This is getting waay stupid. I really hate this favourism-thing, and personally, i thoight that Ambi wouldn't back it up. But she's faved by evryone too, so i should have known. I made be moving out on deep water, but i really hate how many of the members get favorized, and can't get away with stuff, while other members just get flamed for no reason at all.
Like in Angel-fox' thread. Well, she PMed me, and told that she honestly wasn't looking for pity, but just wanted to say goodbye to her friends, and yet, some of the most respected members of OWF, came with their: "Don't go all boo-hoo on us, cos we don't care."
I really felt disgusted by that, and it has really made me see OWF from another point of view. I really don't have much respect for many of the members here anymore. But I respect Dino because he dares to go against the authority, and tell his opinions. He aint a lap-dog like the most members here.
Well, i don't care what comes after this, but i just think that this has gone too far...

Um, Dino, I think you must have missed everytime someone like Hobo had the guts that I think quite a few of us didn't have to call you a liar, like the age thing. I clearly remember him confronting you about that. Jacob made some points to a few times that you could be lying too. And you've also missed a hell of a lot of sarcastic remarks about everything you've ever said you were. My belief is that you got to be "a respected member" by these lies. Sort of.. because I think a big handful of us were only playing along.

Nate and Dipstikk, Fax is right.

T-nex, I never said favoritism was right or moral. I said it happens; there's no way around it. Trust me, I'd love it if everyone was treated perfectly equal, but much like the real world, life on forums will never be completely fair either.

Rules are meant to be broken.Thats all Im gonna say.

You didn't have to say,what you did was enough.
Right and wrong are merely points of view.
Just like how you were playing along with Hobo's little favoritism clique. And to top off your little sophmoric acts of favoritism, you've just tinted Dino's name with red. Might as well tint everyone elses now! How about purple for Jacob and Cheese's green for prosperity!

I think the most recent moderator-placements are interesting.
Hobo, for example, I see as being made a moderator merely because of who he is friends with. Which is fair enough, of course, but he certainly isn't the best choice of moderator, regardless of his experience on OWF.
I'd be surprised if Ambi isn't made a moderator in good time.

I'd say what you said was closer to 'It happens, get over it.'
It is possible to stop it happening, and more than correct to question it. Authority that is supposed to be fair does not do well to show favouritism. Look at teachers, judges, juries and suchlike. People would rightly be unhappy and outspoken if these positions showed favourtism and leniency towards certain people.
Perhaps they do show favouritism where you are, and everyone is fine with that, but I cannot see it happening in my life/surroundings.
You may also say that a forum is unimportant, irrelevant, doesn't matter, or something. This is avoiding the issue. Hopefully you wouldn't say that. :)

Godammit. What the hell happened to OWF?

I remember there was a day when if somebody said something funny or cool, they gained happy points, and if they said something stupid or spammy, they were warned or otherwise punished. That's how it should be.

This is quite a parallel to the oh-so-many threads there have been on corruption in the US and UK governments. Hysterically ironic, if I do say so myself. But in other ways, it's sad. Mods should do their fucking jobs, and police the forums. No special treatment, just justice.

Why can't the forums go back to the way they used to be? When we could have fun according to the rules, and nobody questioned it. No one got off for breaking the rules, but no one did (aside from the occasional shitty member), and the forums operated themselves. Those were the golden days.

Remember what these forums are for? Oh yeah, fun. Discussion of Oddworld, but, seeing as how there are no real Oddworld-related anythings anymore, it's about the discussion of whatever the hell needs discussing. We are voluntarily visiting these board. We are not paid, we do it of our own volition. We do it to enjoy ourselves. And to me, this thread (not meant to rag on Dino) is bringing to the foreground that which should not even have to be considered.

So my proposal is that we let this thread die, and whoever has been offended, wrongly punished, or not punished at all should just forget about this whole thing and the events that led up to it, the mods can actually start doing what they were elected to do, and the public can enjoy themselves once again.

Let the forums be restored. Please.

To do that the OWF staff should let this whole thing go tbh :)

Feel the <3!

*puts on kill list*

But seriously, i've had experience at being a moderator on this forum before, though no one noticed, i was the RPG mod who breathed life back into the old thing before i grew out of it. True I am friendly with Peter. But pissing off the admins is hardly going to get me anywhere but banned.

