Favorite character design.

[Vouroboros]

This is my first post so, hi all. This has probably been discussed here but what is everyone's favorite character design from Oddworld? I prefer the look of the industrial characters. For me it goes to the Big Bro Slig.

[FennecFyre]

Hi and welcome to the forum! We're not as awful as we come off to be at first, I promise.

As for character design...god, where do I start? I could ramble on for hours about how amazingly unique every single Oddworld character looks, but if I had to pick my absolute favorite, it would be the outlaws from Stranger's Wrath. I can't pick any individual design I like best (although D. Caste Raider comes close) but in general I adore how much grunginess and personality OWI managed to pack into them. They're all just such belligerent, stupid little bastards and I love 'em to bits.

[Oddey]

Strangely, I felt the outlaw design was one of the weaker points of Stranger's Wrath. I mean, yes, they're all distinct and easy to distinguish, even in a hectic gunfight or melee, but a lot of the meticulous and careful design for, say, Slobs and Scrabs, was lost on them, I find. It's a little difficult to explain, but one quote from the Oddworld Artbook say something to the effect that "every creature should look like it came from a mother" and I didn't really see that with outlaws; they seemed more generic and stock than say, a Steef or even a Grubb.

Personally, I think my favorite design for Oddworld is the Scrab, which I feel are extraordinarily iconic, even if they're not the main characters. Everything about them just works: the dainty little walk they have, which somehow still looks impressive and imposing, the ramping bull-like charge, their extremely territorial nature... and that amazing sound they got for their howls and shrieks.

[Mr. Bungle]

Sligs. Militant, semi-mechanical, miscellaneous, and menacing. Love em.

The fact that they're really just slacker goofs is icing on the cake.

[UnderTheSun]

Do character designs have to be visual? Can they be the lack of visuals?

Khanzumers have such a well-crafted backstory of mystery surrounding them. We don't know what they look like. We don't know where on Oddworld they live. All we know is that they're the ignorant consumers that have unwittingly given the Industrialists total control over Mudos. Truthfully, the entirety of Oddworld's events revolves around the Khanzumers. Mudos' shores give way to a sea of apathy, where none of Abe's heroic tales and triumphs are heard of or cared for.

That's not much to work by, and it makes them feel very alien. No doubt it's how citizens in third-world countries feel about us.

[Mr. Molluck]

I love the Slig design, they're such a terrifying (but sometimes humorous) fusion of organic and mechanical.

[Nate]

Do character designs have to be visual? Can they be the lack of visuals?

Khanzumers have such a well-crafted backstory of mystery surrounding them. We don't know what they look like. We don't know where on Oddworld they live. All we know is that they're the ignorant consumers that have unwittingly given the Industrialists total control over Mudos. Truthfully, the entirety of Oddworld's events revolves around the Khanzumers. Mudos' shores give way to a sea of apathy, where none of Abe's heroic tales and triumphs are heard of or cared for.

That's not much to work by, and it makes them feel very alien. No doubt it's how citizens in third-world countries feel about us.

Khanzumers are a class, rather than a species. Like Industrial or Native.

[Vlam]

Nathan: (from forum member Sekto Springs) Are Khanzumers a species or a class like the outlaws are?

Lorne: They’re Mudokons.

Nathan: All of them?

Lorne: And they’re other species. But they’re all fat, enormously fat. They sit in front of TVs, they listen to the news, they eat TV dinners. They’ve become their own species even though they’re made out of many.

http://oddworldlibrary.net/blog/nath...lanning-again/

[Varrok]

I think Nate's right, and Lorne doesn't understand some words he uses.

New'n'Tasty is not a HD Remake!

[Sybil Ant]

How does what vlam said deviate from what Nate said?


Also, sligs or maybe paramites. Gawd damn I just love how paramites are always kinda hidden away in the shadows, you barely ever get to see more than fleeting shady glimpses of them, so their detail isn't really illustrated well beyond the occasional break in the Paramonian canopy.

[Vlam]

How does what vlam said deviate from what Nate said?

