screwed up.'

I wouldn't listen to it. I still haven't heard of any such thing on the news and thus i am led to believe it's the Red Cross being complete arsewipes when it comes to being Anti-War. Next it'll be "100% civilians" and then the Americans will be "bombing Nursuries" and then "getting little boys to sleep in the same bed as them"...oh...wait.

'The Iraqi Extremest killed an innocient man because he believed in God and they were ordered to by their superiors or Government because they hate Americans.'

Well, technically you can say that Rumsfeelingrandy ordered the Soldiers to degrade the Iraqi's...thus it is coming from the Soldiers superior.

Besides, Jonah believed in God, look what happened to him...

'and anti-Middle Eastern.'

Pfftttt, it's not as if they're important or anything. The only things they actually make are...erm...Carpets and beards.

Well **** me. Forget what I said about that, then. It had no relevance. Sorry, Death. The rest was valid, though.

Edit: By the way, I completely disagree with PA. Read into what I say just a little bit. Go on. Do it. You might find something neat down there.

Since I'm editing I may as well post an opinion on the topic of discussion. The Bush Administration really ****ed up here. (I don't think it's fair to say Bush himself ****ed it up. His whole cabinet played a role.)Not only was this a major moral pitfall, it was a total political disaster. How badly could this hurt Bush in the election? I'm not saying he should be thinking about nothing but getting re-elected, but if he were, wouldn't this be a major problem? Why do it?

Phew! That's good. It try not piss anyone off as much as possible. Especially avoiding the wrath of Jacob! :D

-oddguy

*raises hand*

I would just like to say that I never took a shot at PA. I've been a good little boy.

*basks in irrelevance of statement... and maybe grabs some popcorn*

Yay!
Now now, Death. If by "America" you mean those wacky folks in Washington, then I agree to a certain extent... even though two wrongs don't make a right (especially if the wrongs involve molestation and/or decapitation). However, if by "America" you mean the American public in general (which you have only heard about through sensationalist media and news sources and whatnot) then I have to question the... well... the accountability of your statement. This goes back to what I have said about media; it does strengthen our case, because it's your only connection to America.

That's all I was really trying to say. I don't know... sometimes it takes me around three posts to convey my original idea. That probably isn't clear enough, either. Le sigh. I guess I can crank out another post after this one.

Ah! Don't yell at me! No barbs! No sarcasm! :kiss:
Huzzah! I agree!

I honestly enjoy seeing all of you arguing and discussing such topics with the tact that you hold. I myself don't care what happens any more, In a day ahead, if a bomb comes and destroys us all I will simply look back on my life and wince, but I think of you guys and smile. You guys have really been busy with your opinions lately, take a step back and look what you guys are doing. Can you answer?

I have no idea what the fuck got up your ass, or what the hell you're trying to say/insinuate. But whatever it was, it more than rasped at your ability to make sense. (which was never very good anyway)

This whole argument is now lost and I can't even see what people are talking about now. It was about the Iraqi guy killing the American guy, but then it turned into some debate war about how great/crap America is.

In my experience, I have discovered that if you put the word "American" in the same sentence as a relatively unsavoury truth/remark/fact/comment, then all nearby Americans will immediately man battlestations to fend off attackers with comeback character assassinations. Or at least lecture you on the real "truth" of how misrepresented and actually brilliant America is.

Whether this makes Americans good or bad is irellivent in my eyes. All I know is that this entire thread has just added to that experience of the way Americans react to the possibility of losing face.

I'm sorry that you fail to see what I'm saying. I would just like someone to understand, I can't put it more simply. What I said made perfect sense, you just can't see it, and you implied that aswell. Americans are losing face, we already have, we are a a society of people that will crumble under it's own weight (one reason being that 50% of americans are obese or fat... it's a joke, don't get lost). I guess this topic has lost it's flavor, I do enjoy watching you debate over it though, which I mentioned already if anyone can understand. I'll leave now.

The thread started with PA talking about the man killed by terrorists and shown on the net. People said that they were annoyed that the media was making a bigger deal about this than the prison torture scandal because they were both big events.

Then people got upset because, as Staikk said, PA was giving the troops that tortured prisoners "a free pass."

Then it turned into an argument against PA.
Then PA backed out of the debate and said God was with him or something.
That's when Alcar criticised PA for using God as a shield against unfriendly words.
Then everybody jumped on the 'let's say bad stuff about PA' train.
Then some people apologised.
Then PA said he was still mad and that Europians were jealous of America and it's greatness.
Then this turned into an America vs. everybody else discussion.
And here we are now.

Phew!

-oddguy :eek:

No I haven't. You've just made that assumption.

I get all my news by comparing up to 20 different sources if I feel that there is sensationalizing going on.

The media doesn't "sensationalize" things by telling the opposite of the truth. They sensationalize by continually insinuating things through speculations and repeatedly reading out the same news story so that everybody knows.