I come with an idea. Every person who believes they have recieved a warning through mistreatment can oppose it. No matter who they are, with a PM to me. A thread can be created in our cushy employee lounge and we will review the warnings with a voting system intact. People will be notified about whether their warnings were repealed or not. And we can try to do it as fair as we can. In exchange we will expect a bit more of a formal atmosphere from you all, and all the *sleeps with Super Munch* or what have you will have to go.

Insert opinions here -

The only thing I hate about Dino is his attitude. I don't care if he is Reece, Codek, Mawk or whatever. If he's a good member, then I'm cool with him. Sadly he isn't. It takes allot of guts to admit you were wrong and stupid, which is what he has done. Aslong as he changes and becomes nicer, your whole ''omfgzorz itz teh c0deck!!11'' conspiracy will end, and noone will warn you.

Secondly, there is allot of favourism. One person posts something bad, they get told to shut the **** up and get a warning. Then a favoured member does something the same, and the thread/post will just be left alone or locked/deleted, without a warning or anything.

Thirdly, allot of mods are slacking off. Most posts in serious threads (like this) have been a pathetic, smart-ass joke.

Yes, I'd prefer the OWF age before the whole Rule enforcement shizzat. Before we had all these threads about a guy getting offended because his friend doesn't masturbate and a guy wanting his penis en-larged. And where mods did their job a bit better.

OMG yue slepe wiff me y tank u ^_^ *sleeps with Hobo*

I'm all for rule enforcement. But sometimes there can be a little too much rule enforcement... And since OWF isnt full to the bursting point of life, there isn't as much of the rules being quoted around, and bannings seem to be a rare occurance.

So, erm, yeah, Mods, try harder, but also, don't try harder. :/

*sleeps with Super Munch*

Hello? You can't just spew out "bring back the golden age" crap. You expect us to return to an age months ago? It is bad to go back. You have to keep moving foward otherwise you'll just end up maiking threads like this with a shit load of nostalgia. There will be hardships but wounds heal and good times will come. They may be entirely different from this "golden age" you are all refering to, but you can't try and make a substitute.

Since Used, Shrink, etc.(?), have quoted only part of what I said and left out the very important last part, I'll quote that for myself.

Maybe it is possible for there to be more equality on forums ... but highly improbable for there to be perfect and pure equality with no favoritism. But seriously, take a look at the members who seem to get away with stuff more, how many of them do you have a serious problem with for spamming or whatever? I honestly can't think of a single respected member who annoys me when they get away with something. It's because they've proved themselves as good, reliable, and contributive members and they deserve more leniency and whatnot.

I don't mean to sound like the bad guy in favor of favoritism as I think some of you think. If respectable member was ridiculously mistreated for something that everyone else did, then I'd be furious, but I honestly don't think anything awful like that really happens here. And I'm pretty tired of people throwing my relationship with Luke in my face--as if I'd be treated completely different if I weren't with him.

Oof, I just want this to all be over... and for Alcar not to go all nazi on us, but I have a pretty big feeling something very bad is going to result from this if something doesn't happen/isn't done to stop all this horrible drama.

Well, according to what I've read, this gooney act was only unveiled just recently (in this thread). And like the whole favoritism thing, we were just annoyed, not necessarily ready to take it, burn it, and piss on its corpse.

First of all, I'd like to ask everyone to stop pissing on Ambi. Thanks.

Why the fuck not?

Well, that's a sack of crap. Since the old days were better, I don't see why we shouldn't "go back" to them.

Actually, this thread was a result of "moving forward".

It wouldn't be a substitute, it would just be better.

While this contradicts my earlier point, it is rather true. Suck things can be overlooked if the member is overall very contributive to the forum. I still think repeat offenders should deal with Los Consequencos, but yeah, not many respected members are repeat offenders.

What I meant was not trying to make it like it was. Maybe if you would consider it "moving foward" into good times then that would be better.

I know what you meant. That's what I mean to. I want it to be like it was, when the forums were fun. I don't want to make a carbon copy of the forums 4 months ago, I just want it to be fun and carefree and gay-sounding like it did back then.

Well, we can make that happen iof we try and stop bickering and wining for once. (cheesy work together music playing)

You know what? That doesn't do you any favours at all - it makes you look like a spitefully dishonest individual who goes behind people's backs to humour them and jest at their expense. Frankly if I was a friend of yours, after reading that I'd be instantly repelled, because god only knows what you'd been saying about me.