According to Lorne Lanning, "they've become their own species even though they're made out of many". Khanzumers are a species, rather than a class. From this standpoint, they're similar to the Outlaws:

How many species of Outlaw are there?

There is only one species of Outlaw, and that is their species’ name. Outlaws may come in a rich variety of sizes and shapes, but this is just individual variation amongst the race.

http://oddworldlibrary.net/toe/FAQ#H...tlaw_are_there

[Sybil Ant]

He doesn't mean it in a literal sense, he means they've become a species through the same characteristic traits. It's an expression.

[Connell]

Vlam always seems to take things in an absolute literal sense. That's not meant to be a dig, just an observation.

[Vlam]

Vlam always seems to take things in an absolute literal sense. That's not meant to be a dig, just an observation.

So according to you, the creator of Oddworld doesn't know what he's talking about? He uses words randomly?

Don't you worry, Connell: I'm not stupid to the point of paying 45 dollars a game that I dislike.

Sybil Ant, you don't seem to understand why I just mentioned the Outlaws, then.

[Connell]

So according to you, the creator of Oddworld doesn't know what he's talking about? He uses words randomly?

Don't you worry, Connell: I'm not stupid to the point of paying 45 dollars a game that I dislike.

No. He wasn't being literal. Perhaps it's the language gap, but to me, and others, it's obvious he didn't mean that they have literally become their own species. You seem to always find a statement and take it exactly literally and as gospel. People can change their minds and their words can have a different context than is immediately apparent.

And thanks for the dig. Genuinely wasn't trying to take you on with that comment; I was giving context to why you might be making the point you are, in the way you are. Sorry if you felt that way. Can always count on you to lower the tone though; Bashing me for supporting OWI on an Oddworld forum.

[Vlam]

Don't get me wrong: it was just an observation.

Let me explain (for the third time): the Outlaws are a species. If you accept this "fact" then why is it absurd to consider that the Khanzumers are indeed a species? On the other hand, show me where Lanning said "the Khanzumers aren't a species".

[RoryF]

I think he's really misusing the word 'species' to be honest, I don't get what he's trying to say in his quote about Khanzumers - I don't interpret it as 'expression', just a poor choice of words.

[Sybil Ant]

Gawdamn just rename this place Anal Forums.

[RoryF]

Anything wrong with anal?

[Connell]

Don't get me wrong: it was just an observation.

Let me explain (for the third time): the Outlaws are a species. If you accept this "fact" then why is it absurd to consider that the Khanzumers are indeed a species? On the other hand, show me where Lanning said "the Khanzumers aren't a species".

Love you Vlam, you always keep things interesting for me on here.

The reason it's "absurd" to accept the Khanzumers as a species is because literally a few words before he says "they're a species" in that quote, he says they're made up of different species.

Each to there own, I guess.

[Mr. Bungle]

What happened here?

Also slurgs are adorable

[UnderTheSun]

What happened here?

Also slurgs are adorable

tl;dr I suggested the Khanzumers, who have no visual design, in a thread about which character/group of characters has the best design. The thread melted down over whether Khanzumers are a species or social class faster than the Internet melted down over Trump winning, despite me never declaring Khanzumers as either in the first place.

[Manco]

Let me explain (for the third time): the Outlaws are a species. If you accept this "fact" then why is it absurd to consider that the Khanzumers are indeed a species? On the other hand, show me where Lanning said "the Khanzumers aren't a species".

Because the Outlaws aren’t a species, they’re a grouping of interrelated sub-species, and Khanzumers are a class comprised of several unrelated species that have developed similar characteristics through a shared lifestyle.

Lorne describes them as “becom[ing] their own species” as a shorthand metaphor to illustrate how the different species in this class now have a shared lifestyle that makes them like a single species, not to literally say they are a single species.

[Vlam]

Because the Outlaws aren’t a species, they’re a grouping of interrelated sub-species

I don't disagree. Yet the Outlaws are a species (canon):

There is only one species of Outlaw, and that is their species’ name. Outlaws may come in a rich variety of sizes and shapes, but this is just individual variation amongst the race.

http://oddworldlibrary.net/toe/FAQ#H...tlaw_are_there

and Khanzumers are a class comprised of several unrelated species that have developed similar characteristics through a shared lifestyle.