True, I made an assumption. However, I feel that it was justified. After all, you said "Watching the news and reading the papers, it is plain to see that all that is being talked about is how appauling the death of this one American is," it is easy to see why I made the assumption in the first place. I never new you were such a... news junkie before now.

I never said that sensationalism was "telling the opposite of the truth." I don't think I even implied that... and if I did, I apologize. I also apologize for making an ignorant assumption; but I still stand by my original opinion that your only connection to America is through news sources (sensationalist or not), and that simply isn't the same as conversing with a multitude of American citizens.

I mean, I'm sure you know by now that America isn't just a bunch of PAs running around all willy nilly. :p

Thank God! :eek:

Once you get past all the politics, America isn't such a bad place. When you get to the good, down to earth people that our country is partly made up of, America is great.

I have a friend from Scottland that flew out to visit, and he was very surprised at how America wasn't such a bad place after all. The news in Scottland made it sound like, and these are his own words, "it was full of crime and murder around every corner." Sure, we have crime and murder, but not around every corner. My friend was amazed that the drive-thru people at McDonalds told him to have a nice day. Apparently that doesn't happen in Scottland.

This is how things are in my neck of the woods......Friendly. Sadly, America isn't like that all over.

I'm just saying that America isn't completely bad...not void from badness. I fear it'll get more wicked in the future.

-oddguy

You said it, oddguy. The world's gradually just rotting into hell due to the fallacies of human nature, and there's nothing that can save it. I'm glad that I'm not going to be alive in 500 years.

Ugh.

I don't even want to think about it.

What have you been reading? 101 Childrens apocalypse theories and other stories?

Yeah, guys, this thread wasn't about treating PA like crap. I was merely analysing his responses. Think about it, if we really want to convert people to our way of thinking, you can't really call them a piece of shit and expect them to come running.

I'm not sorry that I offended anyone. Because I didn't do anything wrong. I simply awakened you to your real self. If you hate your own hypocrisy so much, I'm not to blame.

And everyone has taken things to the extreme personal level. Chill.

Alcar...

****s sake, will someone just close this thread now.

Get political and it will always get personal! Its one of the big three... innit!

Of course you didn't do anything wrong. You had some very good points, but it seemed that after you posted about PA, other people jumped on the train and went a little overboard in my opinion.

Hmmm, where shall this conversation go next, I wonder?

-oddguy

I have missed far to much on this discustion could somebody enlighten me on what has gone on hear.

I know I've missed a lot here, but has anyone noticed that this story seems phony as hell? A bearded guy who looks nothing like Nick Berg is trotted out and killed by a bunch of fat white guys. The guy they are trying to pin this on is Zarquawi but first off the guy doesn't have much of a Jordanian accent, has two legs unlike Zarquawi's 1, is fat and white and wearing a mask while PROCLAIMING RESPONSIBILITY FOR AN ACT. There also seems to be a lack of blood. Christ, you'd think severing a guy's head like that would cause him to gusher blood for at least 10 minutes but hardly any comes out. He's also killed in one of those cheasy dime a dozen chairs.

i havnt personally seen the footage.

http://www.oddworldforums.net/showpo...&postcount=134

Statikk, where did you see the footage? Just wondering. You don't seem like the type of guy that visits al-Qaeda linked web sites. ;)

-oddguy :fuzcool:

F*** This.
 

This is screwed. I hate this F***ing planet.....
I want to say something to ParamiteAbe:

Live with it. Your country is widely hated on My side of the world (Southern Hemisphere) and, while not everywhere, I am not saying that at all, it is viewed as a simple means of entertainment, nothing else.

There. Now feel free to bicker to your hearts content, and Death can go ahead and try and mock me, but my argument stands.....

The F***ed up Ghost. :fuzmad:

Why don't people get this?

I MOCK THE IDIOTIC.

So if you strangely find me mocking you one day, it's either because I'm having a bit of fun, or find you to be an idiot. OK?

Now, do we really have to go off topic by talking about how we all beat up PA? Lets just let it drop - there is nothing more to be said.

It seems to me that the US can fix this problem faster than they realise. If they just publicly ensure that the mistreatment of the prisoners stops, then the extremists would stop killing the Americans - since this was what they said they would do.

BUT.

America seem to want to chase after and kill the extremists, which would give them the power to continue mistreating the prisoners if they wanted to. This is absolutely the most despotic and heinous thing that they could do. It is beyond me to put words to this act, but if America do it, there will almost certainly be no limits to what they can get away with in the world - indeed even attempt to take it over.

We're lucky that we live in an age when one single Russian sub alone has the ability to nuke half the world, otherwise countries like America would be free to take over and commit crimes on whoever they please. Something that they are probably just dying to do. Let's not give them the chance eh?

Speak out against the American mistreatment of the Iraqi prisoners, and for once support the extremists - they're punishing America for things which they deserve punishment over. The Bush administration will STOP all of this if they see that it will get them better publicity - if they see a nation full of people that want the extremists dead, then they will act on that to get themselves re-elected.

That's all they care about.

I cannot honestly decipher whether you're using an extreme form of subtle sarcasm, or you're actually serious:| Normally, I'd just blow it off as a joke, and have a good laugh. But your'e the kind of crazy fuck who just might think that.

I am a "crazy fuck" because of my opinions? I find your mockery of my views quite offensive.

Majic if you continue to assassinate my character whenever I offer my opinions in this thread I may become completely reluctant to offer my opinions at all. And as it is at the moment, I quite enjoy the freedom to express my views without being attacked for them.

I am not a "crazy fuck" as you put it. I find what American Jailers are doing to those prisoners absolutely appauling, and I find it even more appauling that America is willing to let it continue, and kill anyone who speaks out against it. America got its commupance through the death of one of its own, now it's time to do something about it before they kill another - not doing anything about it will mean that the next death will be THEIR responsibility.

Seriously, they ASKED for it - if you humiliate members of an extremist organization like that you just deserve to be killed to be honest. Sadly the one that got killed was innocent - an innocent life taken as a result of the reckless and over zealous/confident jailers.

Alrighty then. No character assasination.

Your paranoia of America just seems... a bit overreactive. Taking over the world? Doing whatever we like? The world is politics. Nobody, nobody is stupid enough to pull another Napoleon in modern times. Among the developed countires of the world, none are stupid enough to go and declare war on each other. Jeebus.

Our government isn't all that bad. Our country still maintains a superb average standard of living. The people here are just as outspoken and intelligent as you. Or maybe you forget there are still headline news stories popping up about "new photos of prisoner abuse", and there's an official petition being circualated for Rumsfeld to resign. The new nerve gas bomb being found- it isn't being paraded as justification for the war. Our government messed up with Iraq; everybody knows that. Bush knows it. His advisors know it. Have you ever considered any other reasoning for pushing on other than corruption or pride? Do you find it impossible for the government to multitask both fixing the prisoner abuse situation and eleminating threats to Iraq?

Anyways, good night to you chap. I need to wake up in 5 hours. Fun fun fun...

Iraq isn't threatened, American troops/helpers in Iraq are threatened. But anyway...

I am not paranoid, I just know what America are like. Their actions speak far louder than their words, and I am yet to see, hear, or read anything about them really paying full attention to the prisoners. They are still trying to find out exactly who killed the American, and where they killed him.

My problem is not with Americans, it is with the Bush admin, and the Jailers that tortured those Iraqi prisoners for "fun" or whatever, thinking it would have no repocussions on them - instead it did, ending up in the death of an American.

Dude, Oddguy. Zarquawi has a prosthetic leg. Now look at the guy in the photos that you can find in any major newspaper. Notice something missing? Or should I say not missing? The guy has TWO GODDAMN LEGS! Tons of people who specialize in speech are raising doubts about the executioner's supposed Jordanian accent. Also, tons of things are just too weird for me to take the CIA's spin on this. The guy who is supposed to be Zaqquawi, one of the most strict, hard-core Muslim out there, is wearing jewelry that is condemned and banned by the Islam. How weird is that? I'm not sure who to believe on this. Also, Berg is sitting in a cheap-ass stackable chair, the kind that the military uses. He's killed wearing U.S. prison orange in a place that is colored and lighted oddly like the Abu Ghraib prison. Meanwhile, Berg was a portly, pale white guy without facial hair but in the span of 2 weeks he's cut, tanned, and sporting a hippy beard. Also, the executioners are white and total fat asses and are wearing body armor like a U.S. guard(or maybe a Russian mobster. Berg DID have ties with those people).

You clearly haven't watched the full footage in which he had his head cut off then.

And it is him. And he DID have facial hair.

'The guy has TWO GODDAMN LEGS!'

Well, unless he was stood there without his trousers on you don't know that one of them was his real leg...could have been fake.

What do you mean "You obviously haven't seen the videos." How the hell would you know? Yes, I've seen them and not only does Zarqawi stand on his two legs firmly he is lacking tatoos. Also, there is no way that a guy would bleed that little from being beheaded. As I said before, GEYSERS of blood would have been pumped out and coated everything from the floors to the executioner's chest. Even when the head is held up victoriously there should be a lot more bleeding and blood seeping from the head. It just doesn't make sense that Zarqawi, who is a one-legged, tattooed man who is forbidden to wear gold by his religion and hasn't covered up his past crimes but openly claimed responsibility for them would have two legs, no tattoos, be wearing gold jewelry and covering his face like a pussy.

It isn't nessacerily true that blood will spew out of the body when the head is cut off. Since the heart and the rest of the body is controlled by the spinal cord, severing it through beheading causes the heart to stop beating, and only a suprisingly small amount of blood comes out.

Also, you do not know the specifics of who wears what, and where, since that sort of information is NOT given out by any news/info sources. The man was killed, it wasn't a dummy. Accept it.

Why should I? Is it that far beyond ordinary that the politicians would orchestrate a killing for political motivations?

In those conditions, yes. In this case, what motivations do they have? The killing was a result of how shabbily the Iraqi prisoners were kept.