You can forget any ideas you may have of ever regaining any of my respect. I'm not going to be fooled by your act again.

Yeah don't you wish. :dodgy:

There's plenty of ways around it, that's what this thread is all about. And if you and your peons hadn't kicked and screamed and made such a big fuss trying to divert the attention, maybe I would've gotten somewhere a little earlier on. But it seems Ambi that as much as you like to take up your argument with Used and myself, there are many other members who are still very well respected who aren't falling for your shit, and I notice you're not taking issue with them half as much as you are with me.

Face it Ambi, you lose this time. You're never going to be able to slow this whole thing down unless you turn against almost half the regular members of the board, and I hardly think a little popularity queen such as yourself would ever do a thing like that.

Total BS, you would hate it. You'd have to follow the rules and behave yourself. If you loved the idea of it so much you'd be more willing to give it a try. But oh wait I forget, your mastermind of prediction allowed you to work out in advance that the whole idea of fairness is 100% certain to fail.

I'll stop pissing on her when she stops pissing on me and my suggestions.

Here's why the fuck not dude; Because it isn't a constructive suggestion, it's a vague wish. What the fuck was the golden age? When was it? What were the rules back then? I don't remember ever having a golden age.

And I've got news for you Kimon; the one time we were all getting along, was because of Ambi and her "friends" deciding to "play along" sarcastically and pretend to like and have respect for me, so that they could make jokes and insults behind my back. That whole time we thought everything was going great it was just a ticking timebomb, counting down to the day when Mrs Queen Victoria here would instruct her minions to remove me from the forums.

I hope you're not confusing that time with your "golden age". And no offense here Ki, I just don't want you getting fooled and burnt by these guys.

There was no specific time of golden-ness, there was always turmoil, but it was never as deep as this. No ever really questioned the mods, because they were pretty much fair, and people abided by the rules for the most part.

Honestly, I think you're being rather paranoid.

I really doubt that there was a master plan to get you off of these forums. Maybe they never did have respect for you, that may be true. Maybe they didn't neccessarily like you, and maybe the whole 'respect' thing was just a ruse to make fun of you. It's all possible, and it's probably true for some of the members. But I don't think you're as globally disliked as you think you are. But I dunno. I'm tired, and I don't know what I'm talkin' about.

None taken, it's a reasonable response, and your 'protection' of me is appreciated.

And good night.

That maybe true, but don't you think that the mods are a little bit paranoid for getting so worked up about an age old meber wgho survies in our realm through reincarnations rituals? (prefereably through the Fire God)

And you're tired? You try going to a band competition that lasts for four hours, ha! I'm not even drowsy :p.

Heh. Pretty fucking ironic that you’re giving me a lecture on honesty. Anyway, not people’s backs, your back because it’s hard not to talk about someone who spews out lies everywhere and then see some members swallow every lie you feed them.

Though I do regret ever playing along simply because it was easier and I was tired of arguing.

Once more I find quoting myself as the most efficient response.

As for the others, I’m trying to clear up things with them without pointless argument. I’ve never had conflicts with them before, so I’m trying to overlook anything that seemed to be a blow at me, like Shrink’s saying he bets I’ll be made a mod simply because of favoritism or something.

Speaking of Shrink’s post, I’ll also say the part he quoted me, saying “get over it” may need more explanation although I think I’ve said all this before. The forums’ favoritism isn’t at some high degree. In a way, I think almost all regular members are favored/get away with a little, etc. because they’ve proven themselves. If there was a high degree of it, completely ignoring all the rules for some and then completely enforcing them on others, creating some huge division among the posters, I’d make a topic about it myself even if I had the advantage. But believe what you will.

I lose? ...What? Sounds like this all a big game to you. Not that it’s a life or death situation, but still. And why exactly would I be turning against half of the members?

But... I do follow the rules as much as any other regular poster can be expected.

And I do love that idea, but find it pretty idealistic. It’s far out of my nature for me to say “Well, that’s just how the world is, so accept it”, but really, I find OWF to be such a fair place that there’s not much of it to complain about. There’s never been a time when I’ve seen a respected poster be punished for something unfairly. But, of course, if there’s any realistic ideas that you or anyone else has to make this place even more fair, suggest away.

Kimon, thanks for that. I quite dislike golden showers, but I do miss the golden days that you speak of.

Edit: Mmyep, it does suck that everyone thinks that I'm all for favoritism simply because I don't think it's a big issue here.

I just completely lost all respect for Dino. Is it even possible for you to have a civil arguement?

And Ambi, perhaps it's harder for you to see un-fairness, because being the admin's Girlfriend, you're obviously favoured (Not that you've done anything bad), it's easier to see from a less-popular view.

Used, by going back, I didn't mean have clone threads. I mean the attitude back then, the better mod behaviour then (Well, except DI) and the better quality of threads. Half of our new threads are just over-sexed or down-right stupid.

Well do you expaect us to make a transition instantly? Things will change over time.

No no, I don't expect a complete transition. But if the mods just put their foot down again, everything will go handy-dandy, even if it takes time.

I tire of this argument.

Conclusions - Be good or we'll ban your ass. Even if we like you.

EDIT - It also wouldn't surprise me if you're only intention s to kick up some shit as i posted a perfectly good solution and it has been all but ignored.

There's no such thing as a "civil argument". That would be like, a polite war, or non-physical punchup.

But whatever.

Hey! If it helps negotiations along any, I'm going to turn into a completely emotionless impenetrable (sorry leto) immortal automaton, whose entire repatoir of witty retorts consists of "Does not compute", "Your logic chip requires an upgrade" and "Your culture and technology will adapt to service ours - Resistance is futile.". Hopefully this will allow me to conduct this argument in a manner that doesn't involve conventional insults or taking things personally. That should boost my respect!

How does that sound? Feeling any of that respect flooding back yet? Is it getting hard?

No? Alrighty then. Exactly.

So shush.

Now, about this whole dealy; fairness, whatnot, blah, etc. Contrary to what Little Miss My-e-penis-is-larger-than-yours "thinks" (and I do use the word "thinks" lightly there, haw haw I'm so ebil) I don't believe we should go totally overboard with it, because then we'll just make everything all boring and things. But we should implement it gradually so that over time we get more of the lets-not-spam-so-much vibe. Because I dig that vibe, man, with spades and things.

Ah, that was fun. But I really don't care anymore now so, bye.

But before I go, I leave you with a few wise words, first spoken sagely by that king of kings, the Jolly Green Jesus; Ho-Ho-Ho. Christmas. Etc.

(close it, please, I should never have posted this in the first place and just let the whole thing blow over - my apologies to Amber who is absolutely right and got the better of my stupid self, sorry for being a bitch and I hope that later we can sit on a fence in the countryside with the sunwarmed wind in our hair, looking back at these old posts in laughter and farting - and my apologies to Cheese for picking on his sexy little ass, when we should've been going for long walks on the beach while holding hands, merrily skipping through that which doth yonder wabe and schtuff.)

I'm rolling my eyes, really I am. Anyway, I'm going to be fairly brief here.

Ambi deserves everything she has. I could go on about how she contributes, and shares her opinion, and is kind, etc, etc. But everyone knows that. That's the problem. A lot of you are jealous.

As for Hobo, yes, it's quite obvious that we are friendly. I make no apologies for having a tendancy to promote people I am more friendly with. Not only does it allow me to get to know the person better, and therefore judge character, but by being friendly, it assures me to some extent that they are not going to turn around and backstab me.

That said, there are Moderators who I do not talk with at all, or rarely. Those being Xavier, AlphaScrab, T-nex, SeaRex, Al the Vykker. Yet, I still support them. I've helped Xavier with his hosting for TOA, and TOGG. I've set up forums for T-nex. I've given SeaRex a lot of power and responsibility. I believe I've met a balance.

I make no apologies.

Alcar...

Bah, this is just exagerated now... I think Hobo's suggestion is the best one so far, and should be used.
Amber never did anything wrong, or spammed or anything, so she desrves what she has.
I just don't like when highly respected members go all hostile on others. Like Mods usually have this bad-ass attitude, which i really hate, so I'd rather not discuss with them or anything...

Anyways, Why not just close this thread. it could be so easy. There hasn't ever been a golden age, and it will never be golden. But at least we can improve it.
Bah, i don't know what to say, i just think it's become rediculous :rolleyes:...

I also think Hobo's suggestion is good. But otherwise this thread is kinda stupid.

All this thread are belong to closed.

EDIT - Temp. Reopened

I'll just say these few things:
First off, I think that Hobo's idea is a good one. While I don't like some of the things he says, his idea is definitely the most constructive suggestion we've had yet.
Second, I thought the way everyone (well, everyone who was nasty) spoke to Angel-Fox in her leaving thread was disgraceful. She was just saying she had to leave, and everyone yelled at her and insulted her. If someone new joins or someone leaves, then the members should show civilness and respect that member, and respect their decision.
Finally, Dino, I like you to a degree, and I respect you,and I think that you have made some good points in this topic, but you seem to have gone in a complete U-Turn from how you started. You insulted Ambi unneccessarily, and made some unkind comments. You could have simply stated your opinion and disagreed with hers in a more respectful manner. I'm not saying I agree with her, just that you could have been kinder. I'm not singling you out, as I say that same goes with everyone else who resorted to flaming to argue their point. Cyber-Slig had it right, keep this arguement civil, be accepting and respectful, even if you disagree with someone else.

...Yikes.

I had no idea there was so much tension on these forums. One of the issues is that people take this forum way too seriously. There is no massive conspiracy among the moderators or any special treatment, case closed. There's nothing special about a member being treated with respect, for good behavior. A member will be treated the same way they treat others. Sometimes new members will get away with spam when older members won't, but that's because newbs don't know any better. That being said, the moderators are in no way perfect, they are human like everybody else. Every now and then they might step over the line, or fart at inappropriate moments, but I'm sure running a forum is a stressful endeavor.

Dino is a great member, he's very intellegent, but he can be also very arrogant. (NERD-ALERT) He reminds me of Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars. He doesn't feel that the elders respect him, and he wants a position of power and authority, but his core intentions are good. Okay, it's a bit of a stretch to compare Dino to Darth Vader, but that's all that comes to mind as I write this. Dino just wants to be a well-known respected member of our community, and that ain't so bad. He brings some of the best discussions to the forums, so to lose his input would be a real drag. Unless anybody has solid evidence that he's created multiple accounts, attacking him because of a hunch is quite unfair. I understand where the guy's coming from, although I don't feel that the favoritism he metioned is at all intentional.

*Oh yes, and spectacular idea Hobo!

Actually, I think that was just me. And an apology was issued.

Anyway, I say three cheers for Hobo's suggestion.

Well, a formal atmosphere is a bit far, people can casually joke around friends! :p
I seem to be the only one who has a problem with the constant *sleeps with..* jokes, so maybe you shouldn't reinforce that idea around people who do enjoy it. They might... I dunno, create a friend complaining.

Ambi, you kind of missed my point(s), when you were directly referring to things I said. Nevermind.

So... what is everyone's problem now? Or have we all cooled off?

Alcar...

Yep, I absolutely agree. I should've kept it civil but really that isn't so easy when everyone is really ragging on you.

And jesus Mojo don't call me a nerd.

Listen, I don't want to be a respected member like it's some kind of life goal of mine. It'd be nice cause I'd get along with everyone easier if I was, but all I'm asking here is that we just respect each other instead of having warring sides across the forums and these internal feudes and such. It's rediculous, we're getting along like one big dysfunctional family. I'm sure we're all more mature than that. We shouldn't be spiting each other - we should be making love in Used's big ebony bed.

And RIGHT yes I should've said this in a better way, people make mistakes. I understand that already. Sorry for what I said, I can be a prick at times but so can everyone. I'm just trying (and going about it the wrong way) to get everyone in a position where they'll just have to learn to get along rather than fight/spite/mock/hate all the time.

Don't worry, I'm not that mean, I was calling myself a nerd for figuring out how to compare the situation to Star Wars. :blush:

Fool us once, shame on you. Fool us twice, shame on us. God help us if it's fallen for a third time...

...

Anyway, I'm done here. I've taken everything I need to say to anyone through PMs, so I'm fine with someone closes it if everyone else is.

Pointless arguments ftw. :cheer:

Since I hold Ambi in such high regards, and therefore would do anything for her, because, you know, I like her a lot more than the rest of you, I'm going to close this for her :p




That was a joke aimed at you jealous folk, by the way.

Alcar...