This is speculation. Moreover, Lanning doesn't use the word "class".

Lorne describes them as “becom[ing] their own species” as a shorthand metaphor to illustrate how the different species in this class now have a shared lifestyle that makes them like a single species, not to literally say they are a single species.

I disagree. Lanning ought to be taken seriously: Khanzumers can interbreed with Khanzumers of a different species. Don't laugh because there's a precedent for this: the Outlaws.

[Manco]

I don't disagree. Yet the Outlaws are a species (canon):


http://oddworldlibrary.net/toe/FAQ#H...tlaw_are_there

Alright, so assuming this FAQ is correct then sub-species isn’t the correct way to describe them. In that case then they would be closer to dogs: a single species with a number of different “breeds”, with a wide amount of variance in physical characteristics.

Surprise, this doesn’t prove your point! If Outlaws are a single species with multiple breeds then they are still not a precedent for the Khanzumers, who are described as separate species who share enough characteristics to be classified into a single group.

Those characteristics are only described by Lorne in terms of shared lifestyle: they’re all fat, eat TV dinners, watch TV, read the news. Shared lifestyle does not in any biological way inform speciation.

So when Lorne refers to them as “becom[ing] a single species”, he is using a metaphor. Which is to say they are a metaphorical species, not a literal biological species.

This is all in service of the blindingly obvious: Khanzumers are a satire of consumers, who are a grouping of people defined by their role in the economy and their lifestyle, not by their species.

This is speculation. Moreover, Lanning doesn't use the word "class".

You’re right – he uses a metaphor to imply it. Is the French language really so literal that you don’t understand what a metaphor is?

I disagree. Lanning ought to be taken seriously:

This from the guy who relentlessly criticizes and nitpicks every single thing Lorne says.

Khanzumers can interbreed with Khanzumers of a different species. Don't laugh because there's a precedent for this: the Outlaws.

No, I’m gonna laugh. You literally argued earlier in the same post that Outlaws were a single species, and now you’re arguing Khanzumers of different species can interbreed because Outlaws are a precedent for it.

[Vlam]

So you're trolling: I don't see the point of arguing with you. By the way, the word "Khanzumers" can refer to both "consumers" and the species. And you can't prove (unless you're Lorne Lanning) that it's actually a metaphor. Moreover, OddMan (who isn't French) said "I don't get what he's trying to say in his quote" which means it isn't crystal clear.

[Manco]

So you're trolling: I don't see the point of arguing with you.

k, have fun being wrong.

By the way, the word "Khanzumers" can refer to both "consumers" and the species.

Or the class, which is the more likely meaning.

And you can't prove (unless you're Lorne Lanning) that it's actually a metaphor.

I’ve just set out why it most likely is a metaphor in my previous post. Try reading it instead of proclaiming it to be trolling.

Moreover, OddMan (who isn't French) said "I don't get what he's trying to say in his quote" which means it isn't crystal clear.

He also said “I don't interpret it as 'expression', just a poor choice of words”, so he’s got a better grasp on it than you. As does Nate, Varrok, Sybil Ant and Connell who have all said they get the intent behind it.

[UnderTheSun]

A thread meant to praise the creative energy that went into a video game's characters derails into an argument over whose headcanon is the best, with the only information that's not fan speculation being vague answers provided by the games' creator.

Is this the Oddworld Forums, or is this the Five Nights at Freddy's fandom?

[Vlam]

Well, Nate is right. The answer was in the same interview (that I haven't read in a while):

They’re a class made of many species – just like us, we come from different races, we have difference heritages, but we wind up in a certain place and now we’re labelled ‘Consumers’.

http://oddworldlibrary.net/blog/nath...lanning-again/

Connell, I apologize.

[Nepsotic]

Meeps.

Hi and welcome to the forum! We're not as awful as we come off to be at first, I promise.

We